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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Awkward situation with friend and her son

122 replies

ahatlikeprincessmarina · 13/04/2017 10:08

My DS has been friends with a boy, R, since they were 5/6 (they're now 11 and 12). R was diagnosed with Aspergers about a year ago and the family have been having a difficult time with him – refusing school and things like that. My DS is more or less his only friend. His mum and I quite often do reciprocal childcare, but it does piss me off that whereas I give her plenty of notice if I'm asking her to have my DC, she will often ask the night before, or even on the actual day if I can look after her two. Some people are fine with this, but I just like a bit more notice.

So again she's asked me to have her DC tomorrow as she has to work – a course that she was signed up for that she didn't realise was right in the middle of the Easter holidays. She also phoned me to ask rather than texting (several missed calls until she got hold of me, and no message left), which I feel puts me on the spot makes it more difficult for me to say no. The awkward bit is that while my DS likes going round to her house to play with R, he really REALLY doesn't like R coming here. He feels there is less to do here, R gets bored and he feels this huge responsibility to entertain him while R is going 'no, that's boring' ... 'don't want to do that' etc. So DS has been crying today at the prospect of R coming tomorrow. It's just not fair on him, I know – but the family are struggling with R and I feel that maybe I should suck it up. I think I will hoik up my courage and ask the mum if she can please give me more notice, but it also grates on me a bit that she thinks my DS loves having his friend to play, when actually he dreads it Sad. I'd feel guilty at making any references to DS not liking having R round, as I feel like it would be beating them when they're down, but at the same time I know she thinks DS would love having R round any time.

I guess I've kind of worked this out for myself just by writing it down here – i.e. ask her to give me more notice, but keep quiet about DS's feelings. But if anyone's been in a similar situation I'd be grateful for any thoughts?

OP posts:
AnnieAnoniMouse · 13/04/2017 16:59

You need to talk to your DS.

It's ridiculous that he's crying about 'R' spending the days at yours then gleefully skipping over to their house.

I 'get' the fact that 'R' has 'stuff' that your DS doesn't & they're allowed unlimited screentime there but not at yours and that's why he prefers going there, but to the point he's CRYING over it? There has to be more to it?!

11yo old here prefers to go to friend x's than have her come here because she has a gymnastics area & a ton of equipment (we don't have the space) and she prefers to go to another friends because she 'has her own pony, in her own paddock, right next to the house' < you have to imagine that in 11 yo squeal! We don't even have a goldfish. But when the girls come here I try do things they're not able/allowed/encouraged (like baking, making candles or messy art stuff) to do at home, so they enjoy it, even if the 11yo would prefer to go to theirs! She will ask if she can't go there instead, but that's it. When I say 'No, it's definitely our turn to have her/them here' she accepts that and if it's due to 'childcare' rather than just because she wouldn't even ask. We had a friends 5 & 12 year old boys last week because their Dad needed some childcare, they play for a bit then all do their own thing. It's childcare, not an arrangement made for their benefit. I think that's a distinction you need to make too.

fuzzyfozzy · 13/04/2017 17:08

I'd ignore her phone calls, if she rings a few times get your spider sense tingling. Text her to ask if she's ok, but sorry you can't ring her.
Hopefully she'll text you and you can have time to think

ahatlikeprincessmarina · 13/04/2017 17:23

Annie, I think TheCakes had it by saying R is just easier on his own turf. The pressure DS feels to entertain is real. Hence my post –I knew I needed to do something about it.

fuzzy in fact this time, she eventually texted, asking me to phone her, so I thought something might be wrong that she needed to talk about. I should have guessed it was a request to have the kids. Will be prepared next time.

I still don't quite get why this request had to be so short notice –surely if she'd been accepted onto this course she'd have had a confirmation at least a few days before – and she may have explained this on the phone last night but my ire was rising so I wasn't taking things in properly. But if it genuinely was a summons to a course at 24 hrs notice, if it had been me I would just have said I couldn't do it. Too short notice to get childcare.

OP posts:
fuzzyfozzy · 13/04/2017 18:43

Say you're visiting family, who are possibly poorly, you can't take other children
And it's easy for it to fall through so you don't actually have to go...

ahatlikeprincessmarina · 13/04/2017 19:04

Ha, fuzzy, thanks but I'm pretty sure she'd say they would just go ahead and risk it, tbh!

