To feel irritated when families have multiple children they cannot afford

[Teddy7878]

First of all I accept that no contraception is 100% foolproof and pregnancy sometimes can occur even when people are trying their hardest to be careful.

I also accept that sometimes people's circumstances change and they could go from being financially comfortable to losing their jobs etc during their children's lives.

What really winds me up though are people who actively try and get pregnant when they already have several children and cannot afford the ones they already have. I sometimes see threads on here where people state they have less than £50 to feed a family of 7 for a week and no money at all for any luxuries whatsoever.

My DP and I will be in our mid 30s when we have our first child and we have decided it might be our only child. We want to be able to afford to give it a great life so have saved up hard for a few years beforehand. Between us we earn 65k so we live comfortably and don't have debts (other than the mortgage). It upsets me that we have to make the decision to only have one (possibly two) children and other people are having 5+ kids when they can't afford them.

Money isn't everything, a loving family home is always going to be the most important thing, but if you can only afford to eat lentils and never take your kids out anywhere fun or go on holiday or afford a car or pay for them to do activities outside of school or buy them a few nice things for Xmas then why keep continuing to have more and more children and making your situation even more stressful for everyone involved?! Why not just stick to one or two children?

YANBU OP. If other posters think that makes me judgemental, they might be right.

Someone reckoned you would need £30K per child to provide a comfortable home, own bedroom, good diet, Boden clothing, public school education, skiing and summer holidays and all the "normal" MC entertainments like going to theatres or exhibitions, think again. The public school (boarding) fees are up to £37K, day schools about £16k, so the real cost could easily be £50k per child, at least for the first. That is a lot of income after tax. And as MrsPorth points out, there are not many of them, and they tend to cluster at the extremes of the spectrum.

I think this thread is deliberately provocative. That is all don't get sucked into it people.

It's not something that irritates me. I only have one child, but that's very much a choice and I'm glad that even though I'm a lone parent and claim benefits, I can still afford decent things for him because it's easier to cover the costs for just one child - e.g. music lessons, sports clubs, days out and holidays abroad. He has his own room as we get housing benefit which wouldn't pay for separate rooms for a second child. Plus I can rely on parents for childcare, but they are retired and would struggle to cope with looking after two young children, so if I had two I'd need to pay for childcare. I know a lot of families who work more hours than me and their children have to do without things that my ds has, but they seem happy enough although it's not a lifestyle I'd want for my family. I don't think it's fair to judge them. I wouldn't want the noisiness of having lots of children around, but they would find my house too quiet probably with me and DS quietly playing board games together.

I think what holidays you can afford as a lone parent depend on things like how much maintainance you get etc. I have quite a few lone parent friends and to be honest they all have holidays abroad and mini breaks etc but Most of them get a lot of help from family and decent amount of CM on top

^Absolutely this.
My SIL has 3 children by different fathers (relevant), and each was a reasonably affluent, responsible professional. Between her income support, housing benefit, council tax benefit, child benefit, tax credits and 3 healthy amounts of CM, her monthly income is significantly higher than DHs, and he works in a professional trade.

Yes it does piss me off a little, that she can afford to go places and do things with her kids that we can't, because we have jobs and children together rather than one child per boyfriend.

Can't be bothered to read 14 pages. OP YANBU x infinity

The only people that will disagree with you are those who are offended by everything or those who are in that situation. We are in the same situation as you just had our first DD age 33 earning 60k between us. Probably only going to have 1, use 2 forms of contraception to stop any "accidents" but could afford a second child. Its about being responsible i guess.

council tax benefit

There hasn't been a 'council tax benefit' for a significant number of years now. 2012 I think. When the welfare reform act came in.

I think people should remember there is a benefit cap

I mainly agree with you OP

I find it very odd that so many seem to think big families are rare. Perhaps in a nice Surrey village, but not in inner cities. I live in a 10% most deprived ward in the country, and it's very common for 4+ child families here, I think there is sometimes a link with general deprevation to be honest. Although the reasons why are obviously very complex. Yes it's people's choice how many children they have, but I think where I live it doesn't improve kids lives when they live in overcrowded accommodation and in poverty. Having worked in adoption and fostering, honestly the amount of children who end up in care and then are followed by sibling after sibling is notable. I don't think it's just how many you can afford, but how many you can give adequate attention to, which all children deserve.

