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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU? - Annual leave

152 replies

MrsR31 · 20/03/2017 18:29

I'd like some opinions please, especially from those of you who might have HR experience.

Background is, I work part time, used to be mon to wed. Employer asked if I would take on new role last year and work mon/tue & fri. Agreed and rejigged childcare. Today I got new holiday sheet for the next year, I get pro rats share of 25 days & public hols. However, this time I will only get 7 public holidays despite working days falling on all 12. Meaning that whilst office is closed, I have to supplement p/h with 5 days annual leave (one & a half weeks). Leaving me with ten days for the year.

AIBU to expect full p/h allocation? Feel that it's unfair, especially as I changed my days to suit business needs and wouldn't have agreed if I had been made aware of the implications. I never have spare annual leave due to needing days for filling childcare gaps. Solutions offered were to work back extra 5 days -not feasible, work PT for a reason, or change days so that not working mon & Friday. But that's a major pain in the arse too as I need to rejig childcare again and I was watching my niece on my day off, so also going to mess up my sisters childcare.

OP posts:
Idefix · 20/03/2017 20:39

What happens to bh if you work part-time (30hrs) but work every week day?
Beginning to wish I took full-time when I was offered.

LindyHemming · 20/03/2017 20:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 20/03/2017 20:47

You still get your 5.6 weeks Idefix - it's just your week is 30 hours. That's 168 hours per annum which might be easier if your hours vary.

Idefix · 20/03/2017 20:54

So I can have a week off but I just get paid at my normal weekly pay? Realise that this make see sound thick Confused

Thank you MovingOnUp!

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 20/03/2017 20:56

Yes :)

hotcrossbun83 · 20/03/2017 21:00

Huh. When I was p/t (2015) I worked on Mondays and had every Monday bh off. If there was a bh on a day I didn't work then I didn't get anything in lieu. My holiday entitlement was pro rata but no one mentioned bh at all.

Idefix · 20/03/2017 21:00

Thank you!!

footballmum · 20/03/2017 21:11

HR professional here too. The problem is that a lot of people view bank holidays as different from their annual leave entitlement and its not. They're just a form of "fixed" holidays. So you can have two people working 3 days a week but different days but one gets a different amount of floating holiday from the other. But they're still getting the same number of holidays.

NoMoreAngstPls · 20/03/2017 21:37

OP im confused why you didn't realise this previously, as you were PT in your previous role (including working on a monday)!

Hotfootit · 20/03/2017 21:37

Sorry but I think YABU. I work PT. My employer gives all PT staff pro-rata BH. This means depending on how Christmas falls some years I get holiday added on to my Annual Leave entitlement and sometimes it is subtracted. For PT staff who work Tues-Thurs, they always have their AL increased as they never get BH, unless Christmas falls mid week.

bruffin · 20/03/2017 22:13

Its still not fair to have a higher percentage of your holiday restricted just because you have to work monday and friday.
As i said above last year i lost a week of holidays to bank holidays.

footballmum · 20/03/2017 22:32

But you didn't "lose" a week of holidays Bruffin. You still had those holidays but they were just fixed days.

bruffin · 20/03/2017 22:45

I did lose them. If i cant take AL when i want then its lost holiday. Nobody else has to use their AL fixed and if i didnt have to work mondays then i would gain AL to use when i want.

footballmum · 20/03/2017 22:55

But it was still holiday! You still had the days off just like all your other colleagues whose working days fall on those days. If you want to use your AL on other days take the bank hols unpaid.

