... to think it slightly odd that so many of my school mum friends are hung up about secondary schools already, when their kids are only 5!

[sandyballs]

It seems to be the sole topic of conversation lately - how good/bad the local comp is, how extra tuition will be needed for the local grammar etc etc.

The kids are 5/6 years old! Let them be kids!

I'm sure our parents never had all this school angst!

No, I mean "society" not "high society". I'm talking about building businesses that benefit us all because they create value.

hm, I still think though, that if more value would be put on the education they receive at whatever Uni, then it having to be the right address, then there would eba good mix at all Uni's and we would therefore benefit even more....

Lol, Anna, I have no need to call the pm, nor does he have any need to speak to me, but I'm sure if dear Gordon and I needed something from each other he would be happy to see me.

Lorayn - at this stage I can't see the point of having a plan C.

Plan A - the hard one - is to get her into the very good school.

Plan B - the easy one - is to keep her at the school she already attends.

Plan C - cross that bridge when I come to it, probably not until she's at least 15.

I am not a great believer in pre 5 education, and I think there is a wide body of research that would back up the fact that it is of no benefit to the child. My son who is 15 is easily in the top 10% of his academically selective school but he had nothing other than mother and toddler groups pre 5. Ditto my 11 year old son. I have a daughter who is nearly two and some days I think nursery school is a fantastic idea because it would suit me . If I do ever send her, I hope I am honest enough with myself and others to admit that it is for ME (nothing wrong with that but surely no need to try and con yourself and others).

I still dont understand how you can have any plans for her other than
Plan A - Be happy.
Plan B - Be happy.
Plan C - Be happy.

Oh, but of course I forgot, a good education is the key to happiness is it not?
Anyone who isnt in the superior intelligence group or a "mover or shaker" must be undeniably depressed.

3andnomore - you are forgetting one very important point - at university, the students learn as much if not more from one another as from the academics.

So it is very useful to put the cleverest students in one group, so that all those great brains come together and fertilise one another's ideas.

If you put a mix of fantastic brains, medium brains and mediocre brains in each university, ie spreading the brain power, the best students won't go so far academically.

It's the critical mass that creates the élite of movers and shakers that keeps human development and society moving forward.

Well, of course I want her to be happy, like any parent.

But, since I know that my education has contributed immeasurably to my own happiness, I want her to have a great education.

lol Caroline...I am sure they compared in some studies the brittish school system and the german one, where children start later, and hvae found out that by age 9 they are equal in their abilities to read and write...
and indeed, the reason my Kids all went to a Nursery was to give me time without them, and they enjoyed to play there and mix with teh children....but no really it was all about ME

A doctor friend of mine thinks that dim people are happier in general as they worry about things less.

Caroline - my understanding is that it is pre-3 education that has no benefit to the child and that from 3 onwards children ought regularly to be in an educational group setting.

The US, for example, which has no history of pre-school education outside the private sector, is now moving in the direction of universal 3+ education.

not sure I believe you Anna...lol....
anywya, shouldn't the elite unis also give teh elite education though...to truely get the best out of it....

Tbh, I believe in diversity wihtin the community and the educational system...

Caroline ...does that mean I am not dim enough then

There is something nice about the prospect of going to your local school without worrying what the pupils at the school across town are achieving. Ah to be dim!

3andnomore - not sure I really understand all of your last post.

I am a great believer in diversity. Which is one of the reasons I love the school my daughter goes to / might go to - absolutely loads of nationalities, languages, religions. And fees are very moderate (about £3,000 a year) so very accessible to people from lots of walks of life.

I would love to experiment (mostly with not paying fucking school fees ) with being more relaxed about education. Trouble is it does not feel right to experiment with your own child. Perhaps I should have gone into politics?

Haven't read the thread, but it HAS to depend on where you live and the local schools surely.
If all the local schools are crap then you are going to worry about it more than if all the local schools are reasonable?
All our local primaries are reasonable, I want the dc's to go to the local one - because it is local. I did nothing other than apply for it when I had to, didn't even consider other schools or tuition etc. But I might think very differently if I knew it was crap. Similarly if I knew the secondaries were crap then I might be doing something alot earlier than I am going to (i.e. year 6 when we have to apply).

£3000 is not making the education accessable to people of most walks of life, you know...but that is another story...

well, o.k. in every UNi, whichever it is, there will be diversity....but with elitism, you surely must loose some of it...I mena, surely part of diversity is that people of different abilities get together and learn together too...

I thought the concensus was that 3+ education was only of benefit to those from low socio-economic backgrounds. Not relevant to all the middle class bores on Mumsnet .

oh, and well, I would think that anyone being able to study at Uni will hvae the right level of knowledge to not drag down teh brainboxes...

Caroline - I agree, I think it's hard to justify experimenting with one's own child.

A friend of mine here is married to a sociologist who quite seriously wanted to drop his Sino-American child into the middle of the French state school system "just to see what happens"

I know I will show just how little I am educated here...but what is Sino-American?

Caroline - that's not my understanding at all . It's the under-3 institutional setting that benefits only children from less affluent / educated families - under-3s are better off at home when home is good and mother is interested, better off in nursery when home is chaos and mother doesn't care.

In response to sandyballs thread(great name by the way-there is a campsite/hol resort nr Bournemouth with that name!)

We moved house when ds 7yo now 10, to get him into a good comp.Best in our town.

Just wanted best for him. I went to a crappy comp and I believe I could have done better at sch elsewhere imo.

I do think its unfair that the other comps aren't doing as well but thats the fault of bad management and the government.

It's not fair that the people who can't afford to move have to put up with sub-standard schools.

Back to your point, these parents are probably just giving it some thought with the hassle of moving etc

chasingsquirrels - "If all the local schools are crap then you are going to worry about it more than if all the local schools are reasonable?" You would have thought so. However, much to my own surprise I think the reverse is true. I live in Harpenden where there are three truly excellent high schools. Most people would be very pleased to have received the chance of a place at any one of them. Yet people worry and fidget and bore and stress - it is really horrible.