To think the 'information' the midwife gave me is almost propaganda?

[ethelfleda]

Recently had 24 week appointment. This is our first. Midwife asked if I had thought about feeding yet. I said I plan on breastfeeding. I say 'plan' because (as with everything else baby related) I am trying to keep an open mind as from what I hear, things don't always go according to plan! So I will try hard to breastfeed but I won't beat myself up if it doesn't work out for us.
She handed me a 20 odd page pamphlet thing and said it contained useful information on caring for a new born.

I started to read it today thinking it would be basic NHS info on how to feed, wind and change your baby etc. It was actually 20 odd pages of info telling me basically that if i don't breastfeed, my baby is more likely to develop cancer (as am I) as well as be admitted to hospital in their first year of life etc etc among other very scary statistics.
The language used was shocking IMO! And seemingly designed to make women who don't/can't breastfeed feel awful! Has anyone else had this information handed to them and thought it was way over the top??

Just because you can't see the impact of suboptimal feeding and poor health choices, it doesn't mean they haven't made a difference to your child or that they don't matter
Around 2% of women can't breastfeed. To deny the 98% who can the correct information just in case the 2% take offence is insane, and has contributed to the UK having one of the worst breastfeeding rates in the world
Couldn't put it better myself. It is also a shame that people don't understand or want to understand that breastfeeding is normal and ff should be the (guilt free) exception where there is medical need.

If a baby is not breastfed or fully breastfed FOR WHATEVER REASON inc his/her mother not wanting to breastfeed, then that's a medical reason for formula - the reasons are no one's business really, except for the fact that sometimes mothers switch reluctantly and with better input, often earlier on, they need not have done so. And that's everyone's business if we care about enabling mothers to feed the way they wish.

No, Myrtle, mum was not submitting a paper....she was just laughing at the research because she was acting like it was telling her breastfeeding stops anyone getting cancer and guarantees individuals perfect health.

Now that's something that deserves sarcasm, and indeed, laughing.

or are just too plain ignorant to try.

Bert^ you were saying you had never seen judgemental posts on MN well here is a bloomer.

In terms of the people I know more breastfed than didn't. That's fact, so to me it didn't feel normal FF a tiny baby at all.

Tictok your posts on this thread are fab. Have you thought of running for government rather than posting on MN?

By medical reason I was thinking of someone like Mychild and her story.

Love the 'give a tit for a bit' message!

I found the feed for two years advice that we were given at the BF workshop rather overwhelming. Before birth I just thought 'oh yes, I want to do that' as I thought that was what was normal and natural. I found BF so overwhelmingly awful the thought of doing it for two years made me suicidal (yes, I had PND).

Maybe a more nuanced message would help - any BF is better than none. And also that feeding for two years isn't like feeding a newborn. I'm still now, much to my surprise, BFing my 20mo. I still don't like it, but for ten mins a day it's something I can put up with - unlike feeding a newborn which takes over your entire day and night!

The EBF women who were so nasty at the BF cafe I went to for advice about mix feeding? Several months later they started coming to a baby group I went to. They were still very cliquey but now they all moaned about how fed up they were with BF. They all BF to six months, then switched to formula. Bizarrely I'm the only one of the lot still BF despite all the formula early on.

If a baby is not breastfed or fully breastfed FOR WHATEVER REASON inc his/her mother not wanting to breastfeed, then that's a medical reason

What's medical about it?

Titty, it's medical, because the baby would be ill if he was not fed anything (or of course, die).

I can't bear the idea of mothers being subject to some sort of test to see if their reasons for FF are 'good' enough, before they're 'approved'. I think women's choice trumps everything - trouble is, that social, cultural and physical barriers interfere with this choice.

"Night time breastmilk does not keep the baby awake - I saw someone post this earlier today and decided to let it go, but now I see another poster believes it. "

Feeling totally stupid to have believed this now!!
goes to show that even the most critical among us buy into falls news some of the time. I remember that bf sent mine to sleep but it's a while ago now.

*and can't spell false news

I believe it's slightly different for exclusively expressed milk, which may not be as responsive/changeable as milk straight from the boob. I'll have to check my source.

Titty, it's medical, because the baby would be ill if he was not fed anything (or of course, die).

The outcome is medical. The decision isn't.

Yes, titty. Do check your source.

