To use the disabled loo when I'm with my son?

[RestingBitch]

My sons 9 months and obviously still in his pushchair. The majority of the time it's just me and him when I go into town/visit places. When I need the loo I get an attack of conscious, I normally use the disabled loo so I can bring him in with me.
Can't use a regular loo as I can't get him in the cubicle in his chair. Don't want to take him out of his pushchair and plonk him on the floor as the floors are manky and he will eat whatever is on the floor. He'll also probably try and crawl under the gap and interrupt someone else. Don't really like the idea of leaving him in his pushchair whilst I nip in the cubicle, so providing there isn't someone waiting for the disabled loos, AIBU to use them? I'm usually in and out and so far I've never encountered anyone waiting for one, or the impatient rattle of the door. If I am being unreasonable, short of pissing myself what's the options?

Not a troll, and don't work for any newspapers :).

*I think this has been covered...But forgotten

There are changing areas for babies on most disabled toilets. Which implies it's actually ok

It could actually imply that the changing table is in the disabled toilet so a disabled baby can have a nappy changed. And that a disabled parent can change their child's nappy.

I am disabled. You are not. Your child is not a disability. YABU.

Parking space use is different as the car is left there for a longer time, that applies to both child and disabled spaces

No, it's the same principle. Using a place designated specifically for another group of people just because it's too tricky to use an ordinary one. In fact, using a disabled toilet because it's "too tricky" has a far greater effect on the people the space I see designed for.

I guess that answers my question though, it's fine to use things when it's not you that will be inconvenienced.

I disagree toilets and parking are not the same the difference with a toilet is that need can be immediate, with parking a car could be left in a space for a considerable amount of time.

If it is so "a disabled parent can change their child's nappy" they didn't think it through. Shoulder height when I'm in my chair (and I'm tall!) isn't really practical for that!
I changed nappies on my lap, and once they were toddlers, they went in pull ups so I could put them on them standing up.

As I say on every thread that relates to planning. Architects should have to spend a week in a wheelchair (other disabilities are available!) when designing any facilities

The ratio of disabled people to non-disabled is very low, so it's highly unlikely you are going to see queues or massive use of a disabled toilet. I don't see it as a problem to use them if you are quick and mindful of the fact a disabled person could need to use it whilst you are in there. In fact, at our local Tesco, the baby changing area has been out of action for the last month, and staff actively advise parents with babies to use the disabled toilet.

The ratio of parents with prams to disabled people is high. So what happens if every parent thinks it's okay to pop in as they can't see anyone waiting who "looks disabled"?

It's not the ratio that's a problem. What's a problem is someone in there and a disabled person with a bowel, bladder problem needs to use the toilet with urgency or face soiling themselves in public, but they can't use the loo because someone is in there with a child in a pushchair, because they think the ratio of able:disabled people is low so they'll be fine
because they'll only be a few minutes

The accessible toilets have the same principle as the P&C parking spaces - as in they were designed for access but anyone can use them.

I've seen many P&C threads where people tell mothers not to act 'entitled' and that anyone can use them. I agree (except for the 'entitled' bit) that they should be used by anyone that needs the extra space/proximity to store etc the same as I agree accessible toilets should be used by anyone who needs them. That's what they're made for.

Why is there so much animosity towards women (and it's always women) with children on these threads? PFB gets thrown about so much as an insult.

If the toilets were for disabled access only I would agree that's what they should be used for, same with blue badge spaces, bus spaces etc. Until they are, then you can't really complain that they're being used for the purpose they're made for Which is access for those that need it.

I can't realistically take him into the cubicle. Firstly there isn't the space, secondly he won't sit on the floor without trying to shuffle of.

And

They also can't juggle one or two babies and a handbag into the micro cubicles that you find in most toilets nowadays.

How do you think a disabled adult manages in a tiny cubicle if there isn't even enough room for a 70cm baby?
Because we have to if you're the DM (Darling Mummy or Definitely Mumtitled) already in there.
I have to juggle everything and force myself, my 2 crutches and my huge change-bag into the tiny cubicle.

