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Original poster

Smacking as discipline

118 replies

aintnobodygottimefodat · 13/01/2017 11:39

Posting here for traffic.

My next door neighbour has a just turned 2 yr old toddler. Our houses are semi's with only us attached iyswim. Now, as expected with toddlers and children, we hear a lot of crying. Their DC is left with dad a lot as mum works full time and he does evening work.
I've noticed a pattern over the last year or so; their DC cries a lot more when left with dad. On occasion, I've heard dad shout and scream when DC cries, fair enough, not the way I would handle it, but it can be very testing. I've also heard very clear, unmistakable smacks Sad sometimes 4/5 in a row. Not a "tap on the hand".
This is fairly distressing to hear. Their DC cries even harder after this and it literally turns my stomach and makes my blood run cold.
I heard this again a few nights ago, after the mum had also been shouting and screaming at him. So she was definitely present when this last incident happened.
It (the smacking) has happened maybe 10 times in the past year.
Whenever we see the neighbours we always give a friendly hello, but we're not overly friendly. I don't think they would take kindly to us approaching them about it, or even offering a cuppa and a chat.
Their child is not neglected from what I can see, and we often hear him laughing and playing.
So my question is what would you do? Have a word with health visitor? Ask for advice from nspcc? Or just leave it?
If we reported it would be obvious it was us, as we're the only ones attached, and no way other neighbours could hear.
Ugh, bit of a moral dilemma here.
Thanks for reading.

OP posts:
dollydaydream114 · 13/01/2017 16:27

The couple are on their 40's and I'm guessing he is of the generation "a smack won't do any harm"

Er, I'm in my 40s and DP is almost 50 but neither of us would ever dream of smacking a child - particularly not in that way. I don't think is an age thing at all.

There is absolutely no way anyone should be smacking a child hard enough for it to be heard through the wall of a house. Yes, sound travels, but not to that extent.

I think you've done the right thing by telling the HV and I also think you should call the NSPCC for advice. Even if you've misread the situation, you are doing no harm by putting in the call.

Trifleorbust · 13/01/2017 16:29

ElphabaTheGreen: Well, I disagree, clearly. It's not illegal so it is just a difference of opinion.

Original poster
aintnobodygottimefodat · 13/01/2017 16:30

Dolly - yeah, sorry... I definitely worded it wrong Blush Of course I know that not everyone in their 40s has that awful attitude.

I should have said he's got the "it did me no harm" attitude.

OP posts:
NotYoda · 13/01/2017 16:31

Only one person on this thread thinks this is OK

Let's not derail it by trying to convince them.

OP please do the right thing

Headofthehive55 · 13/01/2017 16:31

It's up to the parents within reason whether they smack or not. ITs not illegal unless they leave marks. You've done the right thing reporting though.

Ilovewillow · 13/01/2017 16:33

No child or adult should be hit it's disgraceful and violent imo. I would say though both my husband and I are are in our mid 40's as are many of the families we know - we have young children and we have never or would never smack our children.

Bluntness100 · 13/01/2017 16:35

If you hit a two year old four or five times and it can be head in the next house, you're leaving marks. No two ways about it. It's illegal as well as pure evil.

dollydaydream114 · 13/01/2017 16:36

Some children need to be smacked harder and more often than others

There is something seriously wrong with anyone who thinks a two-year-old - barely more than a baby - 'needs' to be smacked four or five times in succession, hard enough to be heard through a wall.

I totally understand that a parent might give a small child a tap to 'shock' them in extreme circumstances - but your description of a child that 'needs to be smacked harder and more often' is repulsive and creepy.

specialsubject · 13/01/2017 16:37

Those now forties/fifties generally brought up their kids without smacking, although it was done to some of us if we were really naughty. The regular clout for bad behaviour went out as acceptable in the generation before.

Can't speak for the younger ones, don't know any !

MatildaTheCat · 13/01/2017 16:38

Do report this yourself, it is an absolutely valid concern. Can you make a list of incidents to back up your concerns?

I wonder if your HV was just being very professional in that she didn't look too worried, hopefully she has gone away to do some digging and will mention it to her colleagues at SS. However, you have no way of knowing that so don't assume she will.

I saw a woman in the park the other day and her son, aged about 4 was dawdling on his bike and she said completely matter of factly, 'Hurry up or I will smack your bottom.' I was astonished. He really wasn't even doing anything wrong. Poor kid. < I am early fifties, the generation of happy smackers was my parents and they threatened more than they actually did any smacking>.

dollydaydream114 · 13/01/2017 16:38

I should have said he's got the "it did me no harm" attitude.

