To wonder if this discipline was excessive of my mother?

[PineappleFwitters]

My mother always physically punished us as children. It's what she grew up with and what she knew, but I think it happened more because she lost her temper than because I was badly behaved.

Once, when I was about 12, I was keeping an eye on my brother but also reading my copy of Mandy (yes it was that long ago!) Before I knew what was happening my brother, who was probably about 9 months at the time, rolled off the bed and fell into the (carpeted) floor. He was not injured (as the bed was fairly low) but he cried, and my mother came storming into the room, slapped me and tore my magazine into pieces.

Now I don't deny that I should've been keeping a closer eye on my brother, but was her behaviour not a tad OTT? Again, I think she lost her temper and didn't know how to deal with it. I don't hold a grudge against her but I do wonder if it's why, even today, I get easily annoyed with her. Part of me is worried that I might wind up acting like that with DC, but fortunately so far so good.

Anyway not sure why I'm posting this really, maybe to see if my feelings are justified or if her behaviour was excessive.

LaContessa, my mum didn't manage to rein it in. When I was about 16, and several inches taller than her, she started to beat me around the room because I had taken a glass of her coke (with her permission, but she had forgotten). I warned her, and then slapped her very softly in the face. She never laid a finger on any of us again.

Not leave the baby lying on the bed?

Make sure the 12 year old wasn't doing something distracting?

Both my partner and I have made silly mistakes resulting in babies falling off beds or similar. Strangely we managed not to hit each other.

That was to bertrand

Bertandrussell I'd like to think I can answer that.

I've an 8 year old and an 18 month old. Generally I don't think a child should be responsible for a child. It's not my 8 year olds burden to watch his baby sibling, so even when I ask him to keep an eye on the baby, I'd only leave them in an already safe situation.

However I did once lose my temper when ds1 was swinging a toy around right next to the baby's face, it was so dangerous and I snatched it from him and shouted.

Who knows how he will have interpreted and remembered that.

I think by the standards of the day it was probably quite normal but by today's standards, excessive. We hold mothers in particular to very high standards these days.

The thing that's striking about the incident you relate is not so much the punishment but the lack of justice: you had done nothing wrong for a 9 year old (looking after the baby was her responsibility as an adult), yet you were punished in this flare of temper that must have been frightening for you.

I think the fact that you've realised that being a SAHM wouldn't make you happy is a good step towards ensuring you don't repeat your mother's mistakes. I am nonetheless sure that in 30 years, daughters of Mumsnetters will be on whatever site exists then, noting things that our generation 'did wrong'. The wheels of history keep on turning...

Of course, and as I said earlier I don't believe in hitting anyone for anything ever.

But if I asked my 12 year old to watch a baby and the 12 year old was so engrossed in their I pad that they let the baby fall I would be angry and punish. Wouldn't most people?

bertrand

I would. No iPad for a week, maybe?

Exactly shovetheholly what will our children hold against us?

We worked too much? Went on mumsnet too much?

Bertrand, I have read a huge number of posters on this site mention that their baby had fallen off a bed or a sofa while they were watching them. If it is an accident that a parent shouldn't beat themselves up over (as the posters are always assured), why does a child deserve punishment in the same situation?

Yes. Taking away the IPad and a telling off. I can't understand why people are saying that the 12 year old OP did nothing wrong.....

But she shouldn't have been hit. Obviously. I might well have torn up the magazine.

What would people do nowadays if they asked their 12 year old to watch the baby, and the 12 year old was so taken up with their iPad that they missed the baby falling off a bed?

I'd probably tell them off and confiscate the iPad for a few days. I wouldn't smash the iPad to pieces or slap them, as that would be more a reflection on my temper than their behaviour. Accidents happen, if we want to reverse it, my mother was once looking after my DS and he burned his hand on the heater. Did I fly into a rage at her? No. She felt bad about it but I said not to worry as accidents happen.

Oh I'd definitely roar blue murder at a 12yo who let one of my DC be hurt (even if the 12yo was one of my own DC too). BUT there is no excuse for socking someone because they really, really annoyed and upset you. What good would it do? What would you be trying to achieve by letting yourself assault someone? And you WOULD be letting yourself do it.

As most of the previous have said, it wouldn't be acceptable by today's standards but norms were different then.

There is no point judging 70s behaviour by 2017 standards, it doesn't achieve anything.

I would've been very cross & upset if you were reading a mag instead of doing what you were supposed to & your DB was hurt as a result so some punishment was warranted but 21c punishment would not involve anything physical.

Agree with shovetheholly and zara.

This was pretty normal back then. I was frequently slapped and sometimes my mother had indeed lost her temper. I honestly dont think anything of it. She also used to send us to the shop for her fags. It was just the 70s and she was probably at the end of her tether.

But my rsponse is framed by the fact that I was very loved. I still am. I know that. You sound like you're not so sure and are questioning your childhood.

Fwiw I dont hit my kids. Times have changed. I do, however, lose my temper and I'm sure our kids will have things to berate us all with in 20 years.

Pineapple there's no doubt your mum lost it and went ott.

But I think more importantly, was she like that all the time? Would she acknowledge now that it was wrong?

This is why 12yos shouldn't be left to care for babies. Stuff like this happens and a child doesn't need the responsibility of caring for a baby. Different if the child is older and able to get themselves around the place. A 9mo baby needs adult supervision or to be put into a safe place (cot or playpen).

"Accidents happen, if we want to reverse it, my mother was once looking after my DS and he burned his hand on the heater. Did I fly into a rage at her? No. She felt bad about it but I said not to worry as accidents happen"

But it wasn't an accident. You had been asked to do something and you didn't do it.

I feel I should add that the bed was maybe a foot and a half max off the ground so my brother wasn't hurt.

I think one of the reasons I remember finding her reaction excessive was because a couple months earlier my brother had been sitting on her lap while she had a friend over and she let him play with one of my other brother's hand-held electronic games. She didn't notice he'd managed to take off the back panel and swallow one of the small round batteries until it was too late, so had to rush him to the doctor. So I wasn't sure why she was allowed to make mistakes yet I wasn't!

And of course a 12 year old can look after a baby for a while!

Yes, I've acknowledged that I should've kept a closer eye on him but the point of my OP is that her reaction was excessive.

But I think more importantly, was she like that all the time? Would she acknowledge now that it was wrong?

She was always flying off the handle tbh, over the smallest things. In fact I remember once bringing up this incident years later and she just laughed and said that's what she's like when she loses her temper. Any attempt to call her out on her behaviour still results in her bursting into tears and refusing to acknowledge that she's done anything wrong.

When you judge the past by today's standards, then yes indeed what you describe is totally out of order.

But back then I don't think anybody would have batted an eyelid.

Times have changed for the better, at least as far as that sort of thing goes.

Pineapple I remember finding it very, very galling that she was allowed to make mistakes but that I'd get ripped a new one for the same offence. Kids do notice blatant parental double standards. I quietly filed it under 'Reasons why I don't trust you' in my head, same as I would for anyone else.

She's crying to deflect you from chasing the topic. Probably guilty, although she may never admit it. What good would it do if she did though?

Parents are human beings. Even the kindest, most wonderful mother will lose her temper at some point. Both my parents slapped me two or three times, when they were at breaking point, and my mother tore my magazine once, too, when I refused to pay attention to her. They were (and are) wonderful, loving parents. It happens.