... for those who are devastated about Brexit, how are you dealing with the fear and depression and anxiety?

[testytesting]

Has anyone got any strategies? I am genuinely not one for melodrama, but I am devastated, angry, terrified, depressed, and I feel so utterly helpless. Nothing in my lifetime has made me feel like this, and I just can't imagine feeling like this for the next two years and beyond. I can hardly bear to listen to the news, but I feel compelled to anyway. How are other remainers dealing with this, what are your coping strategies? And what, if anything, can we DO?

'previously recorded' not 'voted'

Will try to get on my laptop later and link to it, Lucy.

I assumed it was the national service being referred too. Korea was a war that was engagement of UK soldiers during national service.

Either way, original comment from poster Bertrand Russell was snide.

"That saw engagement" of course.

All my family (DC in their 30s, me in my 60s and my parents in their 80s) voted remain - because we care what happens to future generations. IN fact I have yet to meet anyone my age who voted Leave - maybe just the sort of people I know.

Parents and I also voted to join the Common Market in the 70s.

I console myself with the thought that when we joined - things didn't seem so very different, not for a long time and then it just seemed like normal progression. I am hoping for the same the other way around. The best we can do is hope for the best deal possible. Getting ourselves into a state won't help us or anyone.

(Passes round and )

The initial very low turnout figure amongst the young of 36% has been discredited. However the estimated figure is still considerably lower than older age groups. So 64% for under 25 versus 90% for over 65. These are of people registered to vote, rather than people eligible to vote, which may decrease the younger person voting numbers further.

I find is very hard to square these figures with the notion that young people have a level on political nous, insight and foreward thinking ability beyond that of older people.

I also wonder if we would be having this conversation if the demographic voting pattern had gone the other way, and more older people had voted to remain.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-brexit-turnout-young-voters-youth-vote-double-a7129181.html

The EU referendum turnout for people aged between 18 and 24 was almost double the figure initially reported, according to research by the London School of Economics (LSE)

At a rate not seen for two decades, 64 per cent of the age bracket opted to vote on June 23, based on in-depth polling conducted by Opinium and analysed by professor of political science and European politics Michael Bruter and Dr Sarah Harrison of the LSE

Widely reported initial statistics released by Sky Data, which was based on analysis of last year’s general election, suggested the turnout among young people was 36 per cent. The research looked at the proportion within each generation who said they always vote

But starkly contrasting figures emerged after a post-referendum Opinium poll of 2,002 people looked into whether people voted at polling stations or by post, whether they were registered but did not vote, and whether they were not registered at all

It found 64 per cent of those young people who were registered did vote, 65 per cent of 25-to-39-year-olds and 66 per cent of those aged between 40 and 54

Turnout was measured as high as 74 per cent among for 55-to-64 and a remarkable 90 per cent for those aged 65 and over. According to the Electoral Commission, overall turnout was 72.2 per cent

Imjustapoorboy has hit it on the head with their point about arrogance.

I do agree that some sections of society, whether they be old or not, are still thinking of UK as some superior colonial nation. (Don't get me wrong, I love some aspects of the UK, but I don't think that given that globalisation has happened, we can survive well and prosper on our own, without access to the world's largest trading block . And we can't ignore facts such as our productivity is way lower than that of France and Belgium (and many many others) and only just above that of Italy and Spain.)

If I were PM, I would make every student learn a foreign language and make them go and live/work/volunteer in a foreign country for one year. Then UK students would then have to face the humiliation of not being understood, of not being in a position where their language was not the one that was universally known. Thus forcing them to be on the back foot for once, looking beyond their own little comfortable bubble in Horning or wherever... and actually able to appreciate the way things are done successfully (may I suggest transport, education, health care to name a few?) in other EU countries, but first and foremost, they would hopefully learn a little humility.

Oh dear - will preview future messages I promise

meant to say "of being in a position where their language was not the one universally understood"

It found 64 per cent of those young people who were registered did vote. I'd be interested to know what proportion of young people register to vote. The LSE don't seem to provide these figures. After all 64% of a small pool of people is pretty pathetic. This discredits the LSE findings, IMO.

"Either way, original comment from poster Bertrand Russell was snide."

What's snide about pointing out that the "it's what we fought for" line is bollocks?

kaitlinktm

All my family (DC in their 30s, me in my 60s and my parents in their 80s) voted remain - because we care what happens to future generations. IN fact I have yet to meet anyone my age who voted Leave - maybe just the sort of people I know

Do you really believe that people who voted leave don't care about their children and future generations?

So people in London and Scotland (majority remain) care more about their children than those up north and in rural areas?

So people with degrees care more about their children than those without?

So you live in area full of "good" people who voted remain and care about their children, whilst some of us live in areas of "bad" people who voted leave and don't care about their children.

Has is crossed your mind that when people take political decisions, they usually think what is good for them is good for their children? If people think being in the EU is not good for them 1) they will therefore think it is not good for their children and 2) whether it is good or not for their children will be part of their decision on whether EU membership is a positive or not.