Oh, OK - no problem, I do understand what you mean now. :)

Bluntness100 · 13/01/2017 16:42

Those now forties/fifties generally brought up their kids without smacking, although it was done to some of us if we were really naughty. The regular clout for bad behaviour went out as acceptable in the generation before.

smilingsarahb · 13/01/2017 16:44

It's kinda illegal..unless you use the defence that it was 'reasonable punishment' . For it to be reasonable punishment you can't use something to hit them with ..so actually it hinges on weather reasonable punishment is 5 smacks loud enough to be heard through a wall...my gut instinct is this would leave a mark which could just be a strong red mark (not necessarily a bruise) which is common assault on an adult but could be actual bodily harm on a child. It's a bit of a grey area. You have a good defence for a single sharp tap leaving no mark if that's what you chose to do.

madein1995 · 13/01/2017 16:47

Op please report. Im not going to go into a debate on smacking but this could be the missing puzzlepiece professionals are looking for. Its unlikely but think how many tragic cases would have been prevented had someone said something. Imo everyone in contact with a child has a duty to safegusrd that child. If theyre shouting, screaming and smacking what else are they doing out of earshot? The safeguarding peolle wont let anything slip. Contact your LSCB and make a referral. Ring the NSPCC. talk to nursery teacher or similar. Dont ignore - how would you feel if you didnt repprt and the kid was being seriously abused?

RebelRogue · 13/01/2017 16:57

I still don't get how you can hear it,especially if not skin on skin. What exactly do you hear?

festivefucker · 13/01/2017 16:58

I hope you are 100 percent sure that is what the sound is, I live in a semi and even the hardest smack wouldn't be heard.

Lottapianos · 13/01/2017 16:58

Dear god. There's always people who pop up on smacking threads to defend it and tell you to keep your nose out but my jaw is on the floor at some of the comments here. Anyone who thinks that smacking or 'tapping' (or however else you try to justify it to yourselves) is in any way ok needs to ask themselves how they got so messed up in the head

OP, well done for reporting to HV. She should take it seriously and follow it up but obviously can't discuss it with you. Phone NSPCC is you need more advice

Original poster
aintnobodygottimefodat · 13/01/2017 17:06

I am certain that it is smacking that I can hear. It's not a "sharp" slap. So makes me think he is smacking through clothes?

Rebel - if you're wearing trousers, smack your leg. Then smack your bare skin. There's a difference, no?

Thank you for your responses. I feel better that I have mentioned it to HV, and I suppose she may have been keeping a professional demeanour by appearing so straight faced about it. I think I will call nspcc just for advice and call 101 if I hear it again. I really hope I don't though.

OP posts:
Lottapianos · 13/01/2017 17:07

Even if you're wrong about it OP, much better to have reported it than to do nothing. Well done for standing up for that little boy

Cherylene · 13/01/2017 17:17

Some children need to be smacked harder and more often than others - ah yes - that is when you have to get the wooden spoon out, or it will hurt your hands Hmm

OP - have a word with NSPCC. If that is all it is, the worst that will happen is that they will be encouraged to go on a parenting course.

I don't think I could live with listening to it - it would remind me too much of my childhood Sad

lilyboleyn · 13/01/2017 17:35

This reminds me of something I saw last week - the only time I've truly had my judgey pants on for someone's discipline.
The kid (about 9/10) was playing up and the mother kicked him. And yelled at him, 'don't make me kick you again, stop asking me to buy you stuff!'
I was Shock but we were on holiday and there was no way to trace them/report.

Potnoodlewilld0 · 13/01/2017 17:41

NSPCC op

I don't even know why smacking your kids isn't illegal. If an adult was smacking an elderly lady or gent when they where 'misbehaving' they would be charged with assualt.

It really is not ok to smack another person especially when then are vunerable.

madein1995 · 13/01/2017 17:48

OP well done for reporting.Think you're riht and HV was being professional. Bear in mind though that you do have a right to be kept informed on the outcome. If you feel nothing has been done, or you're told it's been 'non actioned' and you think that wrong you can go to the LSCB, or children's services or similar, and they need to look into it. Well done.

Purplebluebird · 13/01/2017 18:46

Glad you've reported it, and yes do ask for advice and phone someone if it happens again. Hope it gets resolved.

SVJAA · 13/01/2017 18:55

I think smacking gets an unfair press. Children need discipline, and this normally means an occasional smack. Some children need to be smacked harder and more often than others. They know their child better than you do, so I'd say leave them to it. The fact that you can hear it doesn't mean it is cruel - it could just be that you've got a keen ear, or the walls are not very well soundproofed
If you can't discipline your kids without fucking hitting them there's something wrong with your parenting, not your kid. I don't hit anyone when they piss me off, let alone my kids, who are tiny people who look to me for guidance, boundaries and security, not a smack. Ugh.