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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Not sure what to do re FIL comment

97 replies

BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 11:19

At the weekend, we went to see my PIL. Nice discussion and then FIL started to go on at how it was really necessary to do something about all those immigrants as the uk was invaded and there was only 60% of true English in the country anymore. Followed by 'oh but I don't mean you'.

I am from a European country and have been here for 20 years, married with his ds for 19.... we have two dcs who have a dual citizenship (so really his comment could easily apply to the dcs too)

MIL tried her best to save the whole thing by mentioning invasions by the vikings etc... Grin (I think she was horrified). I just went quiet.

Now this is playing in my mind. DH has brushed all that under the carpet. But somehow I'm dreading going back to see them. We rarely talk about politics and they've never expressed any views like this. this has rattled me though....

OP posts:
ChasedByBees · 08/05/2017 11:26

I'm sorry you had that experience. The fact is, he does mean you. That 60% is everyone not born in England, isn't it? How many of the 60% is he planning on excluding? And if he doesn't mean you, then what criteria is he using to justify who is acceptable and who is not? Wouldn't be race by any chance would it?

(And how many rhetorical questions can I ask in one post?)

Radishal · 08/05/2017 11:26

He was a jerk.
I would say "Welcome to post-Brexit world where it's ok to say ignorant nonsense like this". However, I suspect he was probably always prone to saying this stuff and now feels comfortable enough to say it for whatever reason.
I'm sorry. I've heard shit like this too and try not to get into that sort of conversation with people who say it, even close family.

BarbarianMum · 08/05/2017 11:27

Ouch - it's not good when people reveal what they've been thinking all along, is it? My parents are (European) immigrants but obviously you can't tell that by looking at me, so i get this quite a lot. Personalky I'd not let my dh brush this under the carpet - he needs to be telling his dad in no uncertain terms that he was offensive as fuck and if he wants to be seeing his "tainted" DiL and grandchildren again he needs to keep his trap shut.

To be fair though, he may really have placed you in the "exceptions" category. My arsehole brother once went on a similar rant til i pointed out we were both "foriegn scum" by his definition. Some people are just stupid.

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 11:29

I know...
No issue with race (we are all white) but yes it does make me wonder.
I have to say the first thing that came to my mind was that the 60% was rubbish!

I can't decide if I should just forget about it or if I ought to kick a fuss.
It does make me feel unwelcome when I thought I was fully welcome iyswim. :(

OP posts:
Chloe84 · 08/05/2017 11:30

I would not go to his house again.

Leave DH to see visit his FIL on his own.

You'll probably get people telling you he is only prejudiced, a xenophobic, etc, but he clearly means you're alright because you're not 'brown'.

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 11:33

We've had some strange conversation with BIL and SIL too looking all surprised that I wasn't British (why sound I? I didn't need to become British to stay in the UK. Well not until recently....). So they seem to suddenly realise that all the stuff about European actually meant ME and US (because if things were going so bad I had to leave the uk, it also mean the dcs and DH leaving the uk).

It's like all of them are completely naive about a situation that should be quite close to them.

Radish yes I with people I don't know well. But as it is my PIL, it feels different somehow.

OP posts:
Radishal · 08/05/2017 11:34

What does your partner say to him? I have to choose my battles (similar situation to you). If I think a person is open to reason, I will try it. My mum's mates were al Daily Fail readers and full of this shit. Both Mum and Dad were from white European immigrant/refugee families- different parts of Europe). My mum sort of "fell in with this old biddy racist " crowd.
A bit of gentle reminders turned her away from this view point and she voted Remain shortly before she died. She had voted UKIP before, ffs.

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 11:39

DH sais nothing. He sort of jumped very half heartily in MIL bandwagon and basically changed the subject.

I think I need to have a chat with him.....

OP posts:
PenelopeFlintstone · 08/05/2017 11:43

He could love you dearly as an individual but still be concerned about immigration.

HazelBite · 08/05/2017 11:45

My brother (married to a very lovely Thai lady) was ranting on about how "all these immigrants come into this country and take our jobs".
I laughed out loud at him and reminded him (in front of his wife) that his wife was an immigrant by marriage!
I really despair when I hear things like this, my parents who went through the 2nd world war were so thrilled to become part of Europe in the 70's, they felt it would create peace and harmony within Europe.
Its all so sad.

Radishal · 08/05/2017 11:46

There's concern about immigration and being an ignoramous. I'm concerned about immigration. I'm from an immigrant/refugee background. I'm not a ridiculous twat about it.

Chloe84 · 08/05/2017 11:50

Who are the 'true English', anyway, Penelope?

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 12:02

Being concerned with immigration isn't the saying that going inn about being invaded.

