to still be cross about the outcome of the EU referendum?

[mynamesnotsam]

I'm still so angry and can't forgive those who voted to leave. After the result there was much talk of how the two sides must put aside their differences but I don't feel there has been any attempt to try to appease the 48.1% of people who voted to stay. I also want to rip the head off any one who says it's the will of the people. They should be legally obligated to say it's the will of 51.9 % of the people who voted. If the vote had gone the other way you can bet that UKIP would still be making a huge fuss about it but remainers are expected to "just get over it"!

Thanks Brompton

@ BromptonOratory

"And I'm struggling to work out quite how to express this, but I actually feel there is something a bit crass and which leaves rather a nasty taste in the mouth about using NI and the fears over destabilisation of the GFA as a stick to beat leavers with."

The problem is that no one knows what will happen now, but NI/ROI/UK relationships will no doubt change after Brexit no matter what.

Can you not see this.

brompton I said upthread that I didn't know about NI before the vote - I really only came to understand here.

I also didn't know other things that others have shared here. I did know the economic effects and the predicted effect on the City because these are where my interests lie and where my best understanding is.

I didn't even know about Euratom (did anyone?) and I have a family member who works in nuclear energy in the UK?!

That list I posted with the 57 things on it is complicated - lots of those things are complicated and with the exit negotiations expected to take up to 10 years, the complexity of this becomes even more apparent.

This is precisely why we should still be angry - this should have never been put to public vote. The only reason it went forward is because it was advisory and non binding. Had it been binding a supermajority would have no doubt been required for a binding result.

We should all be angry at the politicians who misjudged and have thrown this country into such hideous uncertainty.

And cuddling up to Trump? Shit, if that had been forecasted, I'm sure the EU would have looked positively benign as an alternative. But alas, it's just yet another thing that could not have been predicted but didn't have to happen had we not been put into this position in the first place.

Yep. Feeling the same.

Found myself looking at people I once respected and feeling rage at them for being so bloody short-sighted.

Well, I'm trying to be generous grin I wouldn't like to think that anybody totally knew that, for example, NI would be totally screwed up by Brexit and thought "Haha, sod them!"

The Brexit campaign were vehemently against the peace process in Northern Ireland.

Michael Gove compared the peace process in Northern Ireland 'to the appeasement of the Nazis in the 1930s'.

Nigel Farage called the Northern Ireland peace process 'utterly and entirely loathsome'.

"Haha, sod them!' is exactly what they were thinking.

I am extremely cross

God I missed all that about NI.

I was so in blissful denial that the vote would easily be to remain.

While my DH was having a nervous breakdown that the vote was going to be leave.

The NI issue will affect more than NI. But nobody in May's Government seems to care.

Please watch this space. If they don't care about NI as part of the UK, who or what do they care about really?

meltownmary absolutely you are right.

@FuckOff.

I am very concerned. Even though I have no contacts with NI, I just feel the lack of concern for them is telling about the way this thing is going.

And it may affect ROI relationships aswell. I hope not, it was hard won under the GFA.

Peace has been in place since 1998. I really hope it won't be scuppered. But does anyone in Westminster care?

It is all Trump and Erdogan now.

A very important part of the Good Friday Agreement for the nationalist community in Northern Ireland was that the UK government committed to incorporate the European Convention of Human Rights (ECHR) into law of Northern Ireland. This was very imprtant as the nationalist community had encountered severe discrimination in the past.

However, Theresa May's now plans to scrap the Human Rights Act in the UK. This will jeopardise the peace treaty as it is a breach of the Good Friday Agreement.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-facing-likely-legal-challenge-to-block-human-rights-reforms-in-breach-of-northern-a7500416.html

NRTFT but yes I'm still cross (and more than a bit pissed off at how long my Irish passport renewal has taken - no thanks to the thousands of new applications they've received!!!)

I'm sorry I just can't bear to read it, it's all so awful. The thing is, there are historical precedents of wars caused by referendums, by direct democracy. The extent of risk is so profound for this type of vote. It's so painful and horrific what these politicians have done. How do they sleep at night?