OP posts:
Allthewaves · 13/04/2017 19:05

Just ask her for more notice. i'm super strict on computer time but when mates are around they are all either sit on computers, palystation or ipads and play together - keeps everyone happy

purpleprincess24 · 13/04/2017 19:23

Im curious as to what course would have a lesson on Good Friday

Where will her DH be?

Are you sure they're not just having a child free day at your expense

ahatlikeprincessmarina · 13/04/2017 19:50

purple, I explained in a PP that actually, the course was today. I was trying to be a bit anonymous and vague about the details to avoid identification but it backfired!

OP posts:
CouldntMakeThisShitUp · 13/04/2017 20:42

i doubt very much it's a 'course' she's going on - more like she's got other plans but knows this excuse works on you.

she doesn't need to give you notice because she doesn't have much respect for you - as you always drop/rearrange your own plans to accomodate her.
You also never mention/call her up on it so she knows she can play that to her advantage.

The constant ringing and the text asking to call her - classic manipulator tactics.
She knows you're shit at being assertive with her verbally so she will keep putting you on the spot like this.
Now that you've seen how devious she can be, ignore her calls and respond via text .

As for her dc being 'bored' - tell him to mind his manners or get his mum to take him somewhere else.
i'm an aspie but i refuse to go round somewhere i'm going to be bored - much prefer my own company.

tweezers · 13/04/2017 20:44

""I will let her know that while I am happy to have her DC, I'd like more notice in future. I'm going to feel like a bitch, though."""

Why??? I know what you are going through!!! It feels like a cheek to say it, even though you know you are right.
But why should you feel like a bitch for making a simple request for a bit more consideration from someone you do endless favours for? It's not bitchy. Why should your concerns come second to hers?
Does she feel like a bitch when she dumps on you at short notice? Apparently not.

Give her the benefit of the doubt and try it. If nothing else you will find out how she views the whole situation.
If she's making you feel so apprehensive and wrong about saying something that simple to her then sorry but she appears to be taking advantage and you need make things clear now or it will get bigger. What is the worst that can happen?
Another poster said think of a few bomb proof phrases, that's a great idea. Best of luck.
ps. Even if the course is today, she would have known that its the day before Easter Bank holiday and therefore probably right in the middle of school hols. The first thing working mothers do is check their school holidays way in advance so that they can get their time off requests booked in. If you sign up for something, you check you're covered for childcare. Most can't afford not to. And I think if she wants you to do her last minute favours she could credit your intelligence and not tell obvious porkies. Makes it hard to trust what she says.

Whereismumhiding2 · 13/04/2017 21:11

ahat

I too hate last minute cheeky all day childcare requests like this, or the method she used. Pulling out big guns texting 'call me back urgently' when she could have said easily in text what it was about. She knew what she was doing and deliberately put you on spot. It wasn't an emergency, no hospital/A&E trips, flood/ gas leaks... A last minute course is not an emergency! Riiiighht she forgot about it....

So, please feel free, if they help, to use any of my tried&tested tactics for pausing time in phonecall last minute Childcare requests...

  1. "I'll have to check with the others what their plans are, will ring you back later. Byeee, mwah mwah" (click) (then text back if it's a no)
  1. "I can't think right now as I'm in the middle of stuff, tea, immacing... Damn.. things are burning that shouldn't be !!! Really gotta go" (click) Wink
  1. I've even resorted to opening my frontdoor and ringing my own doorbell "Oh God someone's at the door. What now? I'll ring u back later..Oh hiiiii, just on phone" (click)

Then take all the time you need to think about it, talk to DC, and decide yourself /if DC want to. It's a child coming over all day and up to them at their age. Viola, no DS crying next time. And DC can decide whether to make other plans or a cover story themselves.

If someone asks me in person, that's easy as i say, "I'll check our calendar at home and text you later if we can"

Text your reply when ready either 'Yes, can do til 5' or 'Sorry, can't do tomorrow, others have plans, luv ahat"'

I'd then be too busy to check my phone or reply for rest of evening & next day. Ps. She'd be rude if she pushed it to ask what plans they had (which is why you text reply, not ring back). And if she enquired next time i saw her, I'd look quizzical and say "God can't remember what i did yesterday let alone what kids did last week! Some kid friend stuff I'm sure, but they wouldn't want to let others down at the last minute". (See what i do there? Smile )

Hope that helps Flowers

Whereismumhiding2 · 13/04/2017 21:18

Ps. I think i use the doorbell trick too much on my family to end long phone calls GrinGrin

rookiemere · 13/04/2017 21:21

To be fair to R's DM though I don't think she is the classic user as it sounds like the OP's DS spends more time at their house than vice versa.

