Shopping with DS wheelchair…just sounding off as I am fed up today

[Livingtothefull]

1. I went to the supermarket in the big town near us last week with DS (16) who is in a wheelchair….went to look for a wheelchair trolley, found just one which was broken.

Waited at customer service desk while they checked if there was another one available. Waited for a long time….DS got agitated with the waiting (he has learning difficulties). Eventually they confirmed there was no other wheelchair trolley in the store, despite it being a large branch of a big, household-name supermarket.

Without a wheelchair trolley I can't do my shopping as I can't push a normal trolley or carry a basket and manoeuvre the wheelchair at the same time. So in the end they had to send a member of staff with me to assist me.

1. Went shopping again with DS today in another branch of the same supermarket. Again just one wheelchair trolley which was broken so same thing again.

I don't think it's too much to ask that I can just come to the supermarket, get a trolley and do my shopping like everyone else, without having to wait around for a solution because the one suitable trolley is missing or out of action.

DS likes travelling on the bus (there are limited things in life for him to enjoy but he does enjoy bus journeys) so I agreed to get the bus home with him. The bus turned up but the driver didn't open the side doors or drop the ramp down for us. So I went to speak to him while the other passengers were getting on:

Me: 'Could you let us on the bus at the side doors please?'
Driver: 'Sorry no there's no space for you'.
Me: 'There's lots of space, we need the wheelchair space.'
Driver: 'There's a buggy on board'.
Me: 'But that's a wheelchair space, wheelchairs have priority'.
Driver: 'No the buggy got on before you and she already paid for her ticket, and that's that.'

and drove off. He didn't even ask the people with the buggy to make space btw.

I had to wait for the next bus to come, this had a much larger buggy on board but the driver let me on and the mother with the buggy happily made space…no need for her to get off the bus.

What upsets me about this is: the odds are that most busy buses will have at least one buggy so if every bus driver took the same attitude as the first one, DS & I could easily be there all night. Also DS may have a meltdown if he is forced to wait to long and believe me his meltdowns aren't pretty (have posted previously about these).

I am having a rant and I know all this sounds really negative but please try to put yourselves in my shoes?

Ha you shitting up

Nice typo. I think.

So you're making fun of my dyslexia? Lovely, as if it wasn't disabilist enough

I think everyone is shutting up now, Sunshine!

Op - I hope you have had a better day, and let's all hope for better facilities and better understanding for all people with disabilities.

Ffs Sunshine - there are no other typos in your post and somehow I am supposed to guess that it was anything but a typo.

As you say You can't know the ins and outs of other people's conditions.

unborn - is your ds really sure providing a disabled trolley is only a courtesy? My understanding of the relevant part of the Equalities Act is that of 'reasonable adjustments' to facilitate equal access. I would have thought that providing one trolley that wasn't even working was not making a reasonsable adjustment

The town I live in is awful for this. I was on a bus once is was shitting it down and this poor woman and young child in a wheelchair tried to get on, driver says bus is full. Clearly not! So I said hang excuse me everyone, could we all bunch up please and could the owners of these empty buggy's fold them for this lady, no line complained and everyone was more than happy to help. Bus driver too lazy to even ask!

I haven't finished reading the thread yet but lots of people saying get a copy of the bus company's policy. Have you looked on their website yet? I've just looked at ours and it says:-

'Our drivers are asked to fully comply with the law in respect of the wheelchair space on our buses and will always ask other passengers, including mothers with pushchairs and buggies to vacate the wheelchair space. If for any reason you are unable to board and you aren't happy to wait for the next bus, our taxi guarantee will ensure you are not left stranded and our driver will make contact with our Control Team to arrange a taxi on your behalf.'

Just to confirm that it is the law and not at bus company's discretion in case your particular one tries to wriggle out of it when you phone to complain!

