... for those who are devastated about Brexit, how are you dealing with the fear and depression and anxiety?

[testytesting]

Has anyone got any strategies? I am genuinely not one for melodrama, but I am devastated, angry, terrified, depressed, and I feel so utterly helpless. Nothing in my lifetime has made me feel like this, and I just can't imagine feeling like this for the next two years and beyond. I can hardly bear to listen to the news, but I feel compelled to anyway. How are other remainers dealing with this, what are your coping strategies? And what, if anything, can we DO?

Employers in Europe may be less likely to employ UK citizens if they need visas, meaning fewer work opportunities. If we are not permitted to continue as part of the ERASMUS programme, studying in Europe could become financially out of reach.

no one is stopping your children going to Europe, they may have to get a pesky visa but hey that won't stop them

if you live in London pesky visas are ok. If you don't, they are a right pain because embassies have silly opening hours for consular services.

You might have to get a really early morning train to London costing £££s or stay overnight. That's simply not feasible for many students and is totally avoidable by staying in the EEA.

Years ago I had a summer job in a country that is now in the EU, but wasn't in the then-EC - and so I needed a visa. Because their opening hours were so restrictive, it simply wasn't feasible for me to get the visa in person, so I just took a chance and went to the country anyway. I was lucky and got away with it, but I might not have done.

If you can do them online it's ok, though no doubt there will still be a cost.

Sostenueto I have no idea what state education versus private has to do with this thread, but fwiw my dc all attend state education. And btw, state education is much more prevalent in all the other major EU countries such as Germany, France Belgium and Holland.

Mulled I don't know what century you live in but I always manage to get visas for ALL OVER THE WORLD either online, or on arrival. It's one of the benefits of being British - they generally let you do that.

I wish everyone would stop making the visa thing sound like much harder work than it is just because they are determined to be all doom and gloom about Brexit.

And currently for the countries that do insist British passport holders you visit their embassies, being in or out of the EU would appear to not make a blind bit of difference anyway.

Can't see any gain from Brexitting. I can only see what we stand to lose, including our children's future job prospects and their ability to live in 27 other countries unimpeded. Art 50 is revocable, so let's see how it plays out over the next year and if the leave promises all turn out to be lies (some already have - money for the NHS, be like Norway, lower immigration), then we can reverse this. I've joined the Lib Dems and am really excited about that now that I'm in. I feel much better for being active.

Can people top with the 'if you are unhappy leave the country'

Its a seriously shitty stupid comment to make

And i am a bit lost with the 'my grandchildren are awesome ' comment

I mean i am sure they are and its to chat about their achievements, but what has that got to do with brexit

Yes, and ironically, post-Brexit, it's one of the many things UK citizens may no longer have the right to do, if they are so inclined.

I was referring to leaving the country there btw - agreeing with Rufus

Here, here again French lavender. The trouble is people have got so used to traveling easily that the thought of any mild inconvenience in a world where "I want everything now" is the mantra is frightening to some. As for studying abroad it will still be possible to do. But, here in good ole blighty we have some of the best universities in the world. So, why not opt to study in them? Just a thought, my thought. If only you could see what Britain could be. There was life outside the EU and there is life after it. You may, however, have to strive a little harder for what you want which in my mind won't stop the younger generation if they are determined enough. That Is if they can get used to not having everything handed to them on a plate.

Rufus i was answering Fingals question.

At the moment, ERASMUS allows students to study at those great British universities as well as spend a period of time studying in an EU member state university easily and at limited cost. Whatever way you look at, if we don't continue as part of ERASMUS, students' opportunities will be fewer post-Brexit than they are now. As well as being an essential part of mastering a language, spending time in another country broadens your cultural and social experiences, fosters greater independence and increases awareness of the world outside the rather narrow confines of the UK. And before anyone starts, yes students participate in other exchange programmes around the world, but in far, far fewer numbers than have participated in ERASMUS and at greater cost, not least due to the cost of travelling further afield.

My apologies sostenueto

I didnt see that...i did wonder what was going on

he PVV just did less well than expected in the Dutch elections and would have little influence anyway as no other party would form a coalition with them. Le Pen is losing ground in the polls on France. No poll has yet put her ahead in the second round of voting. Switzerland held a referendum on reducing immigration but when told (as is factually correct) by the EU that they could not remain as part of EFTA they voted again as the Swiss realised that membership of the free trade association is more beneficial to them than reducing immigration from EU member states. The Italian referendum was totally misreported by the UK press and was on a domestic governance issue unrelated to the EU. Many Italian-based posters on MN have said there is no appetite in Italy for leaving the EU. All the evidence from polling suggests that Brexit has renewed support for the EU in other member states.

The PVV made massive gains this election. Their gains were just smaller than expected. The press reported this as a "victory".

That Le Pen may not win isn't a victory either. The fact is that there is absolutely massive resentment of the EU in France as well. That someone as extreme as Le Pen can get anywhere near the presidency is evidence of this, and is scarily dangerous. I don't want Le Pen any more than any other reasonable person, but the EU will guarantee that someone like her will get in somewhere.

Italy? Also, very close to wanting to leave. And if they don't choose to, they may be forced (at least the euro) on account of their economic problems.

As far as I know, the Swiss people didn't vote again, their government just caved. Of course they would. The EU is, once again, getting governments to go against the will of their people with threats. We are seeing it with Brexit.

Britain absolutely not alone in this. There is widespread anger at the EU.

First, Switzerland isn't a full member of the EU.

I never said they were.