She just seems to be a bit of a last minute Sally. Some of DS's pals parents are like this. One confessed to ringing up the school holiday club to book for the next day, just before it closed. Goodness knows what she would have done if it had already been closed.

Also in R's DM's mind as probably the OP's DS being at their house makes life easier rather than harder as the two of them play happily together, she probably assumes this is the case in OP's house as well, therefore having R for a day is no biggie in her eyes.

OP is a planner and R's DM clearly is not. Therefore OP is totally at liberty to let her know that she needs to give her a bit more advance warning when childcare is required and say No if it's not possible at last minute, but I do think it's a bit much to make the other DM to be some sort of master manipulator.

ahatlikeprincessmarina · 13/04/2017 21:35

rookie, you're spot on - she certainly isn't a "master manipulator", and I totally believe she went on this course. She told me what it was, and she's not a liar!

being at their house makes life easier rather than harder as the two of them play happily together, she probably assumes this is the case in OP's house as well

This is exactly right - I think in some ways she even thinks she might be doing me a bit of a favour, by supplying her DC to occupy mine, as that's the way she looks at it. But I'm afraid I generally prefer my kids to myself, like hanging out with them, and want to make the most of that while I still can.

tweezers, she was a bit rambly on the phone last night but I think the jist was that it was a course that had been overbooked before and so she didn't expect to get offered a place ...so perhaps didn't look closely at the date. To try and be fair ...

Like the Immac suggestion though, Whereismum? Grin

OP posts:
Whereismumhiding2 · 13/04/2017 22:39

That's lovely ahat that she's not a user, and that it was a genuine late notice course place & ultimately you were happy to.

But she still put you on the spot on the phone for the next day, when she could've texted you & ask to let her know asap, so you could think about it. And your DS was upset you'd not asked him first.

If she wasn't such a good friend, you'd say 'No not tomorrow' soooo much easier, as you prefer to plan. It's about your peace & DS's too. I've had last minute course places offered at work, that I said no to as too late to organise childcare. That's life for course admins.

NotNowNow · 13/04/2017 23:04

I'm sorry to say but I don't think she is a master manipulator. I think it's more that you are too much of a push over and too worried about what she will think of you. Why are you worrying about making excuses and worrying about what she thinks of you. It must make life very complicated for you.

Next time she asks just say that you are sorry but you can't help out as you want to spend the day with your kids on your own. Don't elaborate and don't apologise. If necessary just keep repeating the same thing.
It's only complicated if you make it complicated.

I also think it's a bit unfair for your DS to always go to R's house and for your DS not to want him to come to yours. Is it possible that their get-together s are too long? It often suits parents for kids to spend hours and hours together where I think kids often have more fun if it's just for a couple of hours.

NotNowNow · 13/04/2017 23:06

Sorry for garbled post. not a master manipulator....

FairytalesAreBullshit · 14/04/2017 04:14

How did you get on today?

You sound a bit like me, I like to keep things relaxed, so having it sprung on you last minute almost causes a slight panic. How will I entertain R all day? What if he gets bored? Then your mind creates more and more scenarios that make you feel uncomfy.

Chances are she had childcare sorted but it was pulled at the last minute, or the course is overbooked, so she only got a place after another person dropped out at the last minute.

I do appreciate being older that when we were growing up there was a communal attitude to having children around, it was never really thought of. In those days women were SAHM and house keepers, maybe they had a part time job when DH got home, so it wasn't unusual to have DC flitting from house to house.

I totally understand that situations are a lot different now, the laissez fairs attitude to your kids being out with a trusted adult has somewhat diminished, parents take on responsibility themselves generally, never dreaming that if their DC happened to be round at tea time, so much was cooked an extra portion wasn't an issue.