BusyBeez99 · 20/03/2017 22:56

bruffin

Yes full time people do have to take AL
Fixed if their company is closed on bank holidays. You get the same amount of 'weeks' holiday as FT when you are PT. a full time employee may get 20
Days plus bank holidays so 28. And you, working 4/5 get 22.4 days but if you don't work on Mondays then you can use your pro rata bank holidays when you want because you don't have to take a Monday off. FT have to use 1 of the 28 for the bank holiday Monday

We all get the same number of weeks.....

bruffin · 20/03/2017 23:08

No buzy bee it doesnt work like that.look at it loke this
Ft we get 20 days (4 weeks)+ 8 days bank holiday fixed.
I get 3/ 5 so 17 days of which 8 days bank holidays 7 of which fall on my working day leaving me just 10 days to use as al which is only 3 weeks + 1 day
I get far less percentage of my holidays Al rather than fixed.
I would never advise anyone to work monday and friday if you are p/t unless you are working a 5 short day week.

Papafran · 20/03/2017 23:10

Well, bruffin, you need to plan your AL around the bank holidays in that case.

EineKleine · 20/03/2017 23:18

It's not totally fair bruffin but it is the fairest option and massively fairer than some people getting more leave than others, year in year out.

You have the right to time off, not the right to choose which days. If you get to choose your days for all but a week of your leave, you are doing well in the grand scheme of things. Loads of people struggle to cover school hols or have to work Christmas Day /NYD because they are not allowed to take time off at their own discretion. It is a bit annoying if you are comparing with your colleagues, I know. At my office that can be addressed by working the hours or taking it unpaid once the bank hol hours go over your BH allocation, and that does help.

EineKleine · 21/03/2017 00:17

Sorry Bruffin crosspost. That does sound harsh with stat min allowance and the double whammy of working Mon and Fri. It is still fairer than you getting more holiday than everyone else pro rata though. I think it should be much mitigated if you can take some of the BHs as unpaid or work them in lieu. Might be worth raising with your LM or HR. If you want to address it, the coming FY is the time to do it as Christmas falls badly.

There is a reason why every single PTer I know at work has Mondays off!

Bluewombler2k · 21/03/2017 07:22

I think I am more confused than I was at the start of this thread Grin

GreyBird84 · 21/03/2017 07:32

Im in a part time job share & our employment also incurrs closure days.

I work second half of week, job share first.

My manager calculates how much annual leave each is getting per year inc BH & closure days &
Whoevers has the most sets the holidays for that year for us both.

So neither of us get 'done out' generally I like second half of the week as I get all bank holidays plus time in lieu.

Very lucky I know!

Newtssuitcase · 21/03/2017 07:41

I'm an employment solicitor.

Your employer is absolutely right. You get pro rated salary and pro rated entitlement to holidays (including bank holidays).

In the same way you only have to work a pro rated number of days per annum.

The way to look at this is that you are entitled to a pro rated number of leave days. This should not have come as a surprise to you and it isn't something I would expect the employer to have to point out to you prior to you changing your hours. You still get the bank holidays off you just don't get paid for all of them.

If the employer did it any other way then you would be getting more paid leave (days which are paid but where you don't have to work) than your FT colleagues.

Those posters who are saying this is unfair or discriminatory are quite wrong I'm afraid.

Newtssuitcase · 21/03/2017 07:48

Anyone thinking of reducing their hours and relying on leave in this way should also keep in mind the fact that you have no legal right whatsoever to take leave when you want to take it. An employer could quite legitimately tell you that you have to take all your leave in the month of march for example (as long as they give the correct notice).

Some employees will have contracts which specifically state that they have to take leave on bank holidays or which separate out leave into bank holidays and other holidays. They work slightly differently.

BeyondThePage · 21/03/2017 07:51

When I joined I was given a choice of days - I deliberately don't work on Monday precisely because I do not want a load of my AL to have to be taken on fixed days. The other BH are pot luck as to what days they fall on.

I was once asked to change to Mon and refused unless I got an extra few days leave to cover. The boss hadn't even realised some people had a problem with it.

Berthatydfil · 21/03/2017 07:56

I think you're losing out on a double whammy by working Mondays and Fridays, as apart from Xmas and NY, most other bank holidays fall on those days.
I would ask your employer to change to either working Mondays plus 2 other days not inc Fridays or Fridays plus 2 days not inc Mondays and then you will get the benefit of one of them,