Yes, and ironically, post-Brexit, it's one of the many things UK citizens may no longer have the right to do, if they are so inclined.

Do you mean leave the UK to leave in an EU country? If so then all the more reason to do it now, while you still can.

Can people top with the 'if you are unhappy leave the country

Its a seriously shitty stupid comment to make

I totally disagree, I think that given what many of you are arguing for, and apparently fighting (albeit pointlessly now) to protect, I think it's a perfectly sensible and valid comment to make. You think the UK is about to become a sinking ship, yet you fail to see that you are free to leave it.

You feel European. You want to remain a citizen of an EU country. You want to retain the right to free movement without the need for visas. You see no borders and you do not desire borders, but borders are inevitable now.

So why stay within the borders you are so opposed to, if you loathe and fear the political climate within them? If you are such a champion of EU migration to the UK then why not take inspiration from that and beat a path the other way? You have enough directions to choose from and it has never been a one way street, though you could be forgiven for thinking it is, judging by the number of Brits in Poland.

Seriously, if this country was turning into something so politically and socially repellent to me that I felt a profound sense of disenfranchisement and anxiety over it, as many of you claim you do, then no way would I stay. And you are lucky - nothing is stopping you from upping sticks and starting again in an EU country tomorrow. What you say you desire is there for the taking.

I wish everyone would stop making the visa thing sound like much harder work than it is just because they are determined to be all doom and gloom about Brexit.

Plenty of countries, from America to Japan, require UK citizens to visit the embassy to have their working visas issued. Often you have to attend a brief interview and leave your passport there to have the visa stamped, and wait for it to be posted back to you. Working visa applications have fees, and may require biometrics, police records, or validated copies of your qualifications or other documents. They can be delayed or denied for any reason. If you're being sponsored by a company, visas cost that company money and mean your start date is uncertain. Once you enter the country on a visa, you have far fewer rights than its citizens, and may be required to leave immediately if your job goes. Your spouse and children may not be able to work. If some twat like Trump comes to power, your visa or re-entry rights may be revoked with no notice.

Yes - it's generally no fuss getting a transit or tourist visa for most countries. That's not really a perk of being British , but a result of reciprocal travel agreements. But needing a working visa greatly reduces your employability overseas, and affects your legal status even when you do get hired. It's crazy to hear this being downplayed as no big deal. Every American and Aussie I know would love to get an EU passport (and many do manage it, through ancestry), and they're fucking incredulous that we've voted that right away for ourselves and future generations.

Leaving the EU isn't even part of Le Pen's manifesto. She watered it down to leaving the Eurozone after she realised that there was little appetite in France for quitting the EU. And I don't know what press you read chilli but everything I saw post the Dutch elections was that the PVV had made less gains than they anticipated which was reported as a failure for his party. They do have a fair number of seats, but they are relegated to minority party status as none of the other parties will co-operate with them.

Go and take a look at the Nexit thread in the EU referendum topic if you're interested in this area.

Ah, working visas, I was talking about tourist visas. Fair point, but I don't see having to jump through some hoops for a working visa as a bad thing in the slightest. It is better for security and better for making sure a country isn't lumbered with loads of 'workers' it doesn't actually need, who then become a bit of a liability or a burden.

Yes - it's generally no fuss getting a transit or tourist visa for most countries. That's not really a perk of being British hmm

Actually yes it is, not only Britain, several other countries admittedly, but not everyone can walk into anywhere in the world as a tourist quite as easily as a British citizen can.

Agree with ARumWithAView - it's basically going to be MUCH harder for us Brits to live, work, retire, study, etc. in the other 27 member states post Brexit. Of course it won't be impossible, BUT it will be more expensive (Visas, private health insurance, outside EU tuition fees for unis, lower pensions due to weak pound). As for working - well, we'll have to have a firm job offer in place before going OR the proven means to sustain ourselves, whereas now we can simply rock up and look for a job. All of these issues will mean that companies in the EU would most likely employ an Irish person, or someone else from the other member states over and above a Brit to avoid extra paper work, etc. So all of this means that there will be fewer opportunities for our children ... unless, of course, they're rich kids like Boris' or Farage's or Ree-Mogg's ... you know, the people who think Brexit is going to be great!

Being excited to join the liberal democrats really means you need to get out more.

Seriously, if this country was turning into something so politically and socially repellent to me that I felt a profound sense of disenfranchisement and anxiety over it, as many of you claim you do, then no way would I stay. And you are lucky - nothing is stopping you from upping sticks and starting again in an EU country tomorrow. What you say you desire is there for the taking.

What a load of snide bollocks. I was born here. I'm British and European and I don't want to live in your identity-reclaimed Ye Olde Insular British Utopia. That doesn't mean I have to bugger off just because I disagree with the recent referendum result and right-wing tilt, fuelled by mendacious opportunist politicians and a rabid right-wing press. I don't WANT my own country to be 'socially and politically repellent' to me. I am quite fond of it. This is a democracy, and I have every right to stay, comment, participate and protest without the repetitive response that, if I don't like the way things are going, I should get out.

french

Its a shitty stupid comment

I like my country, i will stay in my country

I am entitled to say that i think brexit is a bad idea

I would be entitled (if i felt that way) to say that my life would not be the same or that i felt the country had changed

Its a bit like saying i really like mumsnet but by god are there some bastards out there and someone saying 'best to go to netmums then'

And stop using YOU try SOME PEOPLE...cos i dont feel any of those things

And what arum said

Cept the european bit