To be selfish over new partner

[Downwithpeppa]

To cut a long story short , I've been dating a man since January , about a month in he told me he'd been to prison for manslaughter , I decided to give him the benefit of the doubt as I really liked him and things have continued to go well he's given me absolutely no indication of being dangerous or anything . He comes off lovely and acknowledges the seriousness of what he did nearly 10 years ago . last week my dad found out and has gone absolutely ballistic and demanded I not speak to this man again or give up my relationship with him. I do have children but they have not been involved at this point. Aibu to ignore my dad and continue the relationship ?

It's becoming more and more clear to me why the OP's dad is so concerned.

It would put me off, if nothing else because of the risk SS might take an interest. In your shoes, I'd certainly insist on seeing the judgement if you've not already.

"Fight gone horribly wrong"

Unless he was defending himself then no.

I can't be doing with fights, punches, any violence.

People make mistakes. It was manslaughter, not murder. Which means there was clearly no element of premeditation.

OPs says she's researched it - why are we doubting this? All this info would be in the public domain - details of the case and sentencing, all easily searchable on the internet.

As to him having a good job/ mortgage - well he's not going to be working for the police/ civil service/ legal profession but there are lots of other well paying jobs that could be open to him. Someone I know earns £45k a year driving lorries - the only requirement for that job was a clean driving licence. There are many other examples.

From what the OP says about a fight gone wrong, it could simply have been a one off error of judgment. There have been many cases in the news in recent years, where a drink fuelled argument results in punches being thrown. In most cases, the worst that happens is someone gets a bloody nose. But sometimes the punch lands badly, the other person falls, hits their head, dies...it's horribly tragic. But unless you subscribe to the view that all criminals should spend their entire lives in prison you have to allow for the possibility of rehabilitation.

For me in this situation it would depend on the circumstances. A punch thrown that lands badly is less of an issue Imo than if a knife or weapon had been used. Maybe there was an element of self defence.

Age is also a factor. Was he under 25? Under 21 even? What has he learned from it? If he was barely out of his teens at the time, he may be a very different person now.

Life isn't black and white, and the older I get the more I become aware of that.

I allow for the possibility of rehabilitation. But I still wouldn't want to be in an intimate relationship with someone who has a history of violence - and punch landed badly/fight gone wrong classes as a history of violence in my book. That's just where I draw my line. I completely understand OP's Dad's concerns especially if she has a history of being in abusive relationships, so may be vulnerable.

these are all good points (minus the strange SS comments i already clarified the children are not involved ), I have not been in an abusive relationship since my early 20s and am 34 now. I'd like to think I've learnt many lessons since then . I'll give it all some thought though thank you .

A (second) cousin of mine was down for murder (debatable, could have been manslaughter in my eyes and I say that with no family bias as I don't actually know him bar him coming to a family function recently) for almost twenty years until a few months ago, he's no looker but immediately has picked up with someone he's been with for a few months. I have no idea what is in her head!!!

I would run screaming from someone if they told me that, no matter how "skewed" they make their conviction out to be.

I just don't understand why you would take the risk.

Yes, I understand why your dp is allowed to start afresh from a legal point of view. But there is no reason why you personally have to shack up with someone who was violent and, as a result, accidentally killed someone.

Why not just find someone who doesn't have a violent history?

Given your update I'd proceed with caution - it wouldn't be an immediate 'dump him'.

The son of a friend of mine has a similar conviction, similar sentence. Two 19 year old lads, both drunk, fist fight, one lad went down and cracked his head on the edge of the pavement and died. Friends son is in his 40's now, married with children, great job, lovely fella, never touched a drink since that day.

minus the strange SS comments i already clarified the children are not involved

Won't they be involved if the relationship continues, though?

I think your abuse radar is not high enough if you're willing to simply overlook this. Being confident you could spot the signs and that this in itself will keep you safe is, in fact, usually a sign your radar is too low. You should be more picky or paranoid, not less, because of that. Especially when there are children involved. And they are involved unless you are planning to keep them out of this forever, which doesn't sound practical.

If it was 10 years ago and he's a similar age to you then it's not like this was a teenage lapse in judgement. Bear that in mind.

But look - seriously. The person you are most likely to be killed by in your life is your husband, boyfriend, or ex-partner. Getting into a relationship is a statistically risky thing to do. For god's sake, don't overlook the extra risk factors here because you believe in second chances, on principle, or because he's nice two months into a relationship. Just take them into account. It's your choice whether you stay with him, but look seriously at the reality - he once got so angry that he hit someone with enough force to end their life - and look critically at it, worst case scenario, not best case, because as ludicrous and abstract as it seems now, ten years down the line it could be a life or death decision for you personally.

The very fact he was fighting in the first place would be enough to put me off. That he actually killed someone in that fight would be a deal breaker for me I'm afraid. He's been in prison, served his time () and has been honest with you as far as you know. But he killed someone in a fight ... I can see why your dad is worried.

Just no.

I have seen people who have turned their life around after doing bad things. I dont agree with writing them off if they have changed.

