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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The one where Trump just can't stop being Trump

976 replies

TheClaws · 01/07/2017 05:34

Time for a new 'un.

Old thread here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2958743-Its-too-hot-for-high-drama-but-nonetheless-we-persist-Trump-cont

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38
PerkingFaintly · 03/07/2017 06:20

Checking The Jackson Telegraph world page, their top "story" is "New Zealand deputy PM dreaded flying dildo attack, court hears".

And according to them, the attack on London Bridge is breaking news (titled so you'd think it was a new incident just happening).

jacksontelegraph.com/category/world/

So shameless purveyors of dirty clickbait. How charming.

SanFranBear · 03/07/2017 07:49

Thanks for your response, ayylmaoo - and I think the point you made about stopping expecting him to be Potus is probably (and pretty sadly) the right one.

He was never presidential and he's not going to suddenly become it - despite it being what he should do and what would actually make him respected across the board.

I don't want him to fail, believe it or not. And I think that's why I get so worked up.. the US deserves better than this (even though they voted him into power). As mentioned previously, America is currently a laughing stock and because of his continuing actions, it's going to take a long time for them to get any credibility back Sad

lionheart · 03/07/2017 07:59

Perking--have been reading around some other sites and think this might be 'fake news'. If it is, I suppose it begs the question of what it is designed to achieve (aside from clicks). Fanning racial division?

CaveMum · 03/07/2017 08:00

Good news, looks like Obama is working behind the scenes to help the Democratic Party: thehill.com/homenews/campaign/340314-obama-plays-behind-the-scenes-role-in-rebuilding-democratic-party?amp

Orlantina · 03/07/2017 08:04

the US deserves better than this

This. The UK has a strong relationship with the US and a good one. Now it's been really affected.

Orlantina · 03/07/2017 08:13

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 7h7 hours ago
More
Stock Market at all time high, unemployment at lowest level in years (wages will start going up) and our base has never been stronger!

Interesting:

US job rate growth has slowed down recently.
Wages aren't growing.

lionheart · 03/07/2017 08:13

why fake it?

Lweji · 03/07/2017 08:29

There's a big problem with lists of winnings and losses.

The only people winning should be the US and particularly the vulnerable.

So:

  • worldwide disapproval
  • worldwide mocking of the president
  • disinvestment and shutting down of science
  • deregulation to benefit corporations, but not small investors or savers
  • deregulation to protect big pharma but not the vulnerable affected by dangerous chemicals
  • less choice for women
  • attacks on the free press. Attempts at shutting down opposition speech
  • secrecy when passing legislation. Shutting down debate
  • supposedly giving dangerous benefits to companies to save handfuls of jobs. But effectively lying about it.
  • contradicting himself and his own administration on a daily basis, so that nobody can know what to expect or what the hell the policy is.
  • appointing people who are clearly dumb, unknowledgeable about their area or with obvious conflict of interests or terrible track records

I don't see any of these as wins for the people who matter.
Unless you mean big corporations, big money and that part of the population who'll shoot themselves on the foot (often literally) for their hate agenda.

Lweji · 03/07/2017 08:35

He doesn't come across as a typical slimey politician with the rehearsed replies and predictable behaviour.

You're right about typical, but he's just as slimy as most. Or worse.
Predictability is good when you're running a country. Nobody wants a wild card. People want to know how much tax they'll have to pay, what health protection they'll have, that their health and security is assured and protected. Not a wild card.
Not someone who's more worried about tweeting insults than finding people to fill government jobs to get things done.

People wanted change.
And they certainly got it.
A clear case of be careful what you wish for.

Lweji · 03/07/2017 08:39

believe the administration is crumbling if it brings you comfort, things will keep ticking along.

They will. Until there's a crisis. Or it reaches tipping point.

There's simply not enough people.
And GOP doesn't have well thought out legislation to put in place.

Sadly, I do think things will implode within the 4 years. And that's not something anyone wants.

Orlantina · 03/07/2017 08:42

And there's plenty of potential crisis

North Korea
Syria
Economic
Russia spreading its wings

Then unexpected events. I fear there will be a major terrorist incident within the USA.

PerkingFaintly · 03/07/2017 08:56

Yes, lionheart. That's what I was wondering when I said it was good-ish news that the story was fake.

Obviously I'm glad the invented murders didn't happen (on top of all the real racist murders of black people that sadly actually have happened).

But WTF about someone sitting down to invent such a story? Just for clicks? For clicks and something else?

lionheart · 03/07/2017 09:29

It's a bit odd really ...

TheClaws · 03/07/2017 10:02

The Associated Press‏Verified account @AP 8m8 minutes ago
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China's Xi warns Trump of “negative factors” hurting U.S. ties.

BEIJING (AP) — Chinese President Xi Jinping warned President Donald Trump on Monday that “some negative factors” are hurting U.S.-China relations, as tensions flare anew over a slew of long-standing sore points.

