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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think it's never right to call someone "toxic"

181 replies

eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 21:35

Just that really. I first heard the word about 6 years ago and dislike it just as much now as I did then.

Do you use it? What do you mean by it? Do you think it is a very strong word to use?

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Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:08

"You really don't get what happens and what you experience to lead you to describe somebody else as 'toxic', do you?"

Well, no one understands every form of negative behaviour but I have experienced at least my fair share, mainly in childhood

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Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:09

"OP, what do you think of the word "abusive"? Should we say "person who perpetrates abuse" instead? On MN toxic is quite often used of a parent whose behaviour, according to the descriptions, appears to amount to longterm emotional abuse."

I'm ok with "abusive".

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Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:10

"Surely it's the behaviour that's toxic, not the person."

Yes.

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VeryBitchyRestingFace · 01/12/2016 22:10

Is it any worse than calling someone a cunt?

Has someone called you toxic, OP?

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 01/12/2016 22:13

Agree. It's a favourite term on mumsnet, used lazily by people who consult Dr Google and just like catch-all terms and professional-sounding buzzwords that they can use in diagnoses. Drives me crackers.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 01/12/2016 22:13

Agree. It's a favourite term on mumsnet, used lazily by people who consult Dr Google and just like catch-all terms and professional-sounding buzzwords that they can use in diagnoses. Drives me crackers.

Cherryskypie · 01/12/2016 22:13

And when the person gets pleasure from the '"behaviour that's toxic"? When they actively enjoy causing pain in others?

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:14

I suppose where I'm maybe coming from is a combination of a few personal things.

I can assure you I did not have a rose tinted childhood.

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littlesallyracket · 01/12/2016 22:14

I can think of a lot worse things to be called. I don't think it's dehumanising, either - I think it's a useful metaphor for someone whose behaviour is consistently harmful and upsetting to those around them, and I personally don't find it any more dehumanising than any other figure of speech. I find terms that are critical of someone's behaviour towards others much less dehumanising than terms that are critical of their looks, class, harmless choices etc.

Each to their own, of course. We all have different words/expressions that we find more upsetting than others, but it's a personal thing really; just because you or I don't like a specific term it doesn't necessarily mean it's always wrong or offensive for other people use it.

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:16

"Has someone called you toxic, OP?"

No thank god! I don't think I could cope with that!

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BakeOffBiscuits · 01/12/2016 22:16

I think it's a very useful word when used appropriately. Yanbu.

BakeOffBiscuits · 01/12/2016 22:17

Sorry that should have been YABU

VeryBitchyRestingFace · 01/12/2016 22:18

No thank god! I don't think I could cope with that!

Mebes it was Britney who started the trend.

I've got that song running through my head now.

Out, damn spot!

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:20

"find terms that are critical of someone's behaviour towards others much less dehumanising than terms that are critical of their looks, class, harmless choices etc"

Isn't that the point. Toxic, as I was brought up to understand the word, can only refer to inherent properties e.g. Toxic waste, toxic sludge, etc.

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FlyingElbows · 01/12/2016 22:21

Dr Google didn't diagnose my toxic mother, a properly qualified real live psychiatrist did. I don't give a rat's left one who might find it offensive. I found a lifetime of emotional abuse offensive and I assert my right as a survivor of a toxic parent to tell you that that woman is fucking poisonous and not give a shit if you're offended. Grin

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:22

Yeah the Britney thing is a bit left field. She seems to use the word to mean "dangerous"

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RebelRogue · 01/12/2016 22:23

There are people that kill every bit of goodness,of happiness,of hope in those around them. They enjoy doing it..seeing the life drain out,the soul break,the light go off in other people's eyes. They love to see someone cry,chocking,unable to breathe,and they love even more the fact that they're the reason why.

So you see OP..people can be toxic. Hell people are toxic!

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:24

Flying, I'm sorry you were abused by your mum.

Did the psychiatrist use the term in that way i.e. "Your mum is toxic" or "your mum's behaviour was toxic"?

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VeryBitchyRestingFace · 01/12/2016 22:26

To be fair OP, now that you've got me cogitating on the issue, I'd rather be called a "fucking rancid cow" than "toxic".

There is something rather all encompassing about "toxic", suggestive of the person tainting everything they touch, being damaging to other people, that simply doesn't come across with many other terms of abuse (imo).

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:28

Yes Bitchy, exactly.

I appreciate you taking the time to think about it :)

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BillSykesDog · 01/12/2016 22:28

I agree with you OP. I could certainly have described my mother as toxic at some times in the past. But as I've grown up I've got some sympathy for her being a woman who ended up in a life she didn't really want trapped and bitter when her life had so much promise.

Ditto one of my grandmothers. She was truly awful but I've discovered that she was actually quite badly abused herself. She grew up as one of three sisters during the depression. If her mother had one egg she'd give half to each of her sisters and make her watch her eat it while she simply had nothing. It was heartbreaking and left her incapable of giving or receiving love.

It's the behaviour that is toxic, not the person. It's often cyclical as they've been victims of similar behaviour themselves. And people can change and redeem themselves or unlearn. Or they can just be different in different situations.

I think dismissing someone as simply toxic does dehumanise them. Perhaps though dehumanising them serves a positive purpose for those who do it? They can see that person as uniquely bad which will allow them to still trust and have relationships with other people?

RebelRogue · 01/12/2016 22:28

Bitchy but some people are exactly like that,hence toxic. But i agree that it is way too overused.

VeryBitchyRestingFace · 01/12/2016 22:28

There