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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask a very personal question about vaginas after birth?

121 replies

PuppyCottonLane · 17/12/2016 17:30

I've had 2 kids and before I had kids I hated the way my vagina in general looked. My labia always hung slightly lower than the outer lips if you see what I mean and gave a rather "man in a boat" appearance

When I had my daughter I had an episiotomy and required a lot of stitching for second degree tears. After the birth I noticed everything was a lot tighter.

When I had my DS he tore open the episiotomy scar and all the scar tissue from the tears and again I had to be sewn up. Some friends said that your vagina in general never looks the same after birth.

My husband commented to me yesterday that childbirth has changed the look of my nether regions. On enquiring what he meant he said that my labia no longer hangs down past my lips (he's right) and my outer lips are a lot tighter and not as loose.

Is this a common thing if you've had an episiotomy/required a lot of stitching? I'm just curious as to why the appearance had changed quite dramatically (to the point of where I'm no longer embarrassed) in the space of 3 years? Odd thread but can't imagine broaching this subject with the other mums at the school gates Grin

OP posts:
WyfOfBathe · 18/12/2016 05:43

I haven't looked at my vagina in a mirror since my first few tries at putting in a tampon as a teenager.

I gave birth less than 36 hours ago (currently having snuggles with my teeny baby while typing Smile) so I don't want to see what I look like "down there" right now Grin but to be honest, I've never considered that my vagina/vulva might be unattractive. As long as it does what it's designed for Wink

maldini · 18/12/2016 06:05

Yes well done a vagina and vulva are different. We all knew what op meant, it's fine, calm down.

pklme · 18/12/2016 06:14

I looked at mine a while after birth because I had an area that hadn't healed quite right- blooming Nora I regretted that! Like the black hole of Calcutta! A yawning abyss. Fortunately it eventually remembered it was elastic and returned to a somewhat more reasonable size. But I had no perineum anymore.

I had prolapse surgery later, and am thrilled to say they built me a bit so I'm a happier Pkl!

Fluffsnuts · 18/12/2016 07:43

My whole genitals look different. My vulva is more swollen and my vagina far more visible, a friend described it as the porch doors now being open, which I think is an apt description.

Playdoughinthecarpet · 18/12/2016 07:51

Don't know what happened to me, think Ds grabbed onto insides and dragged them out with him. Also, my bum hole clicks when I bend down Confused
Want to get medical advice but waiting til my next smear.....oh the joys of parenthood Smile

Pollyanna9 · 18/12/2016 09:14

Sadly though having an episiotomy cannot prevent you from tearing - you make an episiotomy cut, baby comes out (like mine tried maybe, with his hand on his head) and that 'controlled' episiotomy cut can turn into an episiotomy + serious tear (that then goes towards the anus).

I wasn't directing my comments about vagina vs vulva to the OP, but as a general comment based on responses on the thread which persist in calling the vulva the vagina. Even a lesbian who claims to have 'seen a lot of vagina's' goes on to talk about 'keeping your vagina waxed' - has anyone, ever, ever ever, in the world, waxed their vagina? And I make that point not to get at anyone (we can all interpret/work out which exact area someone is talking about) but if we can't accurately describe the part of the body we're talking about, it's going to be difficult to have conversations with medical professionals when we don't know our inner labia from our outer, or a vagina from a vulva.

I fully believe the anal sphincter damage I got was from birth #1 with DS where they did an episiotomy as I only had a very small natural tear with birth #2 DD. So there are no guarantees and I don't feel that episiotomies prevent damage - not always.

I would love to know, of all the babies who were crowning but not coming out who then went on to have an episiotomy on the advice of the medical team in the room at the time, how many first tried for several contractions with the woman in an entirely different birthing position? Probably very few since we've once again returned to the fashion of 90% of women labouring on their backs despite NICE guidelines which support that ambulatory labour is far better. Not getting a tear and not needing an episiotomy in the first place is clearly the preference as is if a baby is in distress getting them out. But what leads to them being in distress in the first place?