I'm really lucky that being ill I have support from family who step up to look after DD & DS. They have a friend, their Mum is a bit old school in that with her DC being an only child, she welcomes extra DC round so her child has more interaction. The child child has Aspergers like issues, so having other DC around, allows her to see how he behaves, reacts and communicates with other DC. The other day spur of the moment they all went out somewhere and had a lovely time.

Ideally whilst R is good on computers, it's not healthy for it to be an all day every day thing for them. I'm sure she appreciates your routine is different, she likely hopes that R will thrive, where at times it's a struggle for you.

I don't know how today went, but in the future, if there are apparent issues, like boredom, don't feel afraid to speak to R's Mother and say we struggled to keep him focussed, my DS got a bit stressed as he didn't know what to do to help. So any guidance would be amazing.

I remember whilst both DC were having surfing lessons, it took me 3 hours to walk back up the beach as it was low tide. I was collecting shells, stones, sticks that had been in the sea etc. I asked for help as my hands were full as there was some fishing rope in pieces washed up, I just wanted help picking them up. I got speaking to the parent, their DC was highly autistic, a bit older and DD, very very clever, but was pretty much mute. The parent was with their family, the other parent was really struggling with the intensity of it all, so they had a week at home to get rest over going on holiday. I found it really interesting speaking to the parent, I knew of severely autistic adults, but never had met a child. Whilst the parent was interacting with the elder child, I tried interacting with the younger. It was an eye opener. Pretty much how lucky we were that even though I'm ill, at present both DC seem unaffected. Whilst the child was mute, they had no fear, they could tackle the most intricate of locks. Alarms had to be put on doors, even then the child knew how to disable them. The parent said it was really nice speaking to someone interested in the bigger picture, where at home parents either avoided the family, or if they tried to assist, it was unhelpful, with opinions like you just need more discipline, which obviously wasn't possible. I would say your friend sees you as an asset as you see a child not the disability, even though it's stressful for you when it's sprung on you at the 11th hour.

Maybe speaking to any of R's direct carers, I'm assuming Mum does most of it. Find out if she has counselling and support, by a professional experienced in dealing with parents of children on the ASD. I can imagine at times it feels like a whirlwind, so they overlook basic resources and services that could help.

You sound like such an amazing kind and caring person. If you want me to make some activities as a back up, even for your DC, I'm more than happy to help. My background is Management, but I did study teaching, I also studied teaching methods, home schooling etc. I don't get the chance to do what I'd like, but it would be an honour to create some materials to help parents during holidays. DC are spoilt with their own consoles, plus access to computers wherever they go, it's hard dragging them away from technology.

I don't know how old you are, but I grew up in the 70's and 80's where life was very different. You could take yourself away exploring with friends. That's not a luxury available to many now. It's a shame, it's just we're more aware of dangers and society is different now. In my day you'd be lucky to have a car per family, instead now situations where if you have older children, you can have 4 cars for one household.

So putting my thinking cap on and creating resources that would allow adventures, experimentation and discovery, but in a different environment, would be a pleasure.

Hopefully after a long day with R you could unwind with a nice bath or a treat like wine, a takeaway, ice cream, whatever your go to treat is.

I think you've highlighted, that as a society we need to look at families with disabled children, looking at being inclusive like you do so amazingly. So education and support for you is also important. For you finding out R's strengths and weaknesses, likes and dislikes, would be helpful. Again I could think of some relevant questions to ask R's Mum so you have all the information possible. If you have another situation like yesterday, you'll feel more prepared and at ease.

My DS & DD are so caring, they get that from not only growing up with my health issues, but being around friends of my parents and grandparents who are older. Such experience is invaluable.

Finally, I know some said that your DS needs to get over himself or stop being a baby. I saw a few comments like that. I don't know what support R has at his current school, but my DD accompanies her friend to sessions where they focus on different things. So the onus isn't only on the child but close friends to. It must be really hard as I'm guessing DS is due his SATs which schools go crazy over, plus it's a big responsibility being R's only friend. I guess DS could feel some what trapped. Not wanting to hurt R, but finding it challenging all the same.

Wishing you all the best for the Easter weekend. I hope you have a nice relaxing time.

claraschu · 14/04/2017 04:50

What a kind, interesting and thoughtful post Fairytales.

I came on here to say that we have a similar situation, and I was finding a lot of the posts early on a bit black and white and unkind.

