AIBU to beg you not to bet on the Grand National? It's animal abuse.

[hhorvath]

Please think about what you're condoning.

www.google.co.uk/search?q=grand+national+deaths&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjhieOLlZXTAhUCOxoKHTDFDagQ_AUICSgC&biw=1366&bih=638

www.independent.co.uk/voices/grand-national-races-animal-cruelty-get-rid-of-dangerous-jump-a7672131.html

"It’s time for the Grand National again – that curious time of year when people who claim to like horses gather to exploit them, often hurting and killing them in the process.

Since 2000, 48 horses have died at the annual festival that the National is part of. Others have suffered horribly with broken backs, necks or legs, severed tendons, or heart attacks. This is the reality of British horse racing."

If you use this as entertainment, the blood of murdered horses is on your hands as well.

Would you bet on a race where human beings fell and broke their legs or necks and had to be shot? At least they would have consented. Horses cannot consent to this life.

Would you be "fine" with it as long as it hadn't happened since 2012, despite horses dying after the race from their injuries since then?

Please don't be dazzled by the so-called glamour of this bloodsport.

Why won't vegans just stfu. Worse than Jeovahs Witnesses these days!

For the same reason you don't just shut the fuck up - freedom of speech!

OP - to be honest I have skipped many of the posts because it seems to have become a tit for tat slanging match, so forgive me if I repeat what's already been said.
IMO there are greater issues in the equine world than the grand national to address. Horses die every single day because of a variety of things, I had one who was having a chase around the field with her mates, slipped and snapped a leg, she was shot because the break was too severe to be healed, she was healthy and well cared for and having her insured, money was not an issue - she would have had to endure months of standing still, in a cast for the leg to have had any chance - horses to not do this naturally, and without the ability to move (which is fundamental to a horses well being, digestive system and lifestyle

Old - exactly this. Horses do die for all sorts of reasons like the terrible field accident you mentioned. Then you have the hunters, eventers, P2P, endurance etc they all have their accidents.

I risk my life daily when I have no choice to hack out on the road to get to the nearest bridle path.

Horses are currently dropping like flies due to Atypical Myopathy.

I have owned a number of Off The Track TBs, none of them are afraid of the crop, none of them hate being ridden and they most certainly do fuck off at warp speed for fun

My current OTTB is called Secret, grand daughter (like many others I know but it's our claim to fame) to the legendary ST. The trainers piled hundreds of thousands into her, they all had high hopes, she was shit. She just didn't want to race, if they don't want to they won't

Sorry posted too soon!
The horse (in the vets opinion) would not have survived the trauma of this.
That's one example of a horse that died because of an injury.
There are many others that are abused and badly treated and that die or are pts as a result - horses bought for £50 at the sales and tethered on a public field with no water, shelter or company. I report these horses, and give them some water.
Horses that are bought by well meaning people with no knowledge and kept alone, with poor care through ignorance, ridden too young or too old by heavy handed ppl or too heavy riders.
Horses much like dogs, like to please, and they will try so very hard in the right circumstances to do such. However they are fight or flight animals and these instincts can be 'toned down' by trust with humans but never eradicated - I've tried many times to get half a ton of horse to do what I think is best and invariably always lost.
I love these animals and I try every single day to do the best by them, I think yabu to be active over one event, claiming it is because of the love of an animal, when there are hundreds of horses put through cruelty every day, and to not mention that.
To me OP it sounds like you are subscribing to a stereotype of the grand national rather than genuinely being pro active in horse welfare. That said I absolutely respect your right to do that even if I don't agree with your motives.

What are YOU doing with your life other than whingeing on the internet
OP, do you seriously not get the irony of that post?

I really don't like the GN and horse racing in general. I remember one year a horse had died and they had green screens around it and the other horses were going round it and the commentators weren't mentioning it, just seemed wrong.

I agree 100% OP.

I think all those who step up seemingly proud of their part in abusing animals, or those who can't wait to tell everyone they are eating a juicy steak while watching it, are pathetic and goady.

OP has expressed a viewpoint, she also happens to be vegan. This second fact has been used to rubbish her opinion. It's ridiculous. Vegans aren't fair game. Why the hell do people feel entitled to talk to people this way because of a moral choice made over what they choose to eat? The OP wasn't preaching about veganism. Do people feel threatened by the idea that others are actively trying to not be part of the cruelty in the world, while they themselves can't be bothered to do anything? It sounds like playground bullying to me. The post that stated that the OP mustn't be any fun as she is vegan was embarrassing to read.

If you want to do one thing to help horse welfare that can I politely ask that you slow down and give them space on the road. According to the British Horse Society 21 horses have been killed this year in road accidents. I know it's not high profile or anything...

I've never met a vegan who preached or acted like a twat for being plant based
Then consider yourself very lucky. I work closely with a vegetarian.
I've never come across a more joy-sucking, judgemental person ever. God help us if she decides to become vegan
Trouble is, I have to listen to her banging on about the success rate of homeopathy as well as her stupid diet advice
We work in palliative care, btw

Sweetkitty the reason the commentators don't mention the screens is because they are not allowed to speculate about what is happening.

