To think this is really underhand of MIL?

[Realitea]

Currently staying with IL's for a few days. Mil wants dc to stay without the rest of us for a bit longer to spend some time together. Dh told her yesterday it's up to dc and we were planning on asking them later today. Mil said she would not put any pressure on them at all.
This morning I heard mil asking dc herself and when they said they'd rather go home she kept quietly talking them into it until they decided they will stay. Whispering in the ear, bribing.. I am really angry about this! Who do I speak to? Dc/mil or dh? Or do I just let it go?

Completely unforgivable.

Realitea you are an absolutely bloody brilliant mum

Sweetheart you need to look out for yourself. What your h has said is unforgivable. Get your ducks in a row and get any and all plans in place for your future

There is nothing terrible about hiding upset from your DCs, especially when the last time you'd seen them they were upset. He's an arse of the highest order.

If he wants to sweep this under the carpet you have to insist on counselling.

For both of you and for him alone.

Otherwise it really should be game over for you even if he says he wants to try again.

You and your DC cannot be put in this position over and over.

In all this sorry saga, you are the only one to have put the children first.
Given his melodramatic behaviour tonight it's clear he doesn't even know how to do that, but that's what he has learned from his mother.
I'm sorry he's chosen this course of childish behaviour OP but don't internalise it. It's not you in the wrong here.

My guess is there was a phonecall where DH & MIL discussed how when it came time to leave you were lingering and the children were getting upset, because it appeared like you didn't want to leave.

In her view the children wanted to stay, this may be something DH shares, because you were unhappy you projected the emotions onto them. Which led to DH sitting in the car waiting and you dithering, obviously appearing unhappy, which made the children unhappy.

They might have discussed how MIL intentions were merely to give both of you time together, free from parenting. He's asserted that you weren't able to do much at all to utilise that time. MIL would have suggested the children were fine after a brief time, but what occurred upon leaving really didn't help the situation, leaving the children confused and slightly off.

DH could even have mentioned the argument on the way home, how you spent the night rather upset, with MIL asserting it was one/two nights. She ruined what should have been a relaxing time for DH and yourself. He then added how you said you heard her bribing the children into staying, which was point blank refuted, with an addendum if she heard that why wasn't I confronted.

The children had a great time, there was nothing to be concerned about. It's just a shame that this opportunity for free time was interrupted with theatrical hysterics.

DH has been left with the impression that you were being precious over the children, when it boils down to it he's a baby-maker / bread winner, you have no interest in him.

This is just assertions of course, but I can imagine it being turned from you being a mother missing her children, to something entirely different.

I hope you are able to sort this, I don't feel like you'll be able to put your foot down about MIL. But wish you luck, it sounds awful.

Thankyou ohforfoxache - it's really happening on Saturday- can't believe it xxxx Thankyou xxxx
Catrina1234 - yes I'll be away a week- but stressing because she'll be there and I won't- I've never asked my husband to be horrible just to keep her at bay at the most private time of my life . She is hard hard work lol .

Please don't panic from his wedding ring being removed. You are currently being manipulated here by your husband. He needs you to get back in your box because he cannot change anyone else.

Of course you are not a terrible mother. What an utterly stupid argument.

You said before all this trouble was still beneath the surface, and you have come close to splitting before. This is not on you.

You are right, he will not see things differently and you will always be where the blame will be put. You are not the most valuable woman in your husbands life.

But you are a role model to your children, and the most valuable lesson in self worth, boundaries and behaviour will come from you.

I certainly am the only one putting the children first YNK. I think the only one important to him and his family is the mil. They can twist it however they like to try to punish me but I'm the only one looking out for them and what they want.
When I think more about what he's said the more it doesn't add up. So either mil has been lying or he's making it up.

Yes, agree with Fairytales it will have gone something like that. MIL will have loved that you spent the night in the spare room too. I think if he's going to share private stuff/conversations with her, you have quite a job on your hands. Best to let the dust settle tonight, I think. Most men ime hate being asked to revisit a conversation over and over again once there's been a row. How much contact does he have with MIL in the normal course of things? Will you be able to talk more calmly tomorrow or later in the week without her input being quite so recent?

I'm sorry but after reading the whole thread him removing his wedding ring is a massive blessing and I'd take him up on the offer of a permanent removal.

He's a prize idiot your better off without.

I doubt he'll be calm for a while but we shall see. Anything that involves his mother is a massively sensitive issue because of her power over him. I can't really see any going back after this as I will never want to see her again and I'd remember how h called me a terrible mother.
Then there would be the problem of him carrying on leaving dcs there without my permission if we did split up. I wouldn't be able to protect them at all then would I? I'm buggered either way

That is an awful thing to say to you, and it could well be the start of the end.