When women labour on their back key, massive, arteries are bearing the weight of baby and all the amniotic fluid. Addditionally the sacrum (tailbone) which is meant to be free moving and swings back to allow the back of the baby's head to be birthed, is now rigid in place because the woman is laying on it. Hence the head approaches the perineum slightly differently and certainly not in the gravity assisted way that nature intended. The uterus is fed with blood from these major arteries. When a contraction happens babys heart dips and then it recovers (Type 1 dips). However, Type 2 dips can develop where the recovery time becomes much (dangerously) longer thus compromising the baby. These Type 2 dips are often a trigger for 'we'll have to do an episiotomy'. I believe if I hadn't been put on my back for the actual birth of DS he wouldn't have had Type 2 dips and I wouldn't have needed an episiotomy and my ass sphincter wouldn't now be compromised.

I think this thread is very important not only for reassuring OP that all DHs / DPs seem to really not have a problem with how our vulva's look / how our vagina's feel - so that's a bonus and something for us not to worry about. It still gives you a pause though when you see the repair cock-ups and attitudes which still abound - and the expectation of what a 'normal' vulval area should look like not helped by porn. Thank God I read a book in my early 20s that hundreds of women had contributed to and agreed to have their lady parts drawn by an artist because that made me understand early doors that there is infinite variety and it's all entirely normal. Can't remember the name of the book.

Can I also give my view of the fantastic surgical procedure called 'Modified Fenton's Procedure'. I would like to meet Dr Fenton and give him a piece of my mind. After birth of DS I was stitched up REALLY well but I had a lot of scar tissue in the perineum which felt really alien to me. So doc says don't worry we can sort that out. Now I'll admit, I was stupid and didn't ask enough but when we were sat discussing 'scar tissue' I thought he'd be dealing with the, scar tissue. No, he did this procedure which involves making a vertical cut at the base of the vaginal opening then stitching it up horizontally. This did nothing to deal with the numb scar tissue area whatsoever and only served to give me a base of vaginal opening to anus distance that is no more than a thumb's width wide, and made the vaginal opening slightly more, well, open. Still, it survived birth #2 and all the component parts still work ok but I'd look at it with a jaundiced eye if I was ever offered it again!

fluffygal · 18/12/2016 09:24

Pre child birth one inner lip was longer than the other. After 3 kids, both inner lips have stretched and both protrude. No tears so everything else is the same. It used to bother me but doesn't anymore. I do think its a bit off saying having small inner lips is 'neat'- it implies anything else is a mess.

dementedma · 18/12/2016 09:26

Well, if I was a first time mum to be, this thread would be scaring the shit out of me!
I had 3 CD so no stitching below stairs and am genuinely shocked at some of the stories on here. Is it standard that every vaginal all delivery involves a tear or epi?
Is this a fairly modern day thing? Why happened in the past, was the rate as high?
Sorry to sound naïve, I'm 53 and have 3 kids but none were vaginal births- thankfully, given the stories on here.

Shakey15000 · 18/12/2016 09:37

Polly I also had a modified Fentons Angry I'm quite passionate (now) about education in these areas. I'd never even heard of prolapses before I was diagnosed. And while I agree that it makes scary reading, it's important I think, to make women aware. Things like perineum massage pre labour to strengthen muscles to hopefully not tear. Not that I know how effective it can be, I only found out it was a "thing" when it was too late. Trust me, if I'd have known before I'd have massaged till my hand fell off.

GhostOfChristmasYetToCome · 18/12/2016 09:38

Is this a fairly modern day thing? Why happened in the past, was the rate as high?

Women died in childbirth.

Shakey15000 · 18/12/2016 09:47

....and the later symptoms are usually attributed to just 'that age'. Like bladder leakage which could mask a bladder prolapse etc. Of course, some women do "just have" leakage and manage with Tena etc. And some women live with prolapses using pessarys. Surgery isn't for everyone but can fix them and improve quality of life.

dementedma · 18/12/2016 10:03

I realise that ghost but your comment makes it sound as if the choice is epi or die!
I'm sure many women, have given birth over the centuries and over the world without those being the only options.
Anyway,don't want to derail the thread. Was just curious.

GhostOfChristmasYetToCome · 18/12/2016 10:07

I suppose they just tore and then were stitched up or bled to death though.