Xi’s comments in a phone call with Trump follow Beijing’s displeasure over U.S. arms sales to rival Taiwan, U.S. sanctions against a Chinese bank over its dealings with North Korea and, most recently, the sailing of a U.S. destroyer within the territorial seas limit of a Chinese-claimed island in the South China Sea.

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SanFranBear · 03/07/2017 11:12

According to the BBC, the White House statement about the call with China doesn't say anything about these so called 'negative factors' - it's taken from the Chinese release.

Plays into the 'everything's rosy' narrative coming from this administration and this is what I hate as I mentioned earlier. Things are not great whatever spin you put on it. Sort it out - you can't go pissing off allies Sad

TheClaws · 03/07/2017 11:50

Typical Sad

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Orlantina · 03/07/2017 12:04

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 2m2 minutes ago
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Will be speaking with Germany and France this morning.

Short and sweet.

Not the UK?

cozietoesie · 03/07/2017 12:24

Right now, I suspect that you're better off not being mentioned in a tweet. Wink

TheClaws · 03/07/2017 12:24

Wonder what the faux pas will be this time. They seem to get cumulatively worse as time goes on.

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TheClaws · 03/07/2017 12:26

BTW, he's speaking with the whole of Germany? And France? Amazing. Them nouns are tricky Grin

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TheClaws · 03/07/2017 12:29

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 9m9 minutes ago
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Spoke yesterday with the King of Saudi Arabia about peace in the Middle-East. Interesting things are happening!

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OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 03/07/2017 12:39

@pdacosta
Newsrooms around the country are having to spend additional money on security for staff because of the president's anti-media incitement.

Evan McMullin @Evan_McMullin
Consider what this means about our president & our country. You'd expect to read this about Russia or Turkey. Incredibly sad to see it here.

And this happens as most Republican leaders watch silently. Those who do speak up, do so only softly and for a moment.

TheClaws · 03/07/2017 12:41

And Italy! Won't bother to paste it cos it's just like the others.

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AcrossthePond55 · 03/07/2017 12:43

And this happens as most Republican leaders watch silently. Those who do speak up, do so only softly and for a moment.

It's the equivalent of 'those parents' who see their children kicking dirt at or snatching toys from other children at the park and say 'Now, Wilberforce, we mustn't do that. Tsk tsk, Wilberforce is such a 'lively child!' but do precisely nothing to stop them.

M0stlyBowlingHedgehog · 03/07/2017 12:51

I've been thinking more about Pain's fascinating link above
www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/530736/
and about the fake KKK story.

It's got me wondering about historical parallels. If I had to reach for a political counterpart to Putin, I think it might be the first ever chancellor of a unified Germany, Otto Von Bismarck, back in the 1870s. He famously manipulated the text of a dispatch (the Ems Telegram) and leaked the "fake news" version to the French press, precipitating a diplomatic crisis and leading to France declaring war on Prussia (a war which Bismarck knew they were in no position to win - they duly lost 7 weeks later, consolidating Bismarck's grip on power and enabling him to extend his power base to cover the other German speaking states).

When it comes to Putin and Trump, the thing that strikes me is that Putin doesn't actually need kompromat, or any solid grip on Trump himself of the sort that (if proved) might lead to Trump's impeachment (I'm pretty sure he does have some of Trump's inner circle in his pocket, but not necessarily Trump himself). The confusion of everyone wondering what the extent of the connections are and whether or not they constitute grounds, and whether we have enough evidence or not: that on its own is enough to serve Putin's purposes.

Of course, if Trump tries to obstruct an investigation into his inner circle and their Russian ties that is grounds for impeachment on the basis of obstruction of justice - but it's the sort of grounds that Trump's supporters can throw their hands up at and go "but Trump himself did nothing wrong."

For an impeachment to work it needs not just solid evidence on a charge which pretty much everyone can agree is justified grounds for impeachment, it needs to have carried enough of the public along with it (including a sufficient proportion of our Trumpette visitors) that it can be done without leading to civil unrest.

By everyone agreeing that the grounds are justified, I'm thinking of for instance the Clinton impeachment. There were a lot of your typical lefty-dude-bros whose attitude was "yes he's done it, but c'mon, get real, since when was oral sex grounds for impeachment? It's a private peccadillo, not treason FGS!" Of course it was the perjury and obstruction of justice bits which led to impeachment - which failed - not the oral sex itself. But I can imagine dyed-in-the-wool Trumpites saying similar - they'd gloss over the obstruction of justice bits and simply say "so, the guy's son-in-law has business interests in Russia? Since when have we used guilt-by-association to topple a president in the US?" Of course, this misses the point of the charges - as indeed the lefty dude bros missed the point of the charges - but it's not just facts, but the scope for different interpretations of those fact that matters.

That's why I'm back where I was at the start of this thread - thinking that any impeachment has to be done really carefully and be absolutely watertight, not leaving wriggle room for "you're just using a minor procedural point to try to bring him down for political reasons." Which is why I still think the left should be concentrating on getting their supporters out in force at the mid-terms. The democratic process looks to me a better option than impeachment at the moment.

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