But - as a PP said - you do all seem to be caught up in the drama. Not that it is an excuse for what he said, but your behaviour last night (the row, crying, spare room) rather than just saying 'no, they are coming home' is a bit puzzling. And involving a friend is the strangest thing of all! You can't expect a third party to solve all your problems, it is down to you.

Because if I'd said no they're coming home, it would've lead to exactly this which was what I was trying to avoid.
I felt I had no choice with calling my friend. It was either that or the police. It had got way too out of control.

Well OP I think your dh needs to calm down but it sounds like it's a rocky marriage anyway. I think however he could be right about his mother not trying to say anything untoward to your children. It didn't sound like you really heard and assumed the worst. I don't get why some of you mums don't want the kids to spend some time with their GM.

I haven't read all the thread and of course there are all the anti MIL posters piling in. I often wonder if these women have bad r/ships with their MILs so assume yours is the same as theirs. Anyone trying to offer a different point of view is told they are one of the "MILs can do no wrong" tribe and that's not fair - it's just as easy to say "DILs can do no wrong" when of course it's a problem for the DIL and MIL. I just wish posters would accept that. There are some terrible MILs and equally terrible DILs.

IF you do split up you have equal rights to the children and will need to make some arrangements for their care. and if you can't sort it out then it will need to go the Family Court for a decision.

Everyone is busy calling your H all sorts of things, when they have NO idea of his character, but then he's you MIL's son isn't he, so that's a good enough reason.

Op don't jump too far ahead....wait until the dust has settled.

He s betrayed you royally but I doubt you'll be thinking straight right now through anger. If wait till the morning and then get yourself a cuppa and start thinking up a plan.

It doesn't seem like there can be any going back - he has accused you of lying and insulted your parenting which is just spiteful.

As for visits YOU decide when they see grandma and where.

But just maybe sleep on all this so you can keep things clear

Catrina, I very clearly heard mil ask the dcs if they wanted to stay. Hey very clearly said no. Mil then repeated what they'd said. After a pause she then tried to sway their decision three times. I also saw her whispering in their ear and the dcs looking very awkwardly back at me.
I have a good feeling she knew I'd twigged what was going on and she is denying it all. H believes her denial of this.

MissesBloom, do you know what I could do if he took them anyway? I don't think I'd have much of a say what he did with his time looking after them if we separated. I could tell him no but he wouldn't have to listen.

Yes, I too would have difficulty moving beyond what has been said tonight, OP, unless he makes a fulsome retraction and apology, which seems unlikely. Refusing to see her again is not unreasonable, imo, though others here will make you feel like the devil's spawn for taking a hardline position. You are right, of course, that you will have less control over her contact with your DCs is you split up with him, but there are only so many hours in the month, and in all likelihood your time with, and influence over, the DCs will be by far the greatest of anyone's. Weighed against all of that is how they will be affected by living in a marital home where dad totally disrespects mum and isn't afraid to make that plain on a daily basis. He is the problem here, not you.

I think, catrina, if you can't be bothered to read the thread, you perhaps aren't very qualified to comment on how valid other posts are.

Not sure the legalities of it but it seems like they live 100s of miles away so you surely would have the right to say no to that? If he took them against my wishes it would be the last time.

What would happen if you phoned mil and had all this out with her btw? Putting dh aside as he's kind of made his bed...but what if you rang her and called her out on all of it? Just thinking she could explain why she felt going behind your back was acceptable?

Oh ffs, clear off Catrina. You've been bothering so many threads today with your snide and contrary crap.

Either read the thread properly or bore off.

Catrina - rtft before you make your very judgemental comments.

This could have been me fifteen years ago. I was a terrible mother, MIL never did anything wrong and it was always me either lying or imagining it. One day she cocked up and bitched about me to my than adult child. DH finally saw it. Fifteen years of shit and finally he realised. Oh I did a happy dance that day.

I've been wonderfully NC with her since and frankly it's bliss. I have a drama free life. DH visits alone and the now adult DC's occasionally, but as they are also now wise to the behaviour it's not as regular as it was.

How you handle things now is up to you. Personally if I could have my time again I'd have cut her out years ago, whether my marriage or yours would survive that is I guess dependent on the DH.
I feel for you. The frustration of having a relationship that seems to involve three people is immense. You do have distance in your favour though, something I did not.
I wish you luck x

I can't see how you could police how and with whom they spend time during access visits to their father, unless there were, for instance, serious allegations of abuse. Once the children are older, they would be in a position to refuse visits themselves, but anything of that kind would have to go through the court, I believe (I have no direct experience). But equally, if you were the resident parent and spent most time with them, you would be far better placed to talk to them candidly about MIL's behaviour and how unhealthy their dad's relationship with her is, and address any worries or incidents, ensure their self-esteem isn't damaged by her shenanigans, etc, than you are ever likely to be while your DH is in the picture arguing with everything you say.

What on earth was going on that you had to call in a third party to calm things down? Was there threatened or actual violence?
If so, you have a greater issue than an underhand mil.