That said I was an only child and hated it!

It is a brutal truth that this planet is getting too full of people. Two will do. If everyone aimed for this the population would stabilise and life would be better for all of the next generation.

It is selfish and irresponsible to keep having dc if you cannot afford it.

UK birthrate is only 1.8 babies per woman, below replacement rate. There is room for the few families who want 5 kids, not a problem.

@Babyroobs

I can only imagine the hard work. But the love must be amazing 💕💕

What Away??
What confidential and identifying info has OP shared?? Proof please. You were very aggressive to call OP "incredibly unprofessional" in her job, so please provide watertight proof.

AwaywiththePixies27 I didn't know that...after the Welfare Reform, what did it become? I just know SIL only pays £10 or so a month on Council Tax, so presumed that was due to reductions via council tax benefits.

Op just because your life choices and priorities are about materialistic things you can buy

Yup, like three nutrious meals a day that aren't from the food bank and new school shoes. She is indeed a materialistic cow.

I will also possibly have my dc thinking about starting their own families so that their dc have youngish grandparents to support them through life

Wow. I'm not even sure what to say, other than it's not about you. It's about what they want, be it kids, a career, both and clearly, finding rhe right partner. Encouraging your children to make their own way in life is where we should all aim, inc doing what's right for them in their own time.

Definitely YANBU but you'll get people here who show lack of intelligence and accuse you of hating the poor even though you've made clear what situations you disagree with. I despise having my tax money to be given to irresponsible parents who make stupid choices.

OP, I'm with you 100%. I'm in my mid 30's and have no children, even though I'd love to have them. The reason for this is that I live in a privately rented 1 bedroom flat - my work as a teacher doesn't allow me to have a bigger place as I live in the South East. I was brought up in a poor family and it wasn't great. I don't know very many people who have deliberately had kids that they couldn't afford, but I do know one. A schoolfriend had her first child at 15 and now has 3, with 4 different dads. I think she feels that having a baby "seals" every new relationship she has. She's a decent person and a good mum within the limitations of money, and lives in two council houses joined into one. No insecure private one-bedroom flat for her!!!

Sorry, meant to say 4 children, not 3!

Can you stop whining on about your taxes op? Ffs our income is £100k plus we pay shitloads of tax, we have 4 dcs btw.

Hmm, I sort of see where you are coming from op. It's never been uncommon for people to have large families throughout history. You hear of mothers who had 7/8/9 children once upon a time.

I suppose the difference is those families didn't have a benefit system to fall back on because it didn't exist. Then the 2.4 children ideal family scenario was sold to people somewhere along the way and now people think any more than that is odd or selfish.

Saying that I don't agree people should just keep having children. I think of the support side of it too emotionally and keeping up with their activities and interests. I always wonder how people with lots of children keep up with their children in terms of homework/reading with them/spending quality time with a child individually/attending their activities/plays etc. They must spread themselves very thin and really enjoy it all without needing any time to themselves.

A friend of mine had 3 children and her partner had 2 children. They got together and had 2 more children even though they were on 100% benefits. I did think it was as it's not as though they didn't have enough children between them!

misshelena OP said she had to deal with a woman with 3 kids who wanted a bigger house as she is planning to have another baby.
I don't think any lines have been crossed in confidentiality (no name or location given), but if your job directly involves people's health or finances in a sensitive situation, it's isn't very professional to share your clients/cases' personal circumstances with the public. Especially if your job is to serve them in a professional setting.

Lets face it- if a Beautician came on here and started talking about the state of her clients' pubic hair before waxing them, she would be called out as insensitive and unprofessional.
OP is judging her client's personal circumstances on a public forum, and sharing their faults when she is paid to provide a professional service to them.
I don't see any difference between the two.

Yanbu....

misshelena give over already about very aggressive for christs sake. If you have a problem with my posts. The report button is right there for you to use freely.

I said it made her look unprofessional not that she was unprofessional.

The confidentiality agreements we signed meant we weren't allowed to discuss any of it. With our family. Or ANY internet platforms. Make of that what you will.

Thankyou LogicalPsycho you described it much better than I appeared to be!

TearsOnTheGround I have a similar acquaintance. They're desperate for no7 together despite having 6 between them. Again. 100% on benefits.

I just sit there with my lips tightly zipped.

As long as they can support the children I have no problem at all and it's not really anyone's business is it?