To think DD's punishment from PE teacher was draconian?

[moonlightshadow1]

DD is in Year 10 and came home quite annoyed about a punishment she got in PE for something very minor in the first place. Her teacher made her get changed into her PE kit at lunchtime (without any tracksuit in the cold wet weather), and run laps around the football pitch for all but the last 15 minutes of the break (so she could eat), much of it whilst the boys were having football practice, who apparently found it quite funny. Is it overreacting to think this is a bit out of order? I might not have been surprised when I was at school but I can't help be a bit annoyed, seems a bit like it was intended to embarrass her and unnecessary.

Actually OP, for some students the 'punishment' of sitting out is anything but.

I would imagine this is not the first time your daughter has been disruptive in PE and the punishment of laps was to now finally deal with a culmination of low level, but nonetheless disruptive and undermining, behaviour. The problem with these posts is not only do parents not have the teacher's side, they have no idea of the bigger picture.

You're going to pursue this regardless so does it really matter what we think?

I meant "lippy" in a way which isn't uncommon to teenagers

That still doesn't make it ok I'm afraid. Can you imagine a teacher having to deal with "Lippy" teenagers every day, every lesson? It's definitely not appropriate to talk back to a teacher and very disrespectful. She was made to sit for the lesson so she wouldn't cause further disruption and asked to do laps to make up for the PE she missed, like payback.

If you are questioning the severity of the punishment I think you need to contact the school and hear the teachers side. Based on what you have been saying it I doubt it was just for one lippy remark!

On the plus side, I bet she has learned not to do it again.

Yanbu.
DD's PE teacher was similarly draconian, reminded me of the one in Kes.

Those of you that think it was OK, would you think it was fine for a maths teacher to make a child run around the field?

No.
However it sounds as if the punishment was handed out directly after the PE lesson.
PE lessons take place either in the hall, the gym or sometimes on a field ( think)
That is why the PE teacher likely chose the field.

I'm shocked that so many don't see how this is wrong and I'm even more shocked that people can't see how a 14 year old girl would find having to do laps around a group of lads playing football embarrassing, appropriate pe kit or not.

Op I don't think you're being unreasonable. It sounds like she was already punished in class and even if not, there are many less humiliating ways of reprimanding bad behaviour.

First things first though, I would discuss this with the school, hear their side, make sure your dd's description of what happened is accurate and go from there.

Irvine and limitededition, I would say a 14 year old having to sit on the floor cross legged in front of their class on their own like a little kid in assembly is quite embarrassing, she certainly found it so and would rather have joined in (but I don't have a problem with this punishment as I've said many times, she was talking when the teacher had told them to be in silence).

OP, is it possible the teacher was supervising the football at the same time as getting your DD to do laps? which would explain why they didn't use the empty field.

She sat out during PE so had to make up the exercise she would have got if she behaved, which really isn't any different to being sent out of a lesson and having to make up the work at lunch. Not letting her wear her tracksuit in the cold and wet does seem a bit much though.

For most misdemeanours, I would agree with you that it is an inappropriate punishment.

But for messing about in a games lesson, I think it's actually okay.

If a child messes about in my lesson badly enough to warrant a punishment then it will be to come back at lunchtime and either do the work they didn't do while messing about (more consequence than punishment imo) or do extra work as punishment.

This is the same thing for a games lesson, isn't it? It's like having to do extra work in any subject.

The no tracksuit thing was a bit OTT though, if she wanted it on.

And the humiliation thing isn't necessarily games specific either. I teach performing arts so I don't have any free lunchtimes. Therefore the offending child sits and does their work/extra work in front of my rehearsal or club. Again, same thing as the running in front of a football practice. Not intentionally humiliating, just necessary multitasking.

Oh, total X-Post with Sparklyunicorn !

