to ask DH to do some housework when he has been at work all day?

[MrsSportacus]

My DH works long hours. He is out of the house by seven and home about half six. On Wednesdays he plays badminton after work. On Saturdays he goes to watch his football team, Sundays he sometimes plays golf and he plays online poker for a few hours every night. He doesn't really do any housework at all. I'm a stay at home mum and don't really see anyone during the day. If he's away I can go days without speaking to another adult. If I complain he says it's my fault and I shouldn't rely on him. He's tired after work and needs to unwind. He says I need to make friends and do things without him. However I can't drive and we live a long way from my friends and family. Am I being pathetic? I think I'm a bit PND as my youngest is eight months and I've been miserable since he was born. I feel such a nothing...I need to get a grip! Sorry for being so wet.

I don't agree with Xenia that you can't have equality and control in your relationship if you don't earn the money. It's not easy, but working outside the home is not necessarily easy either. You have to negotiate your way through and, like I said earlier, it's always much easier to negotiate if you have confidence in yourself that you are doing a fantastic job, whatever that job might be. It is up to you to position yourself as a fantastic mother, household manager, supportive partner rather than a downtrodden skivvy. To begin with, do all the stuff around the house that makes you feel great about yourself (I like making sure my bathroom and bedroom look wonderful, my clothes cupboards are organised, my kitchen always ready to receive visitors for an impromptu meal, all my paperwork up to date and in order, my daughter's bedroom a little girl heaven) and leave the heavy tasks (taking things for recycling, putting things in the attic), clearly defined, to your husband. And don't even bat an eyelid at employing people to do heavy odd jobs your husband doesn't want to do - you should never clean windows, drill holes in heavy walls, clear out drains or anything like that. It doesn't matter whether you are at home or in the workplace - do the jobs you enjoy and give you satisfaction and delegate the tasks you hate. If you love being with your children, fantastic, that doesn't mean you have to do every last menial task at home or you won't even be a good mother because you'll be too depressed.

xenia is defined by her job

some of us have inner confidence and no need of the 'approval' of the workplace!

Am slightly at Anna8888's comments - good advice generally, but maybe just putting a bit too much pressure on yourself? I mean, what happens if you do a less than fantastic job as a home manager one day - does that invalidate you as a person?

Mrs Sportacus, if roles were reversed and you worked full time, I bet you would still do housework. Totally agree with whoever it was who said your job is to raise the children - it doesn't necessarily follow that you have to do everyting else in the house too.

IMO you and your dh have to free up some cash in the household to get you driving lessons; somehow or another your dh has to be more engaged with his own family. It sounds like he is almost living like a bachelor - except even a bachelor would have to do his own housework...

Good luck

Xenia enjoys her job more than being with her children. So be it - even though as Xenia and I have discussed extensively elsewhere it is quite hard to be sure that you are not damaging your relationship with your children if you leave their care to others. For those of us who enjoy being with our children more than working, and believe we should be with them for our and their well-being, we all need to learn better negotiation tactics for our relationships to work. Actually, I think a lot of us were brought up on the false premise that we would achieve equality with men by working and feel disappointed or secretly ashamed when this fails to materialise. We don't achieve equality that way because we don't have the same needs and skills.

doggiesayswoof - motherhood is like any other job, you need to do it well and feel confident in yourself or you get trampled on/fired. Sure, we all have off days (for which we need to forgive ourselves), but you don't want to have too many or you won't feel happy. It's up to us to work out a life we enjoy and can manage, and that changes over time. I know that when my daughter goes to school I would like to work again, but only if she doesn't suffer at all - ie maybe two days a week, where one days she'll be picked up from school and spend the afternoon with her grandmother and the other I'll get a nanny share with another child from her class and they can play together.

MrsSportacus, are you busy with your dcs? I fear your thread may have been ever so slightly hijacked and may be turning into a SAHM/WOHM punch and judy show...

Yes, isn't it? I was going to post back in answer to Anna8888 but I can't raise the wherewithal...

anniemac - if you read the whole sentence, you will see that I am in no way belittling those mothers who have to work to survive and who have all my sympathies. In any case, I think we all, whatever our situation in life, can improve our negotiation tactics so that we get a better deal that suits each individual. I'll give you an example - my stepsons always arrive here filthy with inadequate clothing as their mother and nanny take terrible care of them. I refuse to have dirty, unkempt children around and used to wash their hair and cut their nails (and worse). Until I thought - what is this? I'm not a slave. Now I just tell them that there's no supper unless they are clean and fresh in clean clothing. It works fine.

Back to the OP...

I would tell him that we needed to re-negotiate our contract, discuss what needs to be done etc. You can't do everything and look after a baby, and you can divide up what needs to be done. It should be a team approach, imo.

