To dare speak about Vaxxed on MN?

[thegoodfight]

NC for this but a regular.

So I've just watched the documentary Vaxxed. I know how vaccine threads unfold on MN, so I'm ready to be told IABU however I feel like everyone should see this whatever your views - it's about the cover up around studies into autism and MMR

There is an admission from a CDC insider that he worked on the study and hid data which proved a link (a strong an quite frankly astounding one) and the data was sent to an external biologist who saw it for himself. There are first hand accounts from parents, scientists, doctors and politicians. The CDC haven't denied anything or called their lawyers despite it being an allegation of the biggest medical fraud ever (not exact words but something along those lines)

I just can't believe it's not been in the news! AIBU to ask if anyone else is planning to watch it??

The paediatrician told us that it's quite common for there to be a regression around 13 months which then makes it very apparent that a child may have autism. Of course the autism was always there but this is the point when it can become very apparent (for other children it's apparent much earlier and later for some) which is why some believe that the mmr is the cause. My DS had a sudden almost overnight regression around this age. However, due to illness his MMR had been delayed so he hadn't yet been vaccinated.

The children of those parents on the documentary would have still had the same regression which came on just as suddenly, but due to the timing they blamed that.

There's a wealth of evidence that autism happens inutero including a recent story about brain scans on young babies which showed a difference at only weeks old.

I think so much of how we develop is due to what happens in utero and that research into this is only in its infancy (pardon the pun). Did you see the study last year claiming that what your maternal grandmother ate when she was pregnant is more relevant than what you eat when you are pregnant? Crazy stuff - as if we need more to worry about when pregnant!!

Applebite
That's incredible. Off to google grandmas pregnancy eating habits

OurBlanche, the single measles vaccine was introduced in the UK in 1968. The mumps vaccine wasn't introduced until the MMR in 1988.

Where were these measles and mumps deaths that you know about?

The 15% complication rate for measles includes things like diarrhoea and ear infections - the most common.

You see Bumbley I didn't say MMR. Your pedantry quibbling has tripped you!

My post was about vaccination being available via schools during the 60s and the reason so many parents were keen to have their kids given what was available.

DH's reaction was to polio, early 60s mine to that other triple jab, the DTP.

Happy now?

Ah! I see. You concatenated 2 threads, and in so doing got muddled!

A mother’s diet can change the behaviour of a specific gene for at least two subsequent generations, a new study demonstrates for the first time

Yep! Here's one link: hms.harvard.edu/news/what-grandma-ate

Here's another: www.livescience.com/21902-diet-epigenetics-grandchildren.html

www.newscientist.com/article/dn10518-you-are-what-your-grandmother-ate/

and of course a fail link saying that of course your mother's diet can cause cancer, because daily mail!

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3119180/You-mother-ate-diet-pregnancy-affects-genes-long-term-health-future-child.html

It's just one example but the whole area of what happens in utero is huge. it also means that I can blame my lardy diabetes-risk-laden gut on my grandmother's stodgy war diet...!

OurBlanche what sort of reaction did your DH have to the polio vaccine? I had the one on the sugar cube in the 70s and it almost killed me. My parents were categorically told never to have me vaccinated against anything else. As far as I am aware it was a screaming high temperature for 14 days, lots of vomiting....goodness knows what else. My gp at the time was very surprised I survived.

Oooh Bugger! I did say MMR!!! Hands up, my error... a typographical one.

But I did mean DTP... that being the one that I was given at that time!

How embarrassing!

I'm not muddled at all. I know they are from two separate posts. You said 'nearly everyone got measles etc' in the 60s after two other people posted about having measles and mumps. You then said vaccines were given in schools. You wouldn't have been getting the measles vaccine in school in the 60s as it didn't become available until 1968 and its uptake wasn't very good until 1980.

Your second post in response to Peggy said that you knew areas where someone has died from measles and mumps in the last few years. Where?

Sorry x-post. I'm still interested in where the deaths from measles and mumps were though.

Mimi he went limp, was very hot, had a rash, straight to hospital. Turned out he had scarlet fever!

You're still concatenating, I should have been clearer.

Deaths from measles = x 2 children, Wales. Easy to find.

Incidence of measles and mumps, recently, even the WHO have stepped in to make a statement.