My daughter's best friend from early childhood has a serious problem which means: my daughter is her only friend; this friend doesn't really like coming to our house; my daughter has had a lot of responsibility thrust on her; I have felt caught in the cross fire because her mum is a friend of mine; her mum is disorganised (and lovely). The thought of saying some of the abrupt things which were suggested early on the thread is really abhorrent and would be very unkind. Yes, our situation is difficult and not my responsibility, but equally these are wonderful people in a tough situation. They are true friends, who deserve very sensitive and caring treatment.

My daughter can find a compromise between doing exactly what she wants and feeling like she is being forced into too much of a friendship.

Oblomov17 · 14/04/2017 05:16

I'm puzzled as to why she left it to the last minute? A mum with a SN child plans meticulously, right? She must have known weeks ago about this course on a Thursday. Why didn't she arrange something? Rages not ok. In Fact it's Very odd.

You need to be firmer and say 'No. I need more notice'.

But relaxing the computer time seems obvious? Making your house a bit more fun?
And your ds to the point of crying seems OTT. But he really loves going to theirs? Bet he does! You need to address that bit too.

Less frequent play dates and it will all be ok?

littleoldladywho · 14/04/2017 05:34

Christ, as a mum with sn kids I've lost count of the number of times I've dropped balls, and I'm a control freak who hates to rely on other people. Mums with sn kids are entirely normal, let's not fall into the fecking Holland bullshit of assuming she is some sort of mythical being who always plans childcare two months in advance and wafts around with a beatific smile. She's just as harassed and time poor as everyone else, and by the sounds of it, takes on way too much in the community because she has an sn kid, understands the necessity, and no other fecker will step up.
I assume she has no idea that R gets bored and whines at yours. Or that your precious child who isn't allowed extra screen time is sobbing into his cornflakes with the stress of having his best mate round. And I can guarantee that if she did, she would probably be mortified.
As others have suggested, there are usually reasons why sn kids have extra screen time - rather than sniffing at how unwholesome it is, they have got over themselves and realised that a relaxed happy child is much better than a bored stressed out one. For the love of God, make R days computer days and do everyone a favour. At 11 your son should be old enough and compassionate enough to understand that R has different rules.
And say no if you don't want him. But in a reciprocal relationship when you are currently the one in debt, that would have repercussions. No parent, especially an sn parent, wants to be accused of foisting their kids off onto reluctant friends. I'm feeling a bit nauseous in case any of the friends I have 'used' in this manner over the years have thought I was a secret master manipulator instead of a harassed anxious parent trying to keep everything together and fucking it up occasionally... (Especially when I remember the waves of hot shame at having to ask for favours in the first place)

Aeroflotgirl · 14/04/2017 08:54

Your son goes to R so its kind to have him back sometimes, especially if he might not have many friends due to his Aspergers, so your son is the only one. If its easier as his mum gives him computer, than you can at yours too, and keep the playdates shorter. Mabey take them out for a walk, or something to break it up.

What is not acceptable, is her keep springing it on you all of a sudden and expect you to drop everything. If its not convenient and you don't want to, say no, it has to be mutual.

TheCakes · 14/04/2017 09:21

Totally agree Little old Lady.
Jeez, some days I spend my entire day firefighting the issues of today. There's no room in my head for tomorrow.

dowhatnow · 14/04/2017 09:50

He's cried about it. Just say ok I'll help you deal with it by allowing more computer time because I know how hard it us for you to entertain him. But only in theses circumstances. Job done.

By all means cut down the favours but you can't keep sending your ds over there if you do this.

Werkzallhourz · 14/04/2017 09:53

The only thing I would say here is to be careful of supporting a friendship between R and your DS that may have naturally run its course.

I notice R is a year older and already at secondary school whereas your DS is at primary. Part of me wonders how much of this relationship between the two children is about this informal childcare agreement between R's mum and you, rather than a genuine friendship between the two boys who are now in different educational contexts. If your son is crying about R coming round, I'd suggest there are some issues there.

I've seen a lot of problems with parents encouraging friendships that don't fit the child or no longer fit the child. Children can feel very distressed if they are placed in an uncomfortable friendship situation, and a parent will not listen to their concerns. I also know of a few adults that feel their parents enforced friendships in childhood that then became detrimental to their development as teens and young adults.

I'm not saying this necessarily applies in your case, but I think it's worth considering for the future.

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