MILs

[Happydoingitjusttheonce]

Do we think some women start behaving the way described in these threads when they become MILs, or were they always unpleasant women? If the latter, which of us will become that type of MIL?

So feminism passed her by, then?

From what I read ion this forum, which I grant you is not typical in the real world, DILS are dreadfully sniffy about the In laws. A fairly typical range of subjects is:

• I want to spend Christmas with my mum not his
• I don't want his mum visiting my (note the my) baby in hospital (but its ok for your mum)
• his mum interferes
• his mum doesn't do enough
• his mum wants to have the baby over night
• his mum never baby sits
• why should I send her a birthday card, its his mother
• married out of my culture but I expect them to change their whole way of life to accommodate me

It's relentless DIL manipulation and isolating the bloke away from his family - what is it we call that? ah yes abusive.

Are we Bertrand?

FWIW, my sons are in their late 30s.

My problem is that feminism is about teaching women to blame men and teaching men that they should understand their "privilege" and somehow spend their lives looking to make amends. What's the term? 'Beta male'? 'White knight'? I don't pretend to know.

Bringing up anyone as a feminist is imposing an agenda and once snared, you end up making irrelevant comments at every opportunity.

Feminist is a word that most men and women want to disassociate themselves from. It's seen as an insult and I believe that a large part of the reason for this is that feminists look to hijack any conversation with quite unusual arguments (see Penelope's).

I don't think of MiLs as anything. I simply have an experience of M-M, M-F and F-F relationships (as we all do). F-F have the most issues. Trying to blame society or men is ridiculous.

Would you agree that SonIL-FiL relationships tend to be simpler and easier? Is that down to the patriarchy? Can you, with a straight face, blame men for making MiL and DiL argue whilst letting the men get on together?

BertrandRussell it must have done! It's strange because she was a career woman, they had a full time housekeeper to look after their children and do the housework etc, but she still thinks it's scandalous that I don't iron his shirts.

I'm not thinking of MILs who were bringing their children up in the 50s (if you are referring to me?) My MIL and FIL brought their children up in the 80s/90s the same as my parents. I think her ideals are very similar to mine and she is a very strong role model. If she was a stay at home mum with views of 50s housewife nostalgia then I would still treat her with respect. She is my husband's mother and he loves her and she loves him.

Feminist is a word that most men and women want to disassociate themselves from

Is it?! Pretty much every woman I know (bar my MIL ) would describe themself as a feminist.

My MIL hates my guts but pretends to my face that she loves me. I find that worse than just hating me to be honest.

She's caused another row as of late that is still on going. It's exhausting and to be honest pretty upsetting.

Also Solaris, it's not me steering it to my pet topic and not being socialised well enough to know it's not appropriate or whatever you said. In my experience, as limited as that may be, the friends and family members who have had problematic relationships between DILs and MILs have been ones where the MILs have quite traditional views on what a woman should be like, and have doted on sons and taught them to expect the same from a wife. I therefore hope that I am not "one of those MILs" being discussed on here in 30 years, as I would hope I was supportive and friendly towards any women in their lives, didn't expect them to be just like me, and didn't expect them to treat my sons like demi-gods, or secretly hope that they were unable to cook, clean etc so that I could feel superior.

"My problem is that feminism is about teaching women to blame men and teaching men that they should understand their "privilege" and somehow spend their lives looking to make amends."

What complete and utter bollocks. But if you want to have that conversation, why not start a new thread about it, rather than derailing this one?

Ecureuil

Yes.

it really is

"Younger women were more likely to call themselves feminist, with 19 per cent aged 18-24 using the word, but they were also most likely to oppose feminism."

I feel particularly aggrieved as I'm likely to be older than most feminists and feel the good work of my peers and betters is being eroded.

This thread makes me sad. Completely understand that MILs can be a right PITA, but I would have loved to have met mine. We would have been from very different backgrounds, upbringing, education and from different generations separated by the great north/south divide (for example she'd never been to London) but I slightly envy my SILs and their DCs for being in her life & being on (often fabulously) good terms. She died of cancer before I met DP. I would have liked my DS and unborn DC to have met her. I don't believe in angels or God or anything like that but I talk to my bump & DS about her and hope that if there is something afterlife she knows that even if I didn't meet her, she's still my DCs grandmother.

I'm old enough to be a MiL but have no children. From my own observations I would say it's those women who subsume themselves into motherhood to the exclusion of everything else who become the most tiresome MiLs, refusing to relinquish control of their little darlings well into adulthood.

She's very young to have those views at 60?

Things can change. I was from a small family and dh a big one. It felt like his lovely parents numerous sisters and brothers were taking us over especially when we all started to have children.

As I got older I realised the value of the support and help

Ironically dh and I have the biggest family now and Both my dils have odd cold parents ( their assessments not mine I try to just get on with them) so they gravitate to our family more for Christmas and holidays. I am sure some people look st us and shudder but that's fine we all respect each other and get on. Dh and I never interfere but support.