Also, I would suggest you find some NCT or similar coffee groups/baby groups, and get out there! I've made some of my best friends ever since having children. It also helps you to get things in perspective when you do other things outside the home. What about a yoga/gym class with a creche?

some of us dont have an effing choice - with regards to the workplace.

haven't read the thread in full - would like to say i would hate your life. your dh is a cunt.

the only person who can change it is you. if you dfine yourself by your children - when they are grown or goto school - who will you be?

motherhood doesn't mean - No social life, NO hobbies, No activities, No time out, No evening class, No driving lessons, No self improvement, No gardening, No walking the dog.

think about it - if you and i were to regularly converse - do you think i would find your daily talk of children tedious?

i think i would - but your daily talk of children, along with your other stuff, hobbies interests, people you have met, odd quips, friends you have, what happened down the gym, how well your doing with your night class,

a fusion of interests and things to talk about. things that make you - you.

if you feel trapped. if you want a better life - maybe you need a smaller mortgage? smaller house?

NCT - is still children.

you need to go play badminton. or do something without the blasted kids. Let him mind the fucking kids.

get rid of broadband

no online poker for him - a driving lesson a month for you

agree with custardos post

particularly the cunt bit

actually hold on

I do agree with custardos post but not perhaps when your baby is only 8 months old

how may other kids do you have?

Well it may be children, but it is a start. You at least can find people you have something in common with. I don't think the husband is , but I do think he's getting away with not pulling his weight. He might just need to have it pointed out to him that life changes when you have children. Don't allow yourself to be treated like a doormat is my advice.

ipersonally would rather eat my own arse than get my kids ready to go to a place with YET more of the bloody things where you have tosmile and be goodmum

you need timefor you.

do the NCT thing if it floats your boat - but dont for one second mistake it for time for you.

by the way - if he works long hours - i dont think he should be doing any major tidy ups apart from heling toclear away after a meal or take his cup into kitchen little things - not major tidy ups. i would also not resent having to cook ( not implying you do just saying)

I did feel it added to my sense of well-being to do NCT coffees as well as an evening class. And I see marriage and family as teamwork and not a fight over who deserves to do what when they're at home. I certainly don't expect to look after my husband when he gets home. He mucks in, and does at least half the cooking. But hey, maybe that's just me!

I haven't read all the replies but I agree with the ones about it's family money your DH earns so he should either let you draw on it for your own things or even give you an allowance for you to do as you like with (driving lessons, membership of a sports club, a new lippy, whatever). After all, if you weren't there, he'd have to turn to to do the h/work or pay someone to do it for him. It's only fair that you feel free to spend the money as you see fit, after all, you are an adult and in charge of his DCs!!

First of all talk to your GP or HV about your suspected PND and then ask them about community events you could get along to with your DC or visit the local library, read the local rag, check on google etc. Then get out to at least one or two places a week. Your HV might be able to put you in touch with organisations like NCT.

Thirdly you'll have to discuss the h/work issue with your DH if you want him to contribute towards that. I don't see why he can't do stuff to help you in his free time, after all, loading a washing machine only takes a few seconds and then he's got 45 minutes to play poker online. Perhaps you could get him to stop poker and employ a cleaner/babysitters instead? Just a thought then you could enjoy some quality time together.

MrsSport - If my dh did any of that in his free time I would tell him to get a different wife !

If he can't be bothered to help you, he should PAY for a cleaner.

Try to make friends if you don't have some already. Leave kids with dh or grandparents and go out for dinner or cinema with your friends, etc once a week without kids.

I do this once a week. Dh looks after ds while I go out.

Get help with your PND my darling.

Both my DH and I currently work full time - me 45 to 55 hours a week, him 50 to 60. NEITHER of us want to do ANYTHING when we come home from work. We're too bloody knackered. We squabble about whose turn it is to cook/ wash up blah blah. Very annoying.

I often find household "staff" as much work to manage as do it myself. If DH was a SAHD, I would expect to come in at night and flop on the sofa and do F-all other than spend time with my family. He wouldn't expect me to either.

Being a SAHM IS a full time occupation, but I've been at home with a baby before, and also spent some time being a SAHM with an school-age child and I find it very hard to believe that you can't get everything done during the day on a fairly regular basis. We all have off-days and children get sick and things come up, but surely in 9 hours at home with one or two children, you can manage to clean, cook and do the laundry?

Completely agree that SAHMs need time off AWAY from the kids and access to the family's finances just as if they were earning themselves, but I think it's reasonable to expect to do the regular housework.

I'm about to become a SAHM again, so I'm not just spouting off without any knowledge.

Sharing responsibilities on weekends is reasonable, just as if both parents are "out" at work, they would expect to share at weekends.

"but surely in 9 hours at home with one or two children, you can manage to clean, cook and do the laundry? "

Are you quite sure you've had a baby?

Actually to be fair I think it depends on the ages and personalities of the children.