"I know for a fact that in the trust catchment area we live in no child has died from either of these diseases in the last 5 years." (Measles and mumps)

You: And I know for a fact a few areas were that is not the case.

Iirc The last measles death in wales was in 2013 in an adult male with asthma. Do you have a link to the other two in children?

The WHO statement irt measles was about deaths being at an all time low worldwide. Do you have a link to the statement about mumps? What did it say?

You wouldn't have been getting the measles vaccine in school in the 60s as it didn't become available until 1968 and its uptake wasn't very good until 1980.
nonsense, I queued up at school for my measles vaccine in probably 69/70 when i was about 8 when there was a big catchup campaign in schools. I didnt have it because of family history of febrile convulsions. I was scared of having an injection then relieved when i didnt have to have it. I went on to have measles a year or so later, and was very unwell,.

After 1970 the number of cases of measles steadily decreased, so the catch up campaign made an impact.

I was bloody ill with measles as a child, it turned to encephalitis and my parents were panicking. One of my very earliest memories is of DF standing me on the kitchen table to look at me and me screaming in pain because the light hurt my eyes so badly :(

I've always had slightly dodgy eyesight - fine to see but I get terrible after images and ghosting and haloes, and I've often wondered if it's connected (never had it checked out as I can see well enough so it may well not be).

Do you mean the 2012/2013 outbreak OurBlanche?

"During the outbreak there were 447 cases of measles confirmed from the Mid and West Wales area, 64 cases were admitted to hospital and there was one death."

www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/888/page/43749

The corresponding data from PHE in 2013 shows 961 confirmed cases (from 5422 suspected cases that were tested) and 1 death.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/measles-confirmed-cases/measles-notifications-and-confirmed-cases-by-quarter-in-england-2013-to-2015
www.gov.uk/government/publications/measles-deaths-by-age-group-from-1980-to-2013-ons-data/measles-deaths-by-age-group-from-1980-to-2013-ons-data

I can't find any data on deaths from Mumps. This is generally considered a pretty mild disease (especially in childhood), so I'd be interested if new data showed deaths from it. Incidence has been rising in young adults because of the MMR wearing off - is that what you mean?

Measles was well know at the time foe eye problems. Parents used to put children in darkened room to prevent it.

Bumble If I say I typed loosely, irritated with a post I read as being a bit "I'm alright Jack" will you cease the pedantry?

Absolutism is really offputting. I typed without thinking, I was annoyed, I was wrong.

I hope that fulfils your apparent need to chase down an error and quibble it until it squeaks

Mimi he went limp, was very hot, had a rash, straight to hospital. Turned out he had scarlet fever!

Are you saying that scarlet fever was a reaction to the polio vaccination, or that he actually had scarlet fever and not a reaction? Or, was he told it was scarlet fever when in fact it was a reaction? It isn't clear from what you said.

On the topic of scarlet fever...where did that disappear to without there being a vaccination against it?

Y0uCann0t see my post above. I was lax, didn't post as specifically as I should have, so differentiation between death and incidence got lost.

Mumps: I did find it somewhere.. mainly in the .gov stats www.gov.uk/government/publications/measles-confirmed-cases/confirmed-cases-of-measles-mumps-and-rubella-in-england-and-wales-2012-to-2013

Jesus! The pedantry is spreading.

I was not there, but, as the story goes, he went in to school a happy chap, had his polio vaccine and within a couple of hours was red hot, semi conscious and rushed to hospital.

As it turned out he had scarlet fever, sod all to do with the vaccine. His mum decided that the doctors were telling the truth and had her other kids vaccinated. She did not insist, ever, that the vaccine caused the scarlet fever.

Oh, and it hasn't gone away. Just this morning (another coincidence) it was announced that we are experiencing a possible epidemic: The number of scarlet fever cases has risen from 5,746 last winter to 12,906 cases this year.

Various breakfast television shows and newspapers are reporting it!

On the topic of scarlet fever...where did that disappear to without there being a vaccination against it?

I wouldn't say it disappeared - there were 10,000s of cases last year. It's impact has lessened though, fair enough, and that's mainly put down to improved living conditions, better nourishment giving better overall immunity, and antibiotics.

I'm not meaning to be pedantic OurBlanche - I cross-posted your response to Bumbley. I'm interested in epidemiology and thought perhaps there'd been outbreaks I hadn't heard of.