Screens do not necessarily mean a fatality or severe injury, they are used to give vets and doctors the chance to assess the situation privately. They quite often put screens around jockeys that have taken a fall and around horses that have suffered a tired fall meaning they need 5-10 minutes to get their breath back and get back up on their feet.

Not read all the comments but agree with op. It's all about money not the horses welfare and it's cruel. I am a horse owner and we had an ex grand national race horse at our yard as it was going to be slaughtered as he wasn't performing they are not well looked after at all and yes horses are injured and die maybe not in the main event but 6 died last year in the 3 days of racing all for people who know nothing about horses to have a posh day out getting pissed and having a bet

But that's just one person, Punkrockergirl. You can't judge every vegan/vegetarian on the basis of one person.

And for those that say they are bred for horse racing yes they are but often inbred those who don't make it are disposed of either killed or in rescue. For those who say horses love to run and jump yes but they are herd animals by nature training horse racer are backed before they are 2 when they are still growing they are either in training or resting in the stables they don't get to graze in the fields with other horses. All of this leads to health problems later in life. If they are lucky enough to survive the race course once they are no longer making money they are disregarded sold on or killed. So no i don't believe race horses live the life of luxury they are used as a money making machine

Abused horses?!

You should go to a racing yard... they have the best of everything they are so well cared for. And as for not enjoying it that's crap they LOVE it.

If a horse didn't want to jump trust me you wouldn't get it near one of those fences!

I imagine you ride.

No I don't anymore. Even though my mare is "rideable". I've put her first. It's a long story to do with her mental wellbeing due to her past plus physical restrictions. I absolutely got her almost perfect...then I retired her, because she deserved that.

But thanks for your post, genuinely, I don't think people who bet have blood on their hands myself. Just those behind it. But I do feel so strongly about this and not just GN, many other aspects as well.

*Abused horses?!

You should go to a racing yard... they have the best of everything they are so well cared for. And as for not enjoying it that's crap they LOVE it.

If a horse didn't want to jump trust me you wouldn't get it near one of those fences!*

Some horses love jumping!

Those that are "rapped", don't.

As usual with objectors- you have absolutely no idea what you are on about

Oh ok. I have no idea

But it's actually very difficult to make money owning racehorses Alfiemoon, the vast majority of owners never cover their costs let alone make a profit - only the major players ever make any money.

It costs an average of £16,000 per horse per year in training fees, and that's assuming the horse stays sound and doesn't require any specialist treatment in that time.

Most horses will never win a race and average prize money in this country is woeful - for example tonight at Wolverhampton the winner of the 8.20 collected just over £2,500. Out of that the cost of travel, jockey fees and percentage, trainers percentage, plus other race fees need to be deducted. The owner will be lucky to get £1500 from that.

The winning horse concerned has amassed the grand total of £13,000 in prize money over a 4 year racing career which doesn't come close to covering the owners cost in investment over the years. It's totally unfair, and just not true, to accuse owners of only being in it to make money.

I've got a retired race horse in my field. She's 18 and scarcely run a race.
She lives the life of Riley.

To me OP it sounds like you are subscribing to a stereotype of the grand national rather than genuinely being pro active in horse welfare

I think the debate comes up most often around this time of year because it's when people who otherwise show no interest in racing become interested. It's seen as the best time to involve them and get them to think about the cruelty involved in racing (and other equine sports).

I've been around horses for 40 years. I've worked with them full time and I have BHS qualifications. I've worked with Arab stallions, trained police horses, had training with an FBHS, competed in dressage competitions and support equine charities. And yet if and when I mention my dislike of racing the response I get is "you don't know about horses". When I explain that I do, this is modified to "you don't know about racing". Yes I do. I've been involved with ex racehorses for the last 10 years.

IMO the deaths in the Grand National are the tip of the iceberg. The bit I find horrific is the excessive breeding of thoroughbreds and the wastage of those that don't make it on the course. But the deaths on the course still sicken me.

Put it this way, a friend of mine used to drive the meat wagon at point to points. That's what this sport is. There's a meat wagon at every meet, following the horses around to pick up the dead.

Sure, my horse could (and does) hurt himself playing in the field. I don't think of that as a reason to run him into the ground. Those who say you cannot force a horse to do something - I think you fundamentally misunderstand both horses and the nature of power.

She's peddling dangerous advice and giving false hope to terminally ill patients though, Sooty
So I will absolutely judge her, when I'm the one having to repair the damage she's done to the patients and families in the last days of their lives.
She is being dealt with btw
This has strayed from the grand national somehow!

OP , please nominate yourself for medical testing to prevent animals being tested on. You can't be a vegan and still use mainstream medicine. No one is a vegan until they boycott medicine

I hate ALL horse racing and would never watch it let alone bet on it.

As for the comments about what a wonderful life the horses have, how they are loved etc etc I can only say I know 2 people who have worked at racing stables and that is certainly not what they say.

It speaks volumes that so many of the posters in favour of horse racing have been so rude to the OP

@woodvillain that's an excellent point to make. I live around a lot of farms, stables and riding schools and the way drivers behave around horses is ridiculous