In this case mine is definitely bigger than yours - spare adult shoes and outfits won't fit in a clutch.
I don't take a spare pair of shoes because I love, love shoes, I need them.

Have either of you actually seen a baby - they're so tiny?

ItsNever, I asked upthread, could you link to that legislation? I've never seen it and would love to have something to refer to. Thanks :)

(Note - I am quite sure every post of mine says parent, not mum)

Im confused is a accessable toliet and disabled toliet different? How would i know difference and surely accessable means for someone who needs to access ?

beyond I wasn't singling you out, apologies if you thought so.

I'm on my phone at a rugby match (with only portaloos, no accessible toilets here!) but I will find the legislation, or you can look on your local councils website where it should be.

If you read upthread, there's a poster who designs these toilets, who has stated more than once that they are not for the sole use of disabled patrons. The universal 'disabled' symbol doesn't mean disabled only, it just means that there is access for people with disabilities, and there are so many things that are recognised as disabilities these days, like mental health conditions (including post natal depression if it affects your every day life) which is why the law has to be so hazy.

People claim that accessible means "accessible for everyone" (even when there is other provision for able-bodied/babychanging) though I've never seen any proof of this. I'd be happy to see the proof if it exists, so I know where I need to focus my energies to enact change :)

Really accessible is just a nicer way of saying disabled (plus pedantically, if a toilet is disabled then it is out of order)

Ive always genuinely thought it meant for people with access issues which is what i am with baby and buggy i dont think it means access for anyone else their wouldnt be a point in having onr and main toliets.

GardenGeek stated that where there is one toilet it is accessible to all. That isn't what I am asking. I'm asking for examples like the OPs where there are men's/ladies/babychange separate (I assume the kind without a toilet), but she chose to use the disabled/accessible toilet

'I've never come across a queue'.
I have and I've shit myself.
It's empty 90% of the time.
I may need it the 10% of the time. If someone is in there I may shit myself.
By the way, using a normal queue for those with continence issues.

1. We may not be able to wait that long.
2. We need an area big enough to get washed and changed.
3. We need a sink, not across the way from the cubicle but right in there with us.

I think what this thread shows is that there is a dire shortage of public toilets that are accessible to parents with pushchairs. This is what we need to make a fuss about.

I don't use disabled loos when out with my kids. I do know the location of every loo in my town that I could get a buggy into (not many!). Otherwise I just had to leave them outside the cubicle for a minute. Yes they may cry, but it takes seconds to have a wee. They won't be damaged by you leaving their sight for a few seconds and will eventually get used to it. I used to go in the cubicle furthest from the door, and could always see the buggy under the door. I doubt anyone will run away with a crying baby while you're in there for a few secs.

It does get trickier when they are out of the buggy. Many times I've had to wee whilst trying to stop my kids from touching everything in the cubicle, opening the door and giving a full narrative of what I'm doing to the other loo users . It's even trickier for father's when they are in the same situation.

Disability on www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/6

What ‘substantial’ and ‘long-term’ mean
‘substantial’ is more than minor or trivial, eg it takes much longer than it usually would to complete a daily task like getting dressed
‘long-term’ means 12 months or more, eg a breathing condition that develops as a result of a lung infection

MH issues do count but 'Regular' PND is stretching the definition a tad. And I have had pre and post natal depression before "you don't understand" gets posted.

I only use disabled in an emergency (big queue and desperate child!) and when my child was super small
Even then I felt rude as I am perfectly aware I shouldn't

Oh I hate this subject. I am disabled but my disabilities are mostly hidden. However I am also a single parent to my DD who is still n a pushchair!! I get SUCH grief (or at least very funny looks) when I come out. To the point where now, I just avoid it as best I can. I wish my Blue Badge came with an additional card to carry that I can produce whenever needed to 'prove' I have a disability....

(Just, have a look at an "access card" :) )

Btw, I assume anyone coming out of the toilet has a hidden disability and smile at them. Hopefully if they shouldn't be there, they'll just feel damn guilty. If they had a hidden disability, I hope my reaction helped a little

ktown why not just ask if you can go to the front of the queue? That's happened lots of times when I've been out and about. People understand.