Do you think the punishment will make her think twice before getting lippy to the teacher?

moonlight, if she has recently been made to sit like a little kid in assembly. it sounds as if she has form for being rude to teachers.
It seems as if the sit and think about your actions shite didn't work and she continued to be lippy and disruptive.
Rightly or wrongly, maybe this latest punishment has got through?

She was giving cheek, that's really undermining for a teacher, and then sitting out may have been 'embarrassing' but as others have said the punishment was fitting for a PE department. The only thing which may have been unreasonable is the no tracksuit but here context is everything. Maybe putting on her tracksuit would have required going back to change, taking up more of the teacher's time.

Sometimes I think some Mnetters would be happier writing the school's behaviour policy and handing it to the teachers.

Sounds fair punishment to me.

Hmm, I wonder if the boys laughing and having a good look at op's daughter, were punished accordingly. Seen as they should surely have been paying attention to the football practise.

Therefore the offending child sits and does their work/extra work in front of my rehearsal or club

I wouldn't say it's the same thing really. Sitting and doing work quietly in the background of another class would be much less humiliating than having to run laps around them, especially from the perspective of a body conscious 14 year old.

This is bullying, would an adult accept a punishment like this?? Physical punishment? No I don't think so. I'd complain for sure

Did the pe teacher actually ban her from running in her tracksuit?? Or did she not have it as she wasn't expecting to need it? If she was banned that was OTT if it's part of the pe kit she should have been able to wear it if she wanted. As for the rest I presume it was the in field so it could be supervised and if I remember being a teenager right you have probably only got 50% of the story of what went on, so maybe it was the straw the broke the proverbial back. If you really think it was inappropriate I would get th teachers side and if not satisfied raise it with the head of year.

DeleteOrDecay thank you, I completely agree and that's very good advice.

SparklyUnicornPoo as I understand it the teacher who was taking the football doesn't teach my daughter at all, he's a football coach and my daughter's PE teacher was supervising her though not the whole time, but the football coach was just concentrating on the football, and boys doing drills near her when he was with others were laughing and joking about it (I asked why their teacher didn't stop them).

manicinsomniac I see your point but still think making a teenage girl run around in front of boys of a similar age is insensitive and not great from a teacher to say the least.

Maybe it will make her think twice before being cheeky to this teacher but that doesn't make it a fair punishment.

Your daughter was disrupting the lesson for other students and stopping the teacher from doing their job.
You are minimising this. "Hardly the crime of the century" she's "not unique" in doing this.
She received a consequence for her poor behaviour. Sounds fair to me.

Do she had been disruptive and been sidelined, then had extra work added too?

I suspect DD may still have been a PITA whilst in the sidelines, hence the extra punishment,

Teaching PE is ruddy hard work. Dealing with disrespectful, lippy kids wear you down. Bring lippy is unacceptable behaviour.

Maybe she needs teaching the age old method of apologising.

Pupils who actually apologise for the misdemeanour and mean it (i.e. Don't repeat it) tend to only get as far as that initial stern word.

If there's further punishment then there's been further misbehaving from your DD. You need to get the other side of the story from the school's perspective before you do anything else.

They are all marching out of step, except my Johnny.

I don't understand how humiliating her in front of the lads is thought to be an appropriate punishment I'm quite concerned some people on this thread thinks it is!

Every PE teacher I met in my albeit slim experience did tend to be more military and old fashioned in their punishments which unfortunately didn't help with behaviour (in fact it tended to make more extreme misbehaviour that escalated very quickly) and tended to make the GCSE take up of PE quite small!

I don't think you can say anything as your DD was in the wrong. It's shit and I think the teacher handled it very poorly but your DD is equally not blameless.

That sounds like sensible advice Mrs T.

As a teacher and previously head of year, I notice with some amusement how you keep saying it's nothing major, she is just a bit lippy. Teachers get fed up wth constantly having to deal with low level disruption. I am not commenting on the punishment, but you seem almost to condone your daughter' s behaviour in your comments.