And fwiw, there is only 13% of people in the uk are born abroad (that includes some British people). So nowhere near 40%. Unless you consider that people who are born from parents who are immigrants can be 'really' English??
How far do you need to go back to be 'really' British?

OP posts:
user1471506380 · 08/05/2017 12:09

I suggest FIL does the Ancestry genetics test! He may well get a surprise. Most Brits are a mix. Not trivializing what he said, which was rude and horrible.

tinytemper66 · 08/05/2017 12:20

So when he said English did he discount the rest of UK or did he mean England and the other home nations?

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 12:21

No idea... TBH the discussion wasn't even on immigration or anything remotely 'sensitive'.
And MIL was very good at changing the subject too....

OP posts:
YNK · 08/05/2017 12:24

I had to block the most right wing fascist woman on FB.
She posted some absolutely vile stuff about immigrants.
She's American, lol

Clawhammer · 08/05/2017 12:38

There is only so much you can censure your DH for saying nothing when you also said nothing though. It is difficult to know what to say when you're blindsided like that, but perhaps he was too, and embarrassed.

it's a shame there wasn't a quick "well no, you did mean me and your grandchildren" at the time. Bringing the subject up again after it's been dropped would be playing for higher stakes. Talk to DH about what you want to achieve, and how you'll play next time you see him. Though you might find he is on better behaviour from now on, which I know doesn't make it all better.

blankmind · 08/05/2017 13:02

At the risk of getting flamed, I'd suggest when FIL says "Immigrants" he is thinking of the lazy, feckless workshy people who only want to come to this country to exploit our social security system, have a 'free' house and all that goes with it without any intention of ever paying into the community or being part of our culture. Basically freeloaders who are just taking the mickey and yes, I know some of the indigenous population also do the same.

Maybe we need a different description for all the lovely hardworking people who come here and integrate and enrich all our lives, OP included in that, because I'm pretty sure he didn't mean to include the OP in his rants and he specifically said he didn't mean her.

Immigrants as a term does seem to mean so many different things to different people when they express a negative opinion, maybe it's time to ask exactly which sections of our society someone means when they say immigrants.

Justanothernameonthepage · 08/05/2017 13:11

Buy your DH one of those ancestry testing kits. Then next time "I was so surprised when he turned out to have German/Indian/Spanish DNA. I guess that your ancestors must have come from all over. Still, since those Romans invaded, there's never really been anyone you could call 'true English'. Cup of Tea anyone?"

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 08/05/2017 13:24

Since the Romans came ; those bloody foreigners! No the real definition of anyone British is anyone who can trace their ancestry back to when the English Channel became a sea and not a causeway to the continent. Grin
Mind you his remark suggests to me he may be a product of in- breeding! Grin

Original poster
BluePeppers · 08/05/2017 13:30

Well seeing the very blond/white hair that both him and DH have, I suspect a strong connection with the vikings!!

OP posts:
Beansonapost · 08/05/2017 13:38

So you're all white...

Followed by 'oh but I don't mean you'

I suppose he only means the black/brown people.

By the sounds of it, it would seem it's not the first time MIL & DH have had to change the subject...

itsawonderfulworld · 08/05/2017 13:48

At the risk of getting flamed, I'd suggest when FIL says "Immigrants" he is thinking of the lazy, feckless workshy people who only want to come to this country to exploit our social security system, have a 'free' house and all that goes with it without any intention of ever paying into the community or being part of our culture. Basically freeloaders who are just taking the mickey and yes, I know some of the indigenous population also do the same.

Ok, I'll bite. Can you provide some statistics please as to exactly who you mean by that rant? You do know that this doesn't apply to EU immigrants, right? Because as a group we contribute a lot more to the economy than we take out, and EU citizens were never able to come here to "freeload" but actually had to be working and paying taxes or be supported by a partner or studying ? We've never been able to just "come to this country to exploit our social security system" - nor would we have wanted to, as surprise, surprise, many of our countries of origin have much better systems in place. We came here because the UK was seen as a global, outward-looking country where we could make a life for ourselves while making a positive contribution. Guess we were wrong.

itsawonderfulworld · 08/05/2017 13:54

Maybe we need a different description for all the lovely hardworking people who come here and integrate and enrich all our lives, OP included in that, because I'm pretty sure he didn't mean to include the OP in his rants and he specifically said he didn't mean her.

One more thing: attitudes like yours is EXACTLY why I no longer want to stay here, even though I've made my life here for the past 20 years (all my adult life). Every time someone says to me "oh, we didn't mean you - you're the RIGHT kind of immigrant" it just makes it clearer that this is not a community I want to be part of. Luckily my DH and children all have dual passports so we have options. My children are have repeatedly said that they are ashamed of their British passports.

OP, I'm so sorry for you that you have people like the poster that I've quoted in your family. In your shoes, I couldn't see them again and wouldn't let the children near them either.