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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think the rape laws in the UK are sexist and should be changed?

316 replies

StuartAteMyStrawberries · 07/02/2017 23:43

Only men can be charged with rape in the UK. Women can be charged with sexual assault but not rape.

AIBU to think this is outrageous and that anyone who has sex with another person is a rapist and should be charged as such?

It was legal for a man to rape his wife up until the 1990's and the law was rightly changed to make it a criminal offense. AIBU to think we should change the definition of rape so that women can be charged with it too?

OP posts:
FloraFox · 08/02/2017 00:59

STD transmission from male to female is significantly higher than female to male. Do you consider that to be a fun fact?

venusinscorpio · 08/02/2017 01:00

GangstaRat, I am also sorry for you. I think there is a better case for that offence being classified as rape. But that wasn't the discussion in the OP.

SuperBeagle · 08/02/2017 01:00

I, too, am wondering why, if sexual assault and rape are considered equals, you still feel the need to have a separate definition for "rape". If everything else is defined under the banner of sexual assault, why can't the acts currently defining "rape" also be considered under "sexual assault"?

LoupGarou · 08/02/2017 01:00

So how would a woman force a man to have sex with her without the use of physical force?

  1. Blackmail
  2. Having a weapon such as a gun
  3. Grooming and/or ongoing psychological abuse which makes the man feel like he has no choice but to comply
  4. Drugs or alcohol

Those are just a few ways, there are many more.

worridmum · 08/02/2017 01:01

fun fact women live longer then men on averge but untill recently got to retire much much earlier (yay for useless none important facts to the topic at hand.....)

FloraFox · 08/02/2017 01:01

It is useful to keep statistics on the number of rapes so we have a clear picture of the extent of male sexual violence against women.

I've yet to see any compelling argument in favour of changing this beyond itsnotfair foot stamping.

GangstaRat · 08/02/2017 01:02

AVirginLitTheCandle, does it really make you feel like a feminist to smugly inform a woman who was raped repeatedly as a child that no, actually, you weren't raped, you have no right to call yourself a rape survivor?

I don't care what the laws in your country say (and your own local laws are NOT global) don't you fucking dare go around telling women whether they are or are not allowed to consider themselves rape victims or not.

This thread is the definition of marginalising rape.

brasty · 08/02/2017 01:02

Fun fact - women are much more likely to retire into poverty than men.

Anon1234567890 · 08/02/2017 01:02

LoupGarou, a good list but you missed the most common. Domestic violence.

LoupGarou · 08/02/2017 01:04

Venus the issue being discussed is about men being raped by women, women can use objects to penetrate men, its not just the case of forcing men to penetrate a woman. That is why I highlighted that bit of your post.

SuperBeagle · 08/02/2017 01:04

I've yet to see any compelling argument in favour of changing this beyond itsnotfair foot stamping.

The compelling argument that did away with the term here is that it damages victims of both sexes. By dismissing women who are sexually assaulted in non-penis-penetrative ways a being "less serious" cases than those who experienced penis-vagina sexual assault, you are making it much more than just being mildly unfair.

Dunno, it worked here. We've survived without needing to use the term rape. Maybe we're just foot stomping tantrum throwers though.

LoupGarou · 08/02/2017 01:05

Anon I would class DV under grooming and/or psychological. That is how I meant my post to read, apologies if it didn't.

AVirginLitTheCandle · 08/02/2017 01:05

AVirginLitTheCandle, does it really make you feel like a feminist to smugly inform a woman who was raped repeatedly as a child that no, actually, you weren't raped, you have no right to call yourself a rape survivor? I don't care what the laws in your country say (and your own local laws are NOT global) don't you fucking dare go around telling women whether they are or are not allowed to consider themselves rape victims or not.

Are you being deliberately goady or you just looking for a bunfight? That's not what I said at all.

SuperBeagle · 08/02/2017 01:05

women are much more likely to retire into poverty than men.

Which has precisely what to do with this discussion?

Anon1234567890 · 08/02/2017 01:05

What is the difference between a man shoving a penis inside a women. And a woman shoving her vagina onto a penis. I get one is more common than the other but both are rape and destroy lives. BOTH male and female.

worridmum · 08/02/2017 01:06

GangstaRat using what people here are saying the young boys that have been groomed and sexually abused cannot call themselves rape victims as currently they cannot be raped if their abuser is female were as if the genders were revesed it would be rape.

If they are both equally bad why does male on female sexaul assult need a special term called rape if both crimes are equally serious? Why wont people answer this?

FloraFox · 08/02/2017 01:07

If you're talking about Canada, there are many people who believe it did not achieve any benefit but minimised rape by calling it sexual asssult.

GangstaRat · 08/02/2017 01:07

But that wasn't the discussion in the OP.

The minute you start a thread predicated on the concept a penis is needed to rape, that thread automatically includes all victims of non-penile rape.

A lot of posts have marginalised certain forms of sexual assault and as a woman and a rape victim I personally consider that deeply offensive.

SuperBeagle · 08/02/2017 01:08

If you're talking about Canada, there are many people who believe it did not achieve any benefit but minimised rape by calling it sexual asssult

I'm not talking about Canada.

AVirginLitTheCandle · 08/02/2017 01:09

The minute you start a thread predicated on the concept a penis is needed to rape, that thread automatically includes all victims of non-penile rape.

Then you need to take that up with the (mostly male) UK law makers.

SuperBeagle · 08/02/2017 01:09

If they are both equally bad why does male on female sexaul assult need a special term called rape if both crimes are equally serious? Why wont people answer this?

They won't answer it because they don't have an answer. They say that sexual assault and rape are equally bad, but still feel the need to cling to a definition separate to all other sexual offences. Why? Because "sexual assault" is less punchy than "rape", therefore they are not considered equally bad.

FloraFox · 08/02/2017 01:10

Gangsta this is a UK board and the OP was talking about UK laws.

venusinscorpio · 08/02/2017 01:10

I very much doubt that the OP meant that he was penetrated with an object by a female partner. I imagine that she had PIV intercourse without consent where she used his penis to penetrate herself. But I could be wrong.

As I've said, I personally support penetration with an object in the vagina or anus without consent to be rape.

FloraFox · 08/02/2017 01:10

Rape is a crime committed by men. It has in the past and continues to be part of women's oppression by men. It is sexist that so many men rape so many women. Pretending that women do it too diminishes the nature of rape and it's effect on all women.

worridmum · 08/02/2017 01:10

but does the need of a penis really mean that a women using a strappon to assult a women is less bad because its not a bioloigcal penis? and in turn that she is not a rape victim because she was not violated with a penis so should be classed as sexaul assault?

And gangstaRat has proven my point is that RAPE is considered a much more serious crime then sexual assult......