Punctuation

[GrandDesespoir]

AIBU to wonder why people make up their own personal rules for punctuation when this usually only has the effect of obfuscating what they're trying to say? (NB I'm not talking about established writers who have done this like James Joyce and e e cummings.)

I'm thinking of things like random spaces before exclamation or question marks, unnecessary capital letters, words in quotation marks when they have no need to be, and (my pet peeve) completely eshewing punctuation in favour of an ersatz stream-of-consciousness style with loosely-connected (or completely incoherent) thoughts separated by an indiscriminate number of dots.

Nobody suddenly decides they're going to start writing 1.2 when they actually mean 12, or 3 x 3 = 6 when they mean 3 + 3, so why do some people apparently think they should use punctuation differently to everybody else?

I'm a professional writer and editor. OP, you sound like a twat.

I really don't think that was the point the particular poster was making. It came across as inverted snobbery over using words of more than one syllable. The way you have interpreted it is much kinder than it sounded to me.

RiverTam it's not the 'use words of more than a couple of syllables' but when the 'fancy' word doesn't sit comfortably in the sentence.

I really don't think that was the point the particular poster was making. It came across as inverted snobbery over using words of more than one syllable. The way you have interpreted it is much kinder than it sounded to me.

No, I meant exactly what Maisy said. I think that was clear from my posts that lead up to it.

Just reread it - nope, still not getting that.

Well, Tam I can do nothing about that. Words are interpreted by the reader - I don't control that.

It doesn't matter how great your punctuation is, if you're can't communicate your idea suitably to your audience. Sometimes that means using simpler words (and shorter sentences) to create impact.

Kinda ironic that a poster with a French name betrays complete ignorance of the norms of French punctuation (spaces in front of question marks etc.)

I remember seeing an ad once for a secretary to one of the 1970s politicians who had been kicked upstairs to the Lords - think it might have been Harold Wilson. One of the requirements for the job was that the candidate understood "the correct use of the apostrophe". Never forgot that one as my unspeakably unpleasant English teacher in the Lower Third literally bawled it at us first thing every Monday morning.

How are apostrophes different in the USA? Spelling, idioms and punctuation is different in US speech, but not apostrophes...

In the US it is correct to place an apostrophe in plural words which are acronyms:

C.D.'s

river
I knew that at some point on this thread two things would come up:

1. That people think using long words is pretentious
2. That challenging somebody for being pretentious is inverse snobbery

Really, lots of reasonably smart people know many big words, but we don't feel the need to cram as many as possible into a post to make ourselves sound good. Sometimes I think genuinely smart people know how/when to demonstrate intelligence appropriately and linguistic cock waving on an Internet forum isn't really what most of us would go for.

And look at how the New Yorker handles Donald Trump, Jnr.'s name

www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-correct-punctuation-of-donald-trump-jrs-name

Maisy - so are you saying ostentatious polysyllabism perpetuates patrinomic appendage oscillation?

dad I'm saying that people who show off are just trying to make themselves look good (and in my opinion show themselves as being not as intelligent as they wish to present).
I find the same in discussions. Intelligent people know their specialisms and will talk happily about those and will acknowledge when they don't know as much, whereas people who like to run their mouth and attempt to sound smart on every subject only show their own ignorance.

Are you a primary teacher? That sounds to me like how my 10 year olds write. Why would you even think to put a capital letter in the middle of a word and then not spot it when editing?

Kinda ironic that a poster with a French name betrays complete ignorance of the norms of French punctuation (spaces in front of question marks etc.)

How do you infer that? I'm fully aware of the French conventions for leaving spaces, but I wasn't referring to text written in French so it didn't seem relevant.

Maisy - I agree with what you say, I was just trying to be funny.

dad
Oops. Sorry. Long day and massively grumpy from work. I totally missed the humour and read it as a sarcastic dig.

Though my sense of humour bypass has made the entire thing even more amusing.

Don't worry - humour easily backfires when it's anonymous typing. I should have done one of these -->

I hope you can put your feet up and relax now...

It's not the 'use words of more than a couple of syllables' but when the 'fancy' word doesn't sit comfortably in the sentence.

If I've counted correctly, I've used a grand total of three 'fancy' words, all of which mean precisely what I intended them to mean, albeit one had a spelling error. I was expressing exasperation, and using language colourfully (or pretentiously, depending on your take) because I was writing about language, not to prove a point about my level of education or whatever else I've been repeatedly accused of.

I was not having a pop at people who struggle with dyslexia or some other difficulty with written language, or even people who simply aren't interested in SPAG. I didn't spend hours searching for words to make myself sound superior - the words I chose were the ones that sprang to mind as those which would accurate express what I was trying to say.

The fact that a number of people have understood exactly what I was getting at - and not taken offence at my apparently audacious use of polysyllabic words - is reassuring, at least.

Sadly OP, you can pick apart 'I only used 3 words etc' it doesn't change the fact that the post has a tone to it that sounds 'I'm so much better'.
Otherwise you'd have just said what many posters have said: my manager does these things in writing at work and it does my head in. Please say I'm not the only one. And why the hell do they do it? Argh.

It sort of feels a bit like you were expecting lots of 'Yes that's so annoying' and you haven't got that because if the pretentious tone. Most of the replies on this thread would have been less had your initial tone been different.

Maisy - on your criticism of OP, I part company with you. The opening post reads fine to me and puts the point across with an engaging vocabulary.

Where I disagree with the OP is in thinking there is much of a problem here. For a short email or internet post, haphazard punctuation and overuse of ellipsis is not that big a deal, as you can usually follow what's being said.

My bugbear is posts or emails that are not split into paragraphs, so you feel like your eyes are glazing over as you try to discern some structure in what is being said.

Whereas I felt there was nothing wrong with the vocabulary as such but felt that all of it together on an Internet forum where people are just chilling out and chatting felt a bit off.

Lack of paragraphs in email annoys me. To be honest, I generally couldn't care about minor stylistic things or mistakes in informal things. Formal documents should be accurate.

I approve of the opening post, too.
Just sayin'...