If he has had no further dealings with the police and as you say holds down a job and you know the full details then its your choice.
Have you spoken to his family/friends?
How do they act around him?

I don't get it. You'd only been seeing him a month. You hadn't invested much at that point, and you weren't tied to him in any way. And you have children to consider. What sort of parent, upon hearing that her new boyfriend has been to prison for killing someone, decides to give the benefit of the doubt? That kind of mindset is just alien to me.

I'd like to think I've learnt many lessons since then

No you haven't. You clearly have a history of getting into abusive relationships, and you're judgement on this one, just one month into your relationship after hearing about BFs history is shocking. Your turn of phrase 'benefit of the doubt' shows that you clearly do not understand the gravity of what he has done and the potential for you and DC to be at risk.

Yes, I have to say, my perspective has shifted since I was younger, violence is a dealbreaker to me. I no longer see it as a normal thing which happens. I've never hit anybody and I don't see why it's expected that men might have done so, it's not necessary, IMO, at all. And it makes me think things about the character of the person if they have felt it to be a necessary or reasonable response.

In self defence, perhaps, violence is sometimes defensible. But even self defence raises questions - is a person who hangs around with people who fight, or a person who gets involved instead of walking away someone I want to share my life with? Somebody getting riled up to the point of wanting to fight, alone, even if they never cause injury, is an issue to me.

That's my line and I'm not saying others need to or should share it but for me the situation in the OP crosses several lines - first fighting, second using serious force. I don't know if it was self defence or not but that's two or three lines crossed anyway.

For goodness sake. He is a person. He made a mistake in the past, and was open with you about it.

I would absolutely carry on a relationship with him If he seems cool now. Only you can judge this.

I would absolutely carry on a relationship with him If he seems cool now

Right. How do you judge if an ex prisoner who went in for manslaughter is now 'cool'?

Please don't be that desperate for a man to put your children potentially in that situation. Agree with your father here

The Clare's law suggestion sounds a good one, if you continue with this relationship. However, I wonder if you should in view of your having children. Even if he never harms anyone again, other children will probably find out and you can then imagine the taunts they could get. I am fairly sure given your dad's view that he would involve SS as well.

For me it would be an instant run the minute I found out.

There are plenty of men who have never been involved in a fight and who would choose to walk away. I would not have any respect for someone who engaged in a fight full stop.

I'd go on with caution.

My cousin's ex was in prison for 18 months for killing his best friend whilst driving dangerously (went round a blind bend too fast and was hit by an oncoming car). He has his faults but isn't abusive, loves his now wife and four children.

With regards to sentencing time that doesn't mean anything. My aunt was killed by her husband after years of DV. He was drunk, therefore was only found guilty of manslaughter, sentenced for 5 years and out in 2.5. Robbed our family of a mother, daughter, sister and aunt. He is not a nice man though seems that way. His previous wife divorced him for DV though we didn't know that at the time. I wish we had.

It very much depends on the circumstances; who he was as a person at the time as well as who he is now. I would do some investigating; if he is the man you believe him to be he will wholly support and understand this.

Good luck OP

master you respect yourself enough to make a judgement. I think OP can do that.

If we all go through life thinking that no-one should ever be rehabilitated back into society or have the right to a life of any kind after committing one offence then we might as well write off the idea of restorative justice and sentence all criminals to death.

Everyone has the right to make their own decisions about the people they become involved with but equally people are able to change or even to move on from their past in order to live decent lives after what they have done.

We don't know the circumstances of this man's crime. Manslaughter just isn't a black and white crime as it is, it's horrible to think that one person could kill another but equally different circumstances can lead to different outcomes.

If you e.g. Look at someone like Louise Woodward who was convicted of manslaughter for killing a baby in her care in the US, she is now living back in the UK and iirc has children of her own now. And as far as I'm aware is not involved with SS and has presumably managed to have a successful relationship given she has children. Personally I couldn't get involved with someone who had killed a baby but others clearly don't think the same as me. And presumably as it was manslaughter she didn't intend to kill him, but different people's views would depend on where she was accepted in society.

Similarly there are people who would run a mile from a man who was involved in a fight where someone died. But there are others who might have listened to the circumstances and believe that he has turned his life around, or even that he was never a bad person in the first place but regrets what he did.

And equally there are people who would judge the crime but not the individual who committed it, i.e. He might be lovely but one might feel it impossible to be intimately involved with someone who had killed someone. I think I would fit into that category tbh. I could possibly accept someone as a friend who had been to prison but who had regretted their actions and moved forward, but couldn't personally be in a relationship with them. But other people have a different view, and others in turn decide that even the actions render the individual an evil bastard for life. Judgement is subjective, and often there is no right or wrong.

Personally I would find out the details, not from him but from public records, and then decide how to proceed.

And I understand your dad's view but equally demanding that you end the relationship is just as controlling - he should seek to explain his issue rather than throwing around demands which will achieve nothing. You're an adult, capable of making your own decisions and even mistakes......