To think I am going to get totally shafted here

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

I'm a nanny. As my one charge is of an age where she doesn't 'need' me as much, I've picked up various PA duties for my employer so it's remained a full time position. I stay over when she's away (single parent) I care for two slightly highly strung dogs, I keep the diary, organise shopping etc etc.

Now my charge is off to boarding school in September. Yes, I 'knew' it was coming (I took her to the interviews and exams for one thing and was there when she got her acceptance letter) BUT my employer made no mention of when my job would come to a natural end. I didn't want to 'show my hand' as it were and have waited for her to approach me with end dates/redundancy talk etc.

This morning, in an email (a 'no subject' one at that!) she has said she 'proposes' I work up until the 21st July. After that she'll pay holiday outstanding.

No mention of redundancy paid which I'm sure I must be owed since it's not me choosing to leave the job. Statutory at least? It's been over three years.

I'm shaking now, partly because I don't know what I'm going to do (find another job obviously but don't have lots of time, less than I thought I would)

Partly because after three years she hasn't sat me down face to face to talk this through (she's using the excuse she doesn't want her daughter to overhear )

Because I need the payment as a cusion if I do t find work straight away- I rent a flat with my partner and rent payment is high enough to warrent we are both in constant full time employment or we'd be screwed.

Also because I'm shit with things like this, I go quietly rather than make a fuss (self esteem issues) but I think I'm going to get massively screwed over if I do not speak up.

Please wise mumsnetters, advice on what to do would be really, really appreciated. I feel a sick abs have no idea what my next move should be.

Treated as an employee, that should say.

'well, no contract also means no contract for you to be held to.'

The contract is self-evident via the actions of both parties (but yes, I'd agree that OP would be wise to get a written contract in next job) and de facto exists. If you know nothing about the law then seriously, just don't waste your time or OP's by spouting ill-informed bollocks

OP Follow MovingOnUP's advice

Anyone who works for two years for an enployer is entitled to redundancy payment if the job comes to an end whether its a fixed term job or not . You can calculate what youre due on the government website.

I'm not sure I ever got redundancy in any of my nanny jobs. Just notice, three months, pay.

I nannied and ran agencies for almost 20 years. Nannies are only rarely self employed. Maybe 1%.

And in every nanny job I was made redundant from I got at least the statutory redundancy pay. Without ever asking.

Honestly, I wish some people would engage their brains before bloody posting!

Most nannies are hired on a self employment basis so you would have paid tax and NI yourself.

Total, utter bollocks
Very very few nannies are employed on self-employed basis and HMRC has very clear definitions for when nannies are allowed to - they have to look after 3 or more families at any one time, or be on a series of temporary contracts like a maternity nurse

It just shows what appalling employers there are out there - I'll bet they would foam at the mouth if their own employers tried to wheedle their way out of paying redundancy pay, yet they oh so conveniently don't see themselves as employers when they get themselves a nanny!

You actually wouldn't believe some of he shit I heard from (mostly extremely wealthy) people working at agencies.

The au pair section was even worse.

Sounds like you will be getting a reasonable deal - and well done for having a very civilised conversation about it. From what Ive read above, if she had given you statutory notice and statutory redundancy, you would be getting a similar number of weeks to those you are getting - or even a bit less since you're getting 6.5 weeks plus pay for holidays in lieu.... I'd wait and see what she says, and then propose that she moves some of what she's calculated as your "notice pay" (i.e. anything beyond the three weeks statutory i.e. extra weeks and holidays) to increase the redundancy amount so you don't pay tax on it... don't believe she loses, and you gain. Good luck... and she's definitely not out to shaft you, and has probably thought she was giving you a good deal by giving you such a long notice period....

I think getting holiday owed that I haven't been able to take isn't necessarily a 'good deal'. It's my holiday! Of course I should either have it back or had been able to take it (her personal and work commitments mean I've taken hardly any in six months)

I don't think that's what pp was saying OP. Her point was that your employer didn't need to give you 6+ weeks notice but has done in what was probably meant as a good will gesture on her side.

You're rather defensive, I don't think you're "getting totally shafted" at all.

As with so many circumstances the trick to finally resolving this is how you say as well as what you say.

You have my sympathy OP, also a nanny I have met so many people who are shocked/impressed that I am getting maternity pay while I'm on mat leave. Like it's not a proper job or something.

Call ACAS or go to your local CAB. I work in HR - if you have a permanent contract and you've been employed by them for more than 2 years, you are entitled to redundancy. It will likely be only statutory.

You would be entitled to any accrued and outstanding holiday pay anyway.

OP
You have had a lot of good advice about redundancy. I hope you get a job immediately. If you haven't got one by the time you leave your job and you have been paying NI then you should be entitled to contributions based Job Seekers Allowance. Depending on your other circumstances you may be entitled to other benefits (housing benefit or universal credit). Universal credit is replacing certain benefits which are based on the amount of income and savings you have. It is slowly being rolled out. If you try to claim contribution based JSA in a universal credit area you need to be firm stating that it is contributions based and they might know it as "new JSA".
Citizens advice website has a lot of information on benefits.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/

There is a benefit calculator you could use entitledto.co.uk
www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/startcalc.aspx?e2dwp=y

I am a nanny and was with my last family for 8 years, like you the boys have gone to boarding school so I was no longer needed. I received redundancy pay and my employer was really good about it but I did wait until she bought it up as I was really nervous about broaching the subject with her. Good luck x

All I am aware of is that redundancy pay was related to how often you are paid i.e monthly etc .
I would go to Citizens advice as they are knowledgeable about these issues.
You may be entitled to some pay but I would wager it's not a lot if you don't have a contract and you have only have worked there 3 years.
If you are in the London area and have good references you should get another Nanny position I would hope .
Wishing you lots of luck

Astonished at the number of posters who think normal employment legislation does not apply to a nanny.

Of course this is a redundancy situation and normal redundancy procedures and consultation should be followed.

I have met so many people who are shocked/impressed that I am getting maternity pay while I'm on mat leave. Like it's not a proper job or something

One of our nannies went on maternity leave . I never thought for a minute that I would not have to pay maternity pay.

Most nannies are hired on a self employment basis so you would have paid tax and NI yourself

As the OP says - this is complete and utter bollocks both legally and factually

So nannies get redundancy pay when EVERY child they care for grows up? That sounds bonkers. Surely you know when your job will be coming to an end. Youre not being made redundant you have finished the job you were hired to do. As you have no contract you probably wont have much to argue over. Look for a new job asap and use it as a lesson learned. Plus you may need them as a reference

Oh lord gemma. I do hope you don't employ anyone. You are woefully misinformed. Or dim. Or you haven't read the thread.

So nannies get redundancy pay when EVERY child they care for grows up? That sounds bonkers. Surely you know when your job will be coming to an end. Youre not being made redundant you have finished the job you were hired to do. As you have no contract you probably wont have much to argue over. Look for a new job asap and use it as a lesson learned. Plus you may need them as a reference

You really have no idea what you are talking about.

So far as "No contract" - every employee has a contract.

There is always a contract between an employee and employer. Even if there is nothing in writing, but a contract will still exist. Employment legislation will provide the terms. This is because the agreement to work for an employer and the employer’s agreement to pay for work forms a contract. An employer has to give a written statement within two months of employing starting work.

I think she should have let you know six months beforehand what her plans were.

Can you speak to a college like Norland? They are bound to know how you stand legally or at least advise you who to speak to? I'm sure they wouldn't mind helping you with some advise even if you are not a norland nanny. It's worth a try. Good luck. X