That's rather condescending tiktok. Grow up?? I've made a light hearted comment based on my own experience, yet you feel the need to respond with curt antagonism.
I think it is rather obvious that my post was in no way scientific, nor was it reflecting on any other experience other than my own. So please wind your neck in and find something else to criticise.

I know it's very hard for mums who try and breastfeed and can't. My DSIS was unable to breastfeed with her DD because she had an emergency c section at 32 weeks because of pre-Enclampsia. With her DS, born 3 years later, she tried so hard to breastfeed but he was unable to get enough milk and he kept losing weight so she again had to use formula.

It was a very hard time for her and she really struggled with people banging on about breast being best. It wasn't that she disagreed at all, but she was made to feel really guilty for not being able to. There are a lot of new mums who feel like that. I'm with you, OP, new mums are often struggling and this leaflet is the last thing they need to see if they can't breastfeed.

And nor do I interpret the forementioned BF 'propaganda', as some kind of guaranteed health insurance, although I have seen many claims that do almost reach that level of ridiculousness...I am perhaps a little cynical of a lot of the health awareness fodder that is fed to the public on various themes, as most of it has never been reflected in the health of my family, or indeed the many young friends and loved ones I have lost over the years. I feel generally well informed on my own health, and the choices I make for myself and my family, and leaflets like that, are of no value to me I'm afraid. But of course I do respect that there are those who may indeed find 'information' like that, quite useful.

The trouble with the weight loss stuff is that even HCPs (especially health visitors! but even consultant paediatricians) are really woefully informed about appropriate weight gain in breastfed babies. So they get new mothers in a real panic (oh my god, my baby could die, failure to thrive) when actually in many cases it is fine.

I am not saying it always is, and there are important checks to be done as in some cases there can be a genuine supply issue and the baby can be in real danger but I'm afraid it's often just based on lack of knowledge of appropriate weight gain when it comes to breastfeeding. For obvious reasons absolutely no mother ever wants to risk their baby dying or being poorly for lack of food, so many get unnecessarily frightened into supplementing or switching to formula (see today's survey results on Mumsnet baby not gaining weight is a common reason).

A good number of these cases could be solved by making sure that HCPs refer to average growth charts specifically for breastfed babies -- unfortunately not often the case now.

In case anyone is interested, you can find some helpful information on this issue here: kellymom.com/health/growth/growthcharts/

2% being trotted out again..there is no basis for this figure. The only research done (which was a bit shit) suggested nearer 20%. Basically we don't know proportion of women cannot BF due to no or insufficient supply.

Penguin, I agree knowledge about appropriate growth is poor. This can also lead to BF problems being missed, though, not just the inappropriate supplementation you describe. Too often, babies are not BF well, they lose too much weight and/or gain too slowly, but mothers are told all is well.....when BF should be fixed early on. When it's not, there's a panic at some stage and the baby ends up FF. Don't know what you mean about charts - in the UK the same charts based on BF baby data have been used for years. In any case, BF babies and FF babies gain more or less the same up to about four mths.

@tiktok do you know what % of issues lie with the baby not the mother? I dislike the "mother couldn't breastfeed" all the time when logic would suggest at least a proration of the time (like mine) it's an issue with the baby.

*Portion.

No, we don't know what proportion of mothers literally cannot BF. Given that we know nature certainly does 'misbehave' from time to time, it's sensible to accept that BF won't always work, even in the best of circumstances. But in places where literally everyone breastfeeds, not enough milk really is unusual (there may be other problems, but not really that one).

We do know from observation that some babies have more difficulty latching on effectively - even if the mother is making gallons. But the exact number? Not known.

Mychild I think the range is between 1 in 10,000 to 1/60,000 for metabolic disorders (depending on the condition) where the child can't physically digest breastmilk or standard formula. Its about 1/700 for palate problems which interfere with sucking and tongue-tie occurs in around 7/100 babies which also causes difficulty with sucking. In the last two groups surgery is very effective and breastmilk itself is fine. In the first, only a specific diet is recommended which includes a specialised formula, as you know.

I know what it is for the disorder my child has - I was wondering naked if anyone knew the total % of problems that lie with the child

I just feel (and yes I know I would say this wouldn't I) that gets forgotten in the "mothers who don't / can't / won't breastfeed" discussion. And I'd like an idea of a total %.

I might try to find it but I don't know that my google skills are up to it !