Call the Midwife - FGM

[Littlepiglittlepig3letmeIN]

At first I thought the programe makers were doing a good job at highlighting how wrong this practice is, and yet at the last moment, they normalized it by making out it's tradition.
I felt they missed a good opportunity to get through to the right people.

The programme makers can try and dress it up however they want - trying to make out it's tradition and it's the women that facilitate it.
Women may carry it out, but
It's men who are behind it.

It's heartbreaking to think that even in this day and age, little girls are still being butchered and disfigured by these barbaric animals.

Can anyone explain why perfectly legally obtained female genital piercing, on an adult female became reportable under the laws covering FGM? There seems an abundance of knowledge on this thread and I am genuinely uncomfortable with the conflation of the two in the legislation, which quite rightly sets out to prevent a barbaric and horrific practice, and yet somehow now encompasses something totally different in its net

And I'm the one frothing?

And I'm the one frothing?

You do come across as the one frothing.

Geez, school nurse inspections would be an abhorrent idea. Mainly because silly white middle class have no clue in identifying correctly which cultures operate FGM (see south Africa mentioned upthread).

Desolate, out of interest,
what training do you have?

Genuine question.

Littlepig

I didnt say that I did, I said that others clearly did and that you r attitude to them os worse than what you are accusing them of.

But dont worry about it. You continue frothing on MN and not actually achieving anything.

This is caused by patriarchy, obviously, as is labioplasty and other ways in which women mutilate themselves and each other in order to be fuckable for men.

With FGM, it is just much more obvious.

All this shit is done by women, to women, and only very rarely do men admit that it is they who enforce it.

I have been told by enough males that they dislike my hairy legs, though.

The pressure is mostly applied by women, and disguised as beauty practise that women do "for themselves".

But if a woman proves stubborn enough, eventually, a male will come along and tell her in no uncertain terms that he considers her unfuckable and that he expects her to change.

Little, I am a primary school teacher in a mainly white British school. I get training every few years on the signs of FGM, the forms it can take, what to do if you suspect it, the parts of the world it happens in and how to approach it.

I'm sure that teachers in schools with a more diverse cohort they get more frequent and intense training.

That all of us who know about this, have had training on it are doing nothing.

The reason I ask is that a lot of places now offer their staff some sort of safeguarding covering FGM. (Even frothing unknowledgeable me) has had safeguarding training.

But I wouldn't class it as 'training' as such. And it definitely doesn't make a person an expert.

It's because the actual mutilation happens abroad

No it doesn't. I think this softly softly approach actually isn't working. The UK is now apparently regarded as a safe place to cut. In other European countries with significant fgm practising communities prosecution is much more common, although you only need one prosecution to be more common than the zero we have had. There is evidence that people in Europe are now bringing their daughters to London to be cut as it's cheaper than travelling to Africa with vertualy no chance of being prosecuted. I'll look for a link in the morning.

I listened to this interview with Heidi Thomas back in January:

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b088b8c7

(Can't hyperlink on my stupid phone) but she explains very well the stance that the programme took on FGM and why. Worth a listen.

I wouldn't say I was an expert, far from it, but I think I know more than the average person who perhaps has only just heard of it thought CTM.

Can anyone explain why perfectly legally obtained female genital piercing, on an adult female became reportable under the laws covering FGM?

Isn't it obvious? if you start denoting what is and isn't an acceptable level of deliberate genital change you allow loopholes which can be exploited.

It's far far preferable to report and then filter over 18yrs genital piercing, than it is to allow certain types of true FGM through the net because they can argue that its in an anatomical area where it is allowed.

Also, some piercings are genuinely reportable because there are piercers who pierce underage girls genitals.

Velvet I would imagine just because it's easier to have everything under one umbrella so that people can't claim "it's cosmetic" - presumably an adult wishing to get a genital piercing signs some kind of consent form?

WRT taking the children away ...I can see all the negative sides but just a thought ....
if you took them away -took them out of that 'culture' -away from the traditions - they would be less likely to grow up to believe they should inflict the same on their DDs...it would help to break the chain.
but I guess that also has all kinds of both moral and practical considerations...
I think education is the way to go -but then if someone is surrounded by their mother and grand mother and aunts etc all telling them they should do it...with the knowledge of how to do it/where to get it done...that education will have to pretty good and the mother a pretty strong character...

I live in a lovely village with a very good school and this came up last year with dd12 as her friend, someone who's mother I am close to and have brought our children up with, became distressed during a lesson about girls bodies. It transpires she had this performed on her aged 7 and nobody knew

She was ill over the holidays I recall with glandular fever so we didn't see her but we had no clue. I know the parents didn't allow sleepovers but not all parents do so was shocked when we found out. SS were informed by the school but she still lives with her parents and the worst thing it was done in this country according to dd1. Dd1 had nightmares over this and dealt with trained counsels but I don't encourage the friendship as my dd needed to move on.

rugbyballz

Hmm. I'm not convinced. In this country we are very good at prosecuting tens of thousands of motorists every year for speeding, but it seems that prosecuting people for allowing their daughters' genitalia to be brutally and irreversibly mutilated is put in the "too difficult" box.

I would like to see a much, much more aggressive approach by the authorities and large numbers of abusers and enablers thrown in jail for a very very long time. That would, of course, mean large numbers of children being taken into care, but that would surely be a price worth paying to eradicate FGM in the UK.

As I thought.

No disrespect Desolate,
I've done safeguarding training covering FGM , numerous times and I definitely don't consider myself very knowledgebale
Neither should you..

The people who are out in the communities and helping in the clinics, yes they probably have more of an idea than we do.
But not you.
No offence.
A couple of sessions doesn't make you an expert.

I don't really agree that you can blame the men. It will eventually be wiped out like Chinese footbinding. I didn't even know about FGM till I saw a programme about it a few years ago.

No one on here as claimed to be an expert.

Hmm. I'm not convinced. In this country we are very good at prosecuting tens of thousands of motorists every year for speeding, but it seems that prosecuting people for allowing their daughters' genitalia to be brutally and irreversibly mutilated is put in the "too difficult" box.

I would like to see a much, much more aggressive approach by the authorities and large numbers of abusers and enablers thrown in jail for a very very long time. That would, of course, mean large numbers of children being taken into care, but that would surely be a price worth paying to eradicate FGM in the UK.

But they're only children.
We have to take the softly softly approach

*has

I noted that, at the end, the voiceover said that when it came to the little baby, her mother refused to let her go through that , and finally got her way on it . Change really can only come from those it effects and I hope they get that change but as a pp stated its the older generation keeping this up . Let us hope education stops another one .

As I understand it with footbinding the Chinese government at the time took a very hard line approach, executed people preforming this and wiped out the practice in no time. This was once the decided women were more productive if they could actually walk. Footbinding is of course much harder to hide. Also my information on this just comes from what somebody told me years ago, I haven't bothered googling so could well be wrong.

Btw, not suggesting execution as the solution.

At no point did I say I was an expert, just that I know a little more than the average person who has just this minute heard about it from CTM.

I think you need to revisit your training as you don't seem to have taken very much away from it.