Pixel - I just looked up our local bus company (Metrobus) which I think operates in many places - its website said

If for any reason a wheelchair user is unable to board, we can provide a complimentary taxi under the Wheelchair Taxi Guarantee Scheme. The driver will arrange this for you

This should be better publicised

a wheelchair space on a bus is for a *wheelchair" not a buggy or a person with a hidden disability........but a wheelchair. its not top trumps. but the (in my area) only space a wheelchair user can go,

So sorry you had such a crappy day. I was unable to walk after an operation for 3 months, and although it was a short time, it made me realise how hard everyday life is if you have to use a wheelchair all the time. I personally found ASDA brilliant. Not a supermarket I normally shopped at, but they were easily for disability access.

YANBU, that's appalling.

I'm not at all surprised by the supermarket at fault though. I live near a city with all the supermarkets and don't have a regular one because I live near none of them. Every single one has rafts of disabled parking - except Waitrose.

This doesn't affect me unless my mum is staying. The one and only time I went to Waitrose with her it took us ages to park and I mentioned the meagre number of blue badge spaces to the customer service desk. The lady on there looked (with disgust imo) at my mum and said 'I'm sorry to hear of your experience. Our clientele don't tend to have mobility problems'!

I'm glad you've complained.

Scratch - it doesn't matter how many hidden disabilities a person standing or sitting in the wheelchair space on a bus has - unless they're in a wheelchair they don't have priority over a waiting wheelchair user. It's not a disabled space, it's a wheelchair space, campaigned for by charities for wheelchair users.

Blue badges, toilets and trolleys are entirely different.

Lifts I guess are for anyone who doesn't fancy using the stairs (unless it's one of those little platform wheelchair lifts) but people should use courtesy and common sense.

it si about bloody time buses got themselves sorted and there was space for more than one wheelchair or buggy. (my children would not have coped out of the buggy as it turns out they are disabled, but yet to have received the diagnosis at that point. I used the car as it was easier ) it is not fucking rocket science that it is likely that there are going to be more than one person wanting the space at any one time and the space needs to be flexible. say there was room for three or four buggies, it is likely that at least one of them could be folded to make room for a wheelchair. also bloody drivers need to be flexible enough to let people fold/park/carry baby to seat etc before they drive off...or get the bloody shopping off the bus as well as the buggy.

Blackeyedsusan I think they should bring back conductors. I don't suppose they'd go back to having them do the tickets (though I can't see why not, then the driver could concentrate on driving), but it would be invaluable to disabled, elderly, those who need to fold buggies or get off with a lot of shopping to have someone who could help.

Rant away, my OH has to use a wheelchair on occasion, and it is is very difficult

Dear all, thanks for all your support and info. I also found the attached link re current bus policy:

www.transportforall.org.uk/public/bus/

There is no way that the driver in my case followed any part of the procedure set out here…..he just barked at me that the passenger with the buggy 'had paid for her ticket'; this maybe in reference to the fact that my DS doesn't need to pay? So my DS is just seen as a freeloader?

I can't find any policy relating to trolley availability for the supermarket in question, however as a poster above pointed out, the law stipulates that reasonable adjustments should be made to enable access for the disabled. This should cover the need to provide these trolleys; or alternative equivalent support.

I don't see why I should have to make an appointment to pre book a supermarket trolley for a specific time just to go shopping, with a non refundable fee if I don't turn up. Be honest; would anyone else put up with that?

Re lifts: I frequently got out of a lift to make way for a wheelchair or, for that matter, a buggy or someone with crutches etc. So if I am in the lift with DH and DS, or alone, and it stops on a floor and someone who needs the lift is there & can't get on, I will get out and take the stairs/escalator and meet up with DH/DS. No way would I just stay put and let the disabled person wait for the next lift, if I didn't need it. I thought that was just common consideration.

Yet the times I have waited for the lift with DS, and am greeted with a lift full of able bodied unencumbered people who stare blankly at us, refuse to move and let the lift doors close….I just don't understand it.

Sometimes when I am in a store during busy times, waiting and waiting for a free lift I actually panic that we are not going to be able to get out again. Not a pleasant feeling. So sometimes I practically push my way on with the wheelchair and oh the hostility, the negativity, the accusations of rudeness when I do that.

I'm afraid I don't understand these attitudes at all.