It's like any other successful relationship you listen, compromise and respect

My mil died before I met my husband so I have no role model for my sil. I hope that I treat him as I treat my ds and my Dd. Unfortunately my sil's mother is dying of a brain tumour so Dd is letting her dh spend as much time as he can with his mother. Dd knows how important her mil is to her husband. This is all happening at the time they have a four week old baby. Dd would love to have her mil for much longer.

I seldom hear men complaining about their father in law or son in law....or having an issue with them. Is it a woman thing?

My MIL is 60, thinks its scandalous that I don't iron DH's work shirts and calls me a 'very lucky lady' because DH cooks. Luckily DH has managed to avoid growing up a sexist arse.

I am older than her. My DH does all the ironing, and has been known to cook and do housework. He was also a very hands-on father with regard to nappy changing etc.

Age is not the deciding factor.

Age is not the deciding factor

Gosh no, I wasn't suggesting it was. It was more that I'm surprised she has these views at only 60; as a PP mentioned, MIL's with young grandchildren now were definitely exposed to feminism! My mum is the same age and certainly doesn't think the same.
I guess my point was that people can hold these views, whatever age they are.

Class can also cause huge issues.

My ILs smoke in the house, eat processed rubbish from Iceland and Heron and constantly have the television on. I don't mind this. I do mind them shaping my children in this way.

MIL is not a feminist. She makes disparaging comments about schoolgirls walking home (I can see what that one had for breakfast being one revolting much-trotted out quote) and says "it's no wonder young lads get themselves into trouble."

Bil glassed someone on a night out and MIL said that bil might have gone too far but "he is such a handsome lad and he was being taken piss out of." (Mil regularly misses out words like "to" and "the" - I'm going shop.) And anyone distantly related is prefixed with "our", pronounced "are." Are Donna. Are James. Are Katie.

She hates Asian people, describes the Chinese gentleman who passes her house daily by lifting the skin round her eyes. She loves Staffs and has two. In fairness they are nice natured dogs but combined wih a toddler I feel uncomfortable.

It is up to her how she lives her life but I do try to minimise the influence she has on the DCs.

With me and my MIL, it's about a power struggle and her being in a competition I don't want to be part of. She doesn't like that there is another woman in her DS' life. I try and stay away from it but she interferes in our daily life a lot.

Bertrand I just summarised the conversation in the interests of not derailing the whole thread plus it's a bit outing, but no it was a series of conversations in which I was quite clear than my mum and I had a mum and daughter bonding experience planned, and she thought I should cancel that and go shopping with her and Sis-in-law instead because "it would be much more fun", and then just send my mum the bill. Her attitude towards my mum was awful. It really was. It was "let's you and me have some fun and leave your loser mum at home". Really awful mean-girl behaviour. She works in fashion and thought she was better than my mum, basically.

I have no problem with her 95% of the time, and yes she was trying to bond with me, but doing it at the expense of my mother is never going to go down well.

I hope I won't be that mil to either of my children's future partners should they find someone that makes them happy and they choose to spend their life with. I hope to have a good relationship with them as hopefully indpendent adults who don't expect their patner to take responsability for maintaining their relationship with dh and myself. I'd love to have the same sort of respectful relationship with their partners too.

However I have to acknowledge that I may find this difficult when it comes to ds. Not because I want to be the number one person in his life or control him. I will be delighted for him to have a patner and be able to live his life for himself. But because he has health conditions will be life that will potentially result in many hospital addmissions I think there could be potential for friction and unintentional pushing or overstepping of boundaries when his partner could already be under a great deal of stress and upset that would not need adding to. This is something I know I will have to be awear of as they would rightly be the person going through it with ds. I hope ds will be in a position to manage his conditions himself but know if he was unwell enough to need hospital addmission his patner would become gate keeper of information.

I think the mil/dil relationship is often fraught because even now it's so much more common for the mother to have given up everything for their kids. Once the kids leave, there isn't always enough left for them to be happy and fulfilled by themselves. It's probably why they are interfering, especially when children are involved, as they feel like it's a chance to feel needed again. Some think they can go so far as to have another go at being a mummy. It's usually just about tolerable if it's your own mum but an absolute imposition when it isn't. Throw in a difficult personality on either or both sides and bingo: you have war. Fil isn't usually going to be that involved with sil as both work.

Until there is a more equitable division of labour when it comes to childcare and the household, mils and dils are likely to not get on.

This is feeling cathartic.

Don't understand those mils who expect their dils to 'look after' their sons.
My son has two little boys and a step son. He works full time does lots of the cooking, irons clothes and does housework and his wife is a sahm. It's just normal...not special. I would be ashamed if I had brought up a son who needs looking after.

Don't understand those mils who expect their dils to 'look after' their sons

MIL said this to me a few times, and talks about him as her 'little boy'. DH is 53.

I challenge it now (politely) when she says something like this, and she has taken to calling me odd and alternative.
MIL still gossips like a good'un but is ok to my face which I can tolerate.

I think it's a case of underlying personality flaws coming to the surface when issues arise. Same goes for DIL, FIL, BIL, SIL etc.