Nursery overfeeding 3yo

[yorkshapudding]

DD(3.5) has been identified as being "a little bit overweight" (the HV's words) and I am keen to address this before it becomes a real problem.

She goes to a Nursery attached to the local primary school 3 days a week. She also attends breakfast club on those days. This is unavoidable due to my working hours. At breakfast they are given a choice of toast, cereal or both. They help themselves so portions aren't limited. There is also toast, fruit and milk available for morning and afternoon snack, again they help themselves. DD loves toast, would eat it all day if we let her. Same goes for milk.

When the problem with her weight was picked up we told Nursery about it and the Manager dismissed it as "rubbish" and told me to "ignore the HV" as DD "looks perfectly fine. I could see her point as DD does not look like a 'fat' child to me either, but I explained that DH and I don't want to disregard HCP advice so asked them to limit DD's bread and dairy intake as recommended by HV. Despite assurances, this hasn't happened and DD is still having several slices of toast a day (usually there, one at breakfast and one at each snack, but has been up to five slices in a day!) plus regular milk drinks. I have explained to the Nursery that we are concerned about this and I am met with assurances that it won't happen again and they will do everything they can to support us, but nothing changes.

At home we are being very careful with portion sizes, DD eats healthy, home cooked meals, she rarely snacks between meals, she doesn't have sugary drinks or sweets. Things like cake and ice cream are reserved for special occasions (meals out, parties etc) and given in small amounts. But I'm worried all our efforts will be for nothing if she's allowed to gorge herself three days a week and it's starting to frustrate me.

AIBU to expect the Nursery to work with us on this? I know they're busy and I don't want to be 'that parent'- but I don't want DD to be overweight either. When I go to the dreaded HV weigh in and am told "hmmm, she's still a bit overweight" I feel like they must think I'm a terrible mother, but I can't do anymore than I'm already doing

Are the nursery workers overweight? That might be relevant.

I must admit the diet the nursery are offering your child sounds appalling. The breakfast is almost pure carbohydrates, which is known for causing a surge of energy followed by a steep drop in energy.

Op you are completely valid in your
Concerns. A 3 year old doesn't need
To snack on toast and full fat milk all day. I would send in semi-skimmed milk, and be insistent that she is to have fruit as snacks only.
How good is she in terms of doing what you say? My Dd goes to a school nursery which also has a help yourself approach. My Dd loves eating too (she's 4!) so I say to her st the beginning of the day that 1 glass of milk is enough, and she can have 1 snack from the table in addition to her packed lunch. She is fine about this, and will tell me which fruit she chose when she gets home.

OP I'm a bit confused about what is served at nursery, because you are sending in a packed lunch as well? Why is she getting spaghetti and mashed potatoes in the afternoon as well?

She is there for tea as well because of my working hours.

Oh ffs. She's three and may well be becoming up to a growth spurt or a phase of living off three strawberries a day.

I would love to believe that she isn't really overweight and its just a growth spurt but it's been going on too long for that.

Are the nursery workers overweight? That might be relevant.

Some of them are, some aren't.

Get their menu plan and highlight what she is allowed to eat on it.
So
No toast , no mashed potatoe ..... Absolute ban is the way to go , as they don't seem to understand your point. It's easier to ban something than control a portion,
What would they do it's it's an allergy ?
it may be prescriptive , but we all control our kids food by being the ones to either allow to disallow something .

She is only at nursery 3 days a week you are feeding her the other 4! .I think blaming it all on the nursery is barking up the wrong tree

That just shows your ignorance on the subject user
Feckin keyboard warriors on mumsnet
Nothing constructive or even original to add, seeing as yorksha has already addressed that accusation upthread.

Yes maybe finding a new nursery would be better. Would you consider a childminder? I only say that because I know from friends that they are normally happy to be quite flexible with diets and menus where a nursery can't always be.

