...to feel depressed that only 7% of UK identify as Feminist?

[DioneTheDiabolist]

www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/2016/01/we-are-a-nation-of-hidden-feminists/

7% of the population and just 9% of women in this country identify as feminist. I'm not saying that everyone should call themselves feminist, I care more about what people do, rather than the label they assign themselves. But I am that the number is so low.

Given that most people believe in sexual equality, why do so many people not feel comfortable to call themselves feminist? And what (if anything) can we do about it?

It definitely does ami - but it would be better if both sexes worked together on that instead of men getting together to form their own rights groups and demanding that universities have to admit no more than 40% women to redress the balance.

but it would be better if both sexes worked together on that instead of men getting together to form their own rights groups

You are talking about rights again. I think it's more about changing the culture rather than rights.

There are issues that do affect men - and I think men should have men's rights groups to talk about them. Male mental health is one.

bumbley can you say what it is about the recent posts that put women off the identity of being a feminist?

From a financial point of view, one parent should probably be earning their full wage and, as women are biologically equipped to nourish a young baby

In Iceland, men are given 80% of their full time pay on a use it or lose it basis. This has led to a far more equal culture with men far more likely to work part time / do childcare etc compared to other cultures and a work system that reflects the changing culture.

If a man was encouraged financially to stay at home with their partner, would that be a good thing?

In my case bumbley, as I did breastfeed, I agree. And that is why the original plan was for DH to take over care after maternity leave - when I went back to work, he was going to be sahd til school.

This still happens all the time does it?

Yes

And why would women need protection from men? Oh yes.....

Funny though that one of the most talked about issues in education, the widening achievement difference between boys and girls is not something you see feminists (on here) bothering about. I mean, you would have thought this obvious example of different outcomes based on sex would be right up your street no ?

Personally, I don't see that as me being disadvantaged. I'd rather be at home than in work expressing milk several times a day

True. But many relationships fail and usually it's the mum who ends up with the children and having to work around them whilst relying on the NRP for money. The expectations we place on men and women can lead to disadvantages for the women (and the children) if the relationship breaks down. It also has implications for the man as well.

girl differences in educational attainment are more complex than just gender. In education this is looked at constantly, with ethnicity, poverty etc considered as factors as well. It is not the case that all boys do worse than all girls, it depends on other factors in their background as well.

Charlie

And why would women need protection from men? Oh yes.....

What would you have done, got them to sit around and have a "consent workshop" ? I really don't understand what you are on about. So men are the cause of all of the worlds problems in your opinion. We get that.

girl

I bet it is possible to be feminist and care about women and girls and making the playing field fairer and also care about other rights for other groups.

Just because someone is a feminist does not mean they don't care about other things. It's just that discussing the educational issues around boys is not something usually discussed on a feminist board,

It's discussed by many people though - but not on the feminist board. I bet there are some feminists who worry about LGB people but don't discuss LGB issues on the feminist board unless it involves a feminist angle.

It is not the case that all boys do worse than all girls, it depends on other factors in their background as well.

No one is saying that all boys do worse than all girls, just as I'm sure you wouldn't say that all women are disadvantaged relative to all men.

girl

Well, I'm sure there are some men out there in a position of power who could influence things. I am sure that some of the male newspaper editors could get their male columnists to write a few articles and bring the issue up.

Or the male headteachers could influence the system.

Or men's rights groups could bring some attention to the issue through social media.

girl I phrased that poorly. What I meant was that other factors are as important as gender in determining outcomes, and these shouldn't be ignored. You need to look at all the factors together to best target the children that need it.

male newspaper editors could get their male columnists to write a few articles and bring the issue up

These people, as far as I know, are not members of a movement, the express aim of which, is to identify and reduce instances of sex based inequality. If they were, then indeed it would be reasonable to expect that they would bring it up.

White, working class boys are the ones who don't do as well as hoped for in education.

That would be an interesting discussion thread on its own.

So feminists should be prioritising educational attainment for boys?
Should "black Lives matter" also be prioritising the underperformance of white working class people in the UK?
Should stonewall prioritise the inclusion of women in the workplace?

These people, as far as I know, are not members of a movement, the express aim of which, is to identify and reduce instances of sex based inequality

With a natural bias towards women and girls?

There's a lot of inequality out there. Feminism tends to focus on making things fairer for women and girls.

Just like other groups have their focus.

It doesn't mean that you don't care about other groups.

What would you have done, got them to sit around and have a "consent workshop" ? I really don't understand what you are on about. So men are the cause of all of the worlds problems in your opinion. We get that

You are wilfully obtuse. And not posting in good faith. I'm out.

Ami I salute you for your patience.

Devi

So you would agree with other posters that feminism is not really about removing sex based inequality at all ? Either you think that such gaps can be identified and remedied together, or you think men should get together and form groups dedicated to getting more boys that girls through university ?

These people, as far as I know, are not members of a movement, the express aim of which, is to identify and reduce instances of sex based inequality. If they were, then indeed it would be reasonable to expect that they would bring it up.

Hahaha hahaha
Men can't be arsed to fix their own issues, women need to do it for them! You really are the gift that keeps giving here

By "men" obviously NAMALT and there are men campaigning for male issues, not by demanding women fix it for them (that is for boney)

Charlie

see ya later then.

and form groups dedicated to getting more boys that girls through university

Or encouraging boys to value education, to do their best, to identify issues that affect achievement and under performance, to discuss if the education system offers the right things etc?

Either you think that such gaps can be identified and remedied together, or you think men should get together and form groups dedicated to getting more boys that girls through university ?
How is getting more boys than girls to university a fair outcome?
I'm more than happy for men to try to close the gap in educational attainment but for me personally, reducing violence against women in this country and including participation of women in education globally are bigger priorities.

Men can't be arsed to fix their own issues, women need to do it for them! grin You really are the gift that keeps giving here wink

So we have it on record that as far as you are concerned the best way to end the education gap (e.g.) is for men to form a group for and by men to exclusively promote the education of boys. Righty ho.