Oh Living somehow the reasonable, calm tone of your post brought a lump to my throat. I so often just rant, get angry, shout and alienate people but I just get so fed up and worn out with fighting sometimes.- as if everyday coping wouldn't be hard enough if all worked well.. But I have had successes. Have you decided what to do about WR and the bus company? You would get support from many of us if you would like it. I'm sure I'm right about the Equality Act and the reasonable access. If it were me, I would email Customer Services at Head Office first( if you haven't already). If you want us to, we could also email- we wouldn't have to know your name or which store but just say we were members of an online forum and were supporting you. Similar with the bus company although you would have to tell us which company. I have used my local paper but only did this when I got nowhere re the emails. The trouble with using the press is that they want the photo names etc with the story and that can be hard - particularly when it's your ds. When I was battling Southern, I found out afterwards it was the Twitter storm that finally got them to send a senior manager to see us at the station. I also found my local radio brilliant - they did a real in depth interview with me and then followed it up with a phone in on the topic. Let us know if we can help please

Thank you so much Bourdic for your kind post. I am following up with the bus company as well as the supermarket….so will see what response I get initially & then decide if appropriate to follow up & if more pressure is needed, some of your suggestions may come in handy there & will definitely consider how/whether you could help.

I also have to decide just how much I want to publicise our own situation in applying pressure, & need to consider DS privacy as well as my own. He has severe learning difficulties so can't make this decision himself, we would have to make it for him.

Some individuals make the decision to go public with the difficulties/indignities caused to them by lack of accessibility to facilities which the rest of us take for granted:

www.independent.co.uk/news/paralympic-athlete-wheelchair-wet-herself-crosscountry-train-no-disabled-toilets-anne-wafule-strike-a7505461.html

Some of the responses in the comments within this link are really disheartening though.

Living - good luck. I would always rather not go public but if I do, it's my decision about myself - very different when it's a DC. The article was very upsetting as were some of the comments. I couldn't have gone public like that - I've seen some comments from Tani GT about the dreadful 'passenger assistance't available to train passengers - she's recounted having to crawl it if her chair, throw it onto the platform and then crawl off the train because the booked assistance didn't turn up. Anyway you know where we are and you can always pm me.

I don't use a wheelchair at the moment but use 2 sticks. Getting off the bus (slowly) he suddenly drove off - the only reason I didn't fall was that someon grabbed me. He then said if I had half a brain I would be dangerous . I am so dangerous in fact that I had emailed a complaint to said company before he made it to the station. He was sent on a disability awareness scheme and suspended for 2 weeks- other bus drivers who thought this was unfair told me this. I complained about them as well. If a driver doesn't comply with the disability regulations of any of their bus policies take note of the bus stop and time and the bus company can track which driver it was .

Where I take the bus, the wheelchair space is vacated (sometimes by force) if a disabled person needs it. Have seen shouty women with buggies get kicked off if they refuse to make room. I think bus companies really do need a 'foldable buggy only' policy and actually ban the huge fixed ones.

Livingtothefull my son 14, is also a full time wheelchair user. The trollies in supermarkets do not fit onto his chair due to the special seating system he has to use. As such I've become proficient at a trolley in one hand, (supported against left hip) and wheelchair in right hand and slightly in front. It's taken years or practice to perfect but works well for me now. People see us coming and get out of the way, it takes mages to get round as there's so many 'thank you's' and 'sorry'!' Probably totally outing myself there as well

Anyway, if you want to start lobbying for better services I'm willing to put my bit in. Message me if you think we've got a chance of making a change

W

I disagree that buggies shouldn't be allowed on buses! But wheelchairs definitely need priority and the bus driver should be able to offer a refund to the person that had to get off. I would hope that way things would be better for everyone.

What people forget is that these are wheelchair spaces fought for by wheelchair users and their supporters. I've seen buggies on buses of a size no one could call reasonable - of course a folding buggy only policy should be implemented. Why not? And before any one starts on what about disabled children in special buggies, of course that issue can be easily dealt with. In general, needing to use a buggy is very time limited - just think about that compared with OPs ds.