Has is crossed your mind that the fact we can see clear demographic and geographic patterns in the voting suggests there are factors at play other then that people like you are somehow morally superior? You know, like economics, experience of the advantages and disadvantages of being in the EU, possibly values?

No, it's just that those nasty leave voters don't care about their children.

Really, throwing a slur like that, and it is, to my mind, one of the nastiest insults you can throw at someone - that they don't care about their children - really just makes you look out of touch and blinkered and unable to see people different to you as, y'know, human beings who are equal to you.

^ Brompton ^

....but if that wasn't what you meant by your post kaitlinktm I apologise for my mega-rant and you might want to rephrase.

Well, that seems quite reasonable if they wanted how their children and grandchildren were voting to inform their vote. I imagine people doing that probably didn't have strong opinions one way or the other.

MIL was going to vote leave and felt strongly about it, after talking to ds1 she voted remain

She didn't discuss anything with dh and i, to be honest i assumed that both MIL and FIL had voted leave

Sorry I upset/annoyed you Brompton.

When I re-read my post I agree it did come over badly. I honestly didn't mean it that way.

I ought to have made it clear that I was responding to PP who were suggesting that people over a certain age should not have been allowed to vote and I was explaining why I had made the decision I had - I ought to have added that no doubt Leavers did the same.

I know plenty of people younger than me (who have young children) who voted leave and absolutely they care about their children.

The last thing I intended to do was to upset people and cause more conflict.

So you live in area full of "good" people who voted remain and care about their children, whilst some of us live in areas of "bad" people who voted leave and don't care about their children

Sorry - should have added that I live in an area (full of good people) which voted to leave - just that people I know my age didn't.

Takes foot out of mouth and slinks off thread

The person who said "let's make Britain great again" is 36 so the age thing is immaterial.

My Dad said that there was "a different feeling before the EU". My Auntie said "we didn't sign up for all the bureaucracy we have now" .

One or two mentioned other people mentioned immigration and an infrastructure which cannot cope.

Interestingly one of the local Leave voters was moaning like anything in the local paper because he voted because of immigration and the infrastructure "and now I discover most immigration is outside if the EU". Felt like writing a response saying "yes dear...and without it our infrastructure will collapse".

Thanks kaitlinktm

I did wonder if you had just phrased what you were saying badly, and didn't mean what my long rant was in response to, hence second post. Apologies, I should have asked for clarification first before venting my spleen

Don't go

The irony is that EU legislation is, as we speak being prepared for insertion into the post Brexit rule book by cut and paste. So we will still have bureaucracy, and EU rules and regs by another name.

UK will have to observe rules and regs of the EU if it wants access to the Single Market and other markets also who like regulation and standards.

So let me see..... we shall leave the EU, but keep most of the rules in order to access markets.

Putting it simply, it would appear to me that the only reason for Brexit was to control immigration and free movement. But to access the Single Market like Norway under EEA then the UK must agree to free movement.

I honestly wish someone would actually tell me in a few succinct sentences what Brexit will achieve that we haven't got already, apart from the free movement of people.

"Brexit means Brexit, is a euphemism for "we haven't got a clue, but soundbytes might just do it for now!"

Thanks @Fingalswave for your helpful reply. Yes, it's all so uncertain, a very rocky time ahead.

Can I just leave the latest Jonathon Pie rant here in case anyone wants to watch? : Marching into Brexit

m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=zJP-EaxZeg8&a=

Havana Are you saying you think we will stay in the single market and accept freedom of movement as a condition of this?

Now I'm thinking I might cause offence with the Jonathon Pie video . Don't watch it if you are v sensitive Brexitwise. JP (well, the creator of JP) supports remain but he is a bit scathing about the recent march so don't watch if that will upset you.

@BromptonOratory,

TBH with you I don't know what to think. But if UK wants access to the Single Market, why should it be treated any differently to other EEA countries - Norway, Iceland, Lichtenstein (not in EU) and Switzerland which is neither in EEA nor EU, but is in the single market. In order for them to access the Single Market they are obliged to allow free movement .

Now I suppose the UK could broker a deal that allows bilateral trade with the EU, but outside the single market setup. I think it will be difficult without free movement, which leaves things back to square one.

That's just my reading of it. Of course the UK could join a Customs Union with the likes of Turkey and other countries for free trade amongst them. But where does that leave the UK outside of the single market?

Just seems to me to be a very complicated way of inter European trading, just adding layers of unnecessary complexity.

That is why I am saying the biggest issue in all this is free movement. And that is obviously what Brexit means, because if that was retained there would be no issue, UK could join as an EEA member and trade away.

I also wonder if we would be having this conversation if the demographic voting pattern had gone the other way, and more older people had voted to remain

I strongly suspect that the same arguments could be used by the SNP for a Scottish indyref2. Lets stop those over 70 voting (because they are more likely to vote for the Union).

My mother voted remain, my father died a couple of weeks after the referendum and wasn't well enough to vote. I suspect he would have voted to leave because he said that the Common Market was different to the EU and the EU wasn't what people had signed up to. He was racist though, voted for UKIP and read the Daily Express. However, he always liked the Germans, despite having fought in the war.