If you are happy with the other aspects of the nursery you could try a formal letter outlining your concerns and saying you would like them urgently addressed or you will be looking at sending her to another setting. I don't know how you could monitor their adherence to your demand though they may just pay lip service.

I also think your idea to get the health visitor to contact them is a good one. Surely they have some kind of healthy eating policy. They ought to send someone on some kind of training as they obviously don't know what the are doing, toast as snacks and then double carbs for dinner!?

When you talk about slices of toast do you mean a whole slice of bread? I've never been to a nursery that serves toast in that way.

I would bet that the 'slices' of toast are half-slices, or even quarters as a pp suggested - so I'd ask for clarification first.

I'd also ask if the nursery was working towards being a Healthy School or getting accredited by Food for Life or similar. It sounds like they haven't put much thought into the meals. I'd also want confirmation they aren't having sweets and cake and biscuits every 2 days for a 'party'.

Also is your dd choosing the carby options or is that all there is? I can imagine bolognese sauce being served with spaghetti or with mash and a child asking for both and refusing the veg.

My ds has a very limited diet so I have to watch it carefully. He's thankfully spot on average for height and weight for his age, but probably 1/3 his class are definitely overweight and at least 2 kids per class (inner city primary) are of a weight that is clearly obese. The parents are generally similarly-proportioned. I'm glad it's a mile walk to school as otherwise ds's tendency to be sat on his arse would be more of a problem.

I'm confused by the posters who talk about "growth spurts" and the body's need for carbs then? I always thought carbohydrates were for fuel, and actual body growth, which I would imagine included bone growth, tissue such as muscle, ligaments, sinew, blood vessels, etc would actually need calcium and protein...? I'm not in any way a nutritionist, not being arsey, just actually wondering if I'd got that wrong

I too am confused, because she's only there 3 days. You might have to be stricter at home?
Maybe you are going to have to tell HV that Nursery haven't addressed her(HV's) concerns. Ask her to note that in your files. At least then you are covered!! Ask HV to contact Nursery direct. Get her to do her own 'dirty work', seeing as you have been able to convince Nursery to agree.

3 days out of 7 is significant. Poor feeding in this time could have an effect for sure.

But why should the OP be stricter at home because the nursery serve unrestricted crap?
Not only that, but you then run the risk of turning toast into that treat food that mean mummy doesn't give you.
Refined carbs are filling but low in nutriental value. Fruit, veg, pulses, even things like sardines or cubes of cheese all make far better snacks. DS likes almonds, although I appreciate nuts at a nursery is probably not a good move.

To answer some further questions/points raised:

They are whole slices, I've checked. I was surprised too as I had thought it would make more sense to give halves or even quarters.

I honestly don't see how I can be any "stricter" with her diet at home...not without being extremely controlling and restrictive and making us all miserable

I spent my lunchbreak today ringing round local Nurseries and cannot find one that offers term time only places, which we would need as I don't work school holidays. All other settings locally (apart form the one DD currently goes to) seem to be very expensive private Nurseries that we would struggle to afford anyway. It's very frustrating feeling like you have no option but to entrust your DC to people who don't take your concerns seriously.

Am going to start drafting a letter to the Nursery manager tonight. I will then speak to the HV tomorrow- did ring earlier but she was on training.

Any advice as to what to include in this letter to Nursery would be very much appreciated. I don't want to come across as overly accusatory but equally I need them to know I'm not impressed by their response so far.

As you can't trust the nursery to be sensible, I would put in writing that your dietary requirements for her are a) no milk (at 3.5 she doesn't need it) b) fruit/veg only for snacks, no toast at all and c) fruit and yoghurt only for puddings.

Double carbs for tea is something you might have to let go, but the other changes are things they can easily accommodate. Yes, it will mean she is different from her peers but in my experience of nurseries there will be several children who have slightly adapted meals due to allergies or cultural preference.

I would ask for a more nutritious breakfast for a start, OP, for all the children.

