why should house of lords be able to determine our future?

[dreamingofsun]

Could someone explain to me why an unelected group of people (many of whom seem old/senile/out of touch with every day life) determine our terms of leaving the european union - and whether we leave it at all. the british public voted to leave - so why do they think they can alter that? why do they think they can over-rule what the majority of public said?

It really is terrible the ageism batty, old, duffers,

The Lords haven't stopped us leaving the EU anyway, they are merely saying how they want it to be carried out. Theresa May could accept the amendments and then get on with it. Absolutely nothing is stopping her other than demented control freakery

If you want to see true battiness, consider what the likes of Nuttall and Farage get up to. The Lords would have to go some to beat that

True! then one looks over the to Eu and sees even more battiness, thank goodness we voted to Leave. We have enough of our own batty, corrupt, silly politicians.

And UK sn'r remotelt weird in being a monarchy. One third of countries are

I was thinking about how many countries have UNELECTED second chambers and a Monarchy?

There can't be many democracies who have such a system.

But what's the point of Parliament voting on the terms of Brexit? What if they don't like the terms and vote against it? Then what happens?

The Lords haven't stopped us leaving the EU anyway, they are merely saying how they want it to be carried out

Aren't they proposing amendments to the bill which need to be voted on in the Commons as well?

The House of Lords can add amendments, vote on amendments but it can't dictate anything. Merely suggest, revise and ask are you sure?

Checks and balances - needed in every democracy or else a lot of power rests in one person's hands.

The Lords are trying to keep our sovereignty in the EU. We want to hand it back to our elected MPs. That's why the Lords are out of order.

Where on earth do you get that from? It simply is not what is happening. Can I suggest you go and check the facts immediately?

And you do know that our MEPs are elected by the British electorate, don't you?

Checks and balances OP. That's the way it works. They're trying to make Brexit less unpalatable and insane to the 48%.

Maybe you could explain to me why a Prime Minister who didn't actually come down on one side or the other during the shameful referendum campaign is so determined to press ahead with wrecking the country and offending our closest neighbours?

Then what happens

The Government then needs to come up with terms that are acceptable to Parliament.

Thry haven't voted to stop brexit!
I'm fed up hearing this usually from people who havent a bloody clue how our system even works but hey they read some numbers on the side of a bus and liked a guy who holds a pint

The vote was to leave the EU. It was not a vote for "arrange whatever deal you like and dont ask parliament or when you do its take what I offer or I'll turn down any deal we get because I'm a self serving prime minister who gives zero fucks about you normal folk". The Lords are asking for safeguards for UK citizens living abroad and EU citizens living here.

Most Brexit voters wanted parliament to be sovereign. But seemingly some dont actually understand what that means.

There are many smart people who voted brexit and whilst I disagree with them, I respect the outcome of the vote. Those sensible people have no objection to parliament having a vote on the deal because they are smart and know how parliament works.
Sadly, when the hysterical folk come out claiming everyones being mean it risks making brexit voters look like utter morons.

Most Brexit voters wanted parliament to be sovereign. But seemingly some dont actually understand what that means

They also wanted UK courts to have the final say on UK law. Unless the courts uphold the law, Then look what happens.

UNELECTED PRIME MINISTER There was I thinking that the PM was also an MP, and thus elected. She was elected by the Tory party as well to lead them. The last time I looked, the country does not elect the PM. There wasn't all this sturm and drang when Major took over from Mrs T, (and then railroaded Maastricht through); neither iirc, was one G Brown 'elected' by the country when he took over from T Blair, (and signed Lisbon on the quiet).

People who voted Remain had a pretty good idea what they were voting for.

People who voted Leave voted for 17,410,742 different versions of Brexit. What is happening now is just one of those versions. What a nightmare. Don't blame me. I voted Remain to avoid this nightmare.

The main vote was for leaving the EU - not hard, not half in and half out OUT.

Quite Scary, I wonder who people would rather see in TM place.

The problem with Parliament and political parties right now - is a huge disconnect between voters and their representatives, ie - who are they representing.

She was elected by the Tory party as well to lead them

Indeed she was. The Tory party does not have a mandate to undertake hard Brexit or soft Brexit.

Gordon Brown and Major did take part in an election though within their party. Theresa May was unopposed by anybody when she became leader.

There certainly was plenty of Sturm und Drang about Gordon Brown being unelected, scaryteacher. The Mail and Express and their faithful readers were constantly whinging on about it.

They also wanted UK courts to have the final say on UK law. Unless the courts uphold the law, Then look what happens.
The judges were performimg checks and balances.
All this enemies of the people stuff is hysterical.

People who voted Leave voted for 17,410,742 different versions of Brexit
This.
Some people voted brexit because of an opposition to transfer of power, others because TTIP was worrying, others because they simply hate peopel who aren't british and think that somebody with a degree and professional training is stealing their job when they have 4 GCSEs.

Point being the vote was to leave.

Personally, i think the final deal should be put to the people. At the very least it should go to parliament who could send Mrs May back to negotiate further.

I dont like the bullying tactics of "you'll get whay i like and tough shit".

What i hate even more is that trying to explain checks and balances to half the people who voted leave is like playing chess with a pigeon. (And most sensibke leave voters arent the ones screaming hysterically).

for what it's worth i voted remain because for a number of reasojs but this kind of chaos on leaving was one of them. I respect the result but refuse to be bulled by the loud mouth politicians who seem to thinking that shouting brexit means brexit gets the people on side. It only gets prople on side who'd probably also believe that a reality TV star will make your country great again

amispartacus do you think that was a good move or a bad one? Seeing what could have happened? I think she stepped up to the role and the Tories managed to swiftly sort themselves out under immense pressure and drama.

The same however cannot be said for the Labour party nor the Lib Dems.

The problem with Parliament and political parties right now - is a huge disconnect between voters and their representatives, ie - who are they representing

If an MP is part of a constituency that voted Remain, should they have voted AGAINST the bill.

My area voted Remain. My MP defied Corbyn and voted against the bill recently.

Many areas voted Remain.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36616028

The main vote was for leaving the EU - not hard, not half in and half out confused OUT

I simply have no idea what you intended with your leave vote then, if not one of either 'hard' or 'half in, half out'?

Yes I'm remembering this Sturm and Drang re Gordon Brown too..."I didn't vote for him" etc

Please could we have some actual education in schools about the British political system given that so many people are too idle/dim to pay attention in everyday life.

amispartacus do you think that was a good move or a bad one? Seeing what could have happened? I think she stepped up to the role and the Tories managed to swiftly sort themselves out under immense pressure and drama

It would have been useful for her to have been voted - either in election with her MPs OR with Conservative members.

Then she could have discussed the issues and her opinions and been elected within her party.

Out Maid - Simple out of the EU. In all respects.

Out Maid - Simple out of the EU. In all respects.
So 'hard' then?

Out Maid - Simple out of the EU. In all respects

Parliament needs to debate what type of Brexit we would like and the red lines in the sand.

The UK voted Leave - well, 52% vs 48%. Parliament needs to debate it.