Maybe in the past babies were smaller because diet and healthcare wasn't as good and so it was less of an issue. Maybe that is still the case in countries where healthcare isn't as advanced. Maybe women aren't out working 50+ hours a week and have more time to devote to more holistic/natural practices that prepare their bodies better for childbirth

I don't know what the answer is really. And I'm guessing epi or die is probably a bit simplistic!

EnormousTiger · 18/12/2016 10:52

I had an episiotomy with my first a long time ago. I was giving birth upright in a birth chair which I think pushed the baby out a bit too fast. Anyway it was the worst to heal. With baby 2 I had a small natural tear which didn't need stitching and was fine and nothing with babies 3 - 5. I suspect I would have done better out of the birth chair but at the time it was my choice (given I was pressured to give birth in hospital with that first birth) as I didn't want to give birth on my back.

I have never given a second's thought to a vulva or vagina not looking good though! It's all wonderful beautiful stuff which bears life.

Look at natural birth in Africa today - some girls at 14 will have a 3 day labour and die in labour or have serious injuries. So do need our current balance between nature and assistance and each woman in the UK needs to decide what feels rights for her.

caroldecker · 18/12/2016 13:20

Perineum massage is recommended by the NHS to reduce incidents of tearing etc.
Maternal death rates were around 50 per 1000 births until about 1940 when they rapidly started getting better.
Basically, if you had 4 children before 1940, you had about a 20% chance of dying in one on them.

skyyequake · 18/12/2016 13:26

Umm hate to point this out caroldecker but your statistics are flawed... A 5% chance of dying in childbirth doesn't increase to 20% if you have four. Plus if you had four children and died during childbirth I'm pretty sure you'd die in the last one... Else how would you have four children? Speaking purely statistically (obviously this depends on medical circumstances) each time you gave birth you would have had a 5% chance. If you flip a coin and get heads, that doesn't mean you're more likely to get tails the next time - the chance remains 50/50.

DailyFail1 · 18/12/2016 13:27

Sister gave birth on her hands and knees and still got a 4th degree tear. Cousin gave birth on her back to a much larger baby, had a 2 hour labour and didnt even need stiches. The position you give birth in probably doesn't have a big influence on tears - it's the position of the baby that counts

DailyFail1 · 18/12/2016 13:30

Enormoustiger - nutritionally most poor 14 year old African girls are on the same level as 10-12 year old girls here. They might have only recently started their period, might not be done growing, some might even have had their cliterouses/vulva removed, and so of course they're more likely to die during birth.

GirlInASwirl · 18/12/2016 13:33

My downstairs looks different after just one child. My inner labia teared and were stitched, but the stitches released themselves part way through the healing process - so I now have three inner lips (lucky girl!). I asked my health visitor to check it over at the time and she just said 'well I've seen worse' (how's that for empathy?). It took me a while to adjust to my new appearance.

The shape of the inner lips are important as they help to funnel pee in the right direction (amongst other things). And scar tissue can do all sorts of weird and wonderful distortions - tightening, twisting,, elongating.

I think that many couples have to adjust to the new lie of the land after childbirth - whether negative/positive.

And porn has a lot to answer for - they all look the same. Nothing wrong with protruding inner lips/outer lips/wrinkles.....

If you find a reindeer down there; well that's another story

Branleuse · 18/12/2016 13:34

I think mine looks fine. Looks like a vagina. I think age and childbirth probably changed it, but nothing out of the ordinary. It still works.

DrunkOnEther · 18/12/2016 14:12

DC1's labour was very quick - he was 6 weeks early but still weighed 6lbs 3oz. My perineum was fairly intact, but I ended up having internal stitches all the way up to my cervix, and one of my inner labia had to be stitched back on. Hmm I can still remember the MW saying "oh Christ! I'm just going to get the doctor.." The registrar came and said "Right, don't move, cough or sneeze, I'm getting the consultant.." Fun times.

Anyway, this might be TMI - but the only difference I've really noticed long-term is that before DC1, when I had my period the blood kind of funnelled backwards, so I was more likely to leak at the back, whereas afterwards it all funnelled forwards, so I was more likely to leak out of the front/top. Confused

DC2's birth was great though - 7lbs 1oz, and just a minor graze. Relieved was an understatement!

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