Is it worth having a final conversation (perhaps with manager?) BEFORE you write the letter? I agree not EVERYTHING needs to change, but something does & you need to know what they can truly accommodate (not just say they will) and what will be too tricky. E.g. You supply her snacks, or, they limit toast, or, one complex carb per meal, or no pudding apart from yoghurt/fruit.

I really don't think it's much to ask that there isn't limitless toast & milk & that the meals are balanced! For any child! Far more reasonable than saying 'no toast' 'no milk'. but if they force you into a corner then obviously that's an option, albeit not one I'd readily take.

When you know what they can accommodate, write the letter and set out clearly what the health visitor advised, your original conversation with the nursery, the (unacceptable) outcome of that, the outcome of the most recent conversation & what was agreed & expected to happen. Be v firm, clear and succinct.

Is it worth having a final conversation (perhaps with manager?) BEFORE you write the letter?

You may be right. I will have a think about this. It's tricky as she is never in when I drop off and has invariably left for the day by the time I arrive to pick up, so would probably be by phone or email which hasn't been successful so far.

ooooh what a horrible situation. I really feel for you op, and just for the record you sound like you love your daughter very much. much much more than the people who want their kids to stay fat!

I think in your shoes i would look for a childminder. nursery could be really limiting her exercise, compared with a child minder who has to do school runs and shopping etc by foot? Also I have never met a child minder who wants to encourage kids to drop toast crumbs all over their house 5 times a day.

unless your daughter is by far the biggest child in the nursery I'm worried that the nursery will just continue to feed her as much as they like because they can't really limit her and then give larger children unlimited toast.

Could you make her a little more active instead if you can't change the food at school

I would be like a broken record, 'please ensure dd does not have more than 1 slice of toast at the beginning and end of every day because I am trying to encourage her to have 'me sized meals' in accordance with the health visitors advice'. Fight the battle on the toast, not on the main meal. Ultimately though, you are a bit in their hands - are you going to continue using them for before and after school when she starts school? If it continues, you could ask to meet with the manager.

HOWEVER I would also advise you to try really really hard not to over focus on this. You allude to it making you feel like a bad mother. Our girls are the shape they are, more or less, and ALL of them need feeding enough and not too much, not to make them thin but to make sure they grow and develop and thrive and feel confident in the body they are in. I was once in a place when I felt others would be judging me similarly. Then I looked at a very sound brilliant mother I know who has three daughters of varying sizes. I have two of varying sizes. Did I think she was overfeeding just one of them? Of course she wasn't, they were just growing differently. I have watched her daughters grow and they are all beautiful and successful and they use their bodies for dance and sport and acting and singing and are a credit to her parenting. So yes, take note of what the health visitor says, but it says nothing about you or your daughter.

I think SafeToCross gives excellent advice - focus on JUST the toast (partly because it is pretty empty, nutritionally) as then it is easy for your Keyworker to try her best to implement your wishes. Don't make it complicated! I hope you get results and it doesn't overshadow your life. I think you are absolutely, absolutely right to (a) be worried, and (b) do something about it. It will almost certainly right itself of its own accord, but for your peace of mind you need to feel that you tried to help the situation rather than just sat back because you didn't want to annoy people.

Could you make her a little more active instead if you can't change the food at school

Increased activity does not reduce weight. Even most marathon runners don't lose weight (and not because muscle weighs more than fat - it does, but only slightly).

Exercise is fab for many reasons but it will not lead to weight loss unless really extreme (which would be inappropriate for a young child) or unless calorie intake is controlled.

The more I think about this, the more unfair it seems, not sure why OP needs to alter the way she feeds her family or enforce a new excercise regime on her DD because the nursery keep feeding their kids unhealthily. 5 whole slices of toast is pretty poor show. I would do as others have suggested and speak to the manager about it, s/he must know that that is not a responsible way to feed children.
Good luck OP, if you manage to crack this, the other parents will thank you!