AIBU to not understand why "normal" people vote Tory?

[olddogsnewtricks]

OK, so I'll probably get flamed for this but am genuinely interested! All the people I know who vote Tory are pretty well off so use private schools and healthcare. As a family we need the NHS and we need a good education system - and I can't see them getting any better under the Tories. Are these just not priorities for Tory voters or do they really believe they will improve even with a Conservative government?

*The NHS is currently in its worst state ever. The Conservatives don't want the NHS to continue. They want it to cease to exist.

the NHS ever been as close to non existence as it is now

if it's all sold off to private companies.

There are areas of the UK where people who have children with complex needs now have to wait 18 months for a hospital appointment since their services have been sold to Virgin.*

So where's your evidence to back up these claims Lottie?

Those of us 'normal' people who have to earn the money that pay our countries bills have an intimate understanding of how important it is to live within our means. And the UK is not living within its means.

We would all like to have more but the reality is we dont. No its not down the back of the sofa, their isn't a secret vault in the treasury or a Chinese sugar daddy bailing us out.

JC is talking about spending money like he is Santa, luckily of course most people have grown out of that fantasy. But voters on benefits or employed by the state never have to generate wealth so just dont get the blood sweat and tears that teach you not to spend what you dont have and are susceptible to the JC xmas fantasy.

Normal people vote Tories because "When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a woman, I put away childish things".

So we all need to either, pay a lot more tax (no one wants that), do more with less (the Tory idea), stop spending as much (no one likes that) or stick our fingers in our ears and sing La La JC.. La La JC... La La Jeremy Corbyn.

The NHS will cease to exist and we will end up having to pay for everything like in the US.

Again where are you getting this from? Where in the conservative manifesto is the bit about privatising the NHS? You realise Labour started PFI initiatives right?

Holly - ffs read my posts. The evidence is there. It's not speculation.

I feel that Labour did spend money on unnecessary things but anyone who believes Tory cuts to the weak and vulnerable are not ideological you're in denial. There has to be a middle ground.

Yes the PFI initiatives were one of those indications that Tony Blair was not really a creature of the Labour Party.

'Normal people vote Tories because "When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a woman, I put away childish things"'

Wow, how patronising.

And theres why i hate Tories:

Those of us 'normal' people who have to earn the money that pay our countries bills have an intimate understanding of how important it is to live within our means.

Have none of you seen the headlines about elderly people being stuck in hospital for weeks or months because social care has been cut so much that they cannot be discharged due to there being no care for them at home? That isn't actually the fault of the NHS but it has a knock on effect of reducing the number of beds available to those that need them.

I do agree about PFI.

Getting to a middle ground is the right thing to do as there is no such thing as an empty pit of money.

What it equates to is which party do you think is more aligned with that. Personally I think labour is too much spend now and worry later (and yes I have voted for them in the past). I now prefer a more cautious approach hence why I voted conservative last time (for the first time ever) and why I will vote for them again this time.

Anon1234567890 And right there we have the reason why people really, really dislike Tories as well as disagreeing with them.

Austerity stops the economy from growing and hasnt actually reduced the deficit.

Whats not to like

ffs read my posts. The evidence is there. It's not speculation.

Well so far its an anecdote not evidence, I have also never heard of any Tory saying we should not have a free at the point of entry NHS, so why is it that any mention of NHS automatically equates to the US style? There are many more successful models used across europe.

I'll see if I can find it but there is a fantastic article floating around above why austerity doesn't work and why running a country is completely different to managing a household budget so all the platitudes spouted about living within your means and ciutting your cloth accordingly are meaningless when talking about managing an economy.

Yes. People suck it up though

Lottie

Ah I've read your posts and found plenty of opinion but no evidence. You just keep saying you think the NHS is rubbish and going to be privatised but I want to know where the Tories have committed to that. It's a fair question, yes?

Have none of you seen the headlines about elderly people being stuck in hospital for weeks or months because social care has been cut so much that they cannot be discharged due to there being no care for them at home?

Yes I am sure we all have. But social care is provided/brokered by local authorities not the NHS. So if we move the debate to being about social care funding issues then I fully agree it is a problem and needs a solution. But let's not pretend the whole NHS is shit because of an issue it has no control over. It certainly has knock on effects but there is still good care happening out there.

Holly

So you think the NHS is not being sold to companies like Virgin? That's up to you. But I'm telling you it's happening. It's not my opinion. Privatisation is something the conservatives do and always have done. I'm surprised people don't remember the 80s tbh.

The NHS is not rubbish - it's one of the things I love about the UK which is why it makes me mad that the current government wants it gone.

Here's your evidence (some)

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2016/nov/11/virgin-care-700m-contract-200-nhs-social-care-services-bath-somerset

Here is what is happening to one person who now has to rely on Virgin

'Three days before a consultant appointment we waited 6 months for, we received this letter. I called the hospital who refused to speak to me. They just told me to speak to Virgin Care. You can't speak to Virgin Care. Only leave voice mails to which they don't respond. I wrote a letter to which they responded. I got an initial assessment appointment and again have heard nothing since. I still haven't seen a consultant. In all since seeking a referral from my GP it has been 18 months. This is the new Tory Health care. And it is targeted at your children.'

Here is some more evidence.

www.wiltshiretimes.co.uk/news/15223166.Mum_claims_severely_disabled_girl__put_in_danger__by_Virgin_Care_after_NHS_transfer/?ref=fbshr

YY Lottie I just found that on fb after seeing tweets about it. I was going to copy and paste but you beat me to it.

"BMW6 Fri 21-Apr-17 06:39:32
helenadove But if you have no viable means to wash long, thick hair why wouldn't you cut it short? You could then sell it to a wig maker for extra £££ so it's a win-win"

Now you sound like a jealous old woman.

Baby boomer right?

I have private medical care through work so I have accessed both NHS and private.
I don't get all the scary arm waving about when a small section like that is managed privately as long as the care is administered.

And let's face it, you find people going to the papers complaining about their care in the NHS under both major parties. No one sensible would say something as big as health care will get it right every time for everyone but that does not mean that it is a disaster.