They don't care, do they. They just don't care.

user270 I was meaning about ordinary voters for Leave, who on these threads have mostly said that they hadn't known about the NI issue at all. (OK, the response from some Leavers now that the problem has been pointed out to them is )...

That the ringleaders for Brexit were odious arses who cared nothing for the effects on ordinary people, I am in total agreement with.

Brompton, I don't live in NI anymore, but my parents and extended family do. I grew up in what was essentially a warzone. Peace has been so hard won and so fragile. A return to conflict is a horrifying thought for me - and Brexit will do so much to destabilise the region. My home town has a lot to lose.

The OP asked if people were angry. Yes, I'm still raging. Mainly with Cameron and senior Tories for their arrogance and stupidity in opening it up to referendum in the first place, but also with those who voted leave who didn't seem to get their heads around any of the issues actually involved. And this kind of information was there and easily accessible if you had cared to look for it.

So you think it's 'crass' to hound you about this now? Well, I'm sorry your feelings are hurt, but my hometown will feel the effects of this and the memories of what we might to return to are very vivid for me. It's a very real fear, it's not scaremongering and I find it deeply upsetting that the UK as a whole cares so little.

Haven't read the thread. Get over yourself. The MAJORITY of people wanted to leave, so we are leaving. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and unfortunately yours was in the minority.

Haven't read the thread. Get over yourself.

And we have another utterly conclusive argument, folks.

We've voted to leave. I'm not happy about it and feel that lots of the claims were lies, but that's the vote.

Now we voted to leave the focus should be on getting the best deal and holding the government to account e.g adding ammendments that means the final deal should go back through parliament, avoiding having our NHS handed to US firms, avoiding becoming a tax haven etc.

There are many ways this could go. What we can't do is allow factions of the leave vote to scream "it's the will of the people!" When the government is held to account. The 'will of the people' is Brexit, NOT sign up unquestioningly to anything Mrs May wants.

Haven't read the thread. Get over yourself. The MAJORITY of people wanted to leave, so we are leaving. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and unfortunately yours was in the minority.

And it's this belligerent, entrenched, ill informed attitude that got us into this in the first place; blinkered and ignorant.

Can someone tell me why Trump's Muslim ban is fundamentally different to May's citizens of nowhere?

In the US green card holders have been detained. Those living there with them afraid that they may not be able to stay indefinitely.

In the UK EU citizens have been detained in record numbers for dubious reasons by the home office. Those here legally have been sent letters telling them to make preparations to leave. Long term futures are uncertain. By hey that's ok. They are our bargaining chips.

As MPs rush to condemn Trump, particularly Conservative ones, maybe they should reflect on this.

This is why May's response to Muslim Ban has been so weak and so late.

And perhaps people who are in horror about Trump but perfectly fine with Brexit ought to take one long hard honest look in the mirror and stop defending the same shit happening in this country.

If you can't start admitting you are a fascist and have done with it.

Remember Deadsouls you mustn't use naughty words like blinkered and ignorant. Especially not for posters who have such indisputable pearls of wisdom that they don't actually need to read anybody's posts nor stick around to face any responses (mustn't call that cowardly)! (See also the charming breastfeeding one at 23:07 yesterday).

Red toothbrush, so right!

Red you're absolutely right, I've been saying the same for ages

It was pure jingoism that got us into this mess, that's what the almost 52% voted for as opposed to the 48% that didn't.
I can't believe that we are going ahead with this on such a slim and flawed mandate. Where is the £6 000 000 for the NHS that was a leave election pledge?
HSBC are going to move their operations to Frankfurt, other industries will follow.
Brexit is just foolhardy and unbelievably sad.

I find it surprising that people voted out without any knowledge about NI. I knew a base amount about the EU and trade beforehand so didn't do that much research before deciding, but even that small amount turned up the NI question.

I don't think it's good enough to shrug having voted out and say it's not your problem. At least own the fact that your vote has contributed to a potentially volatile situation. You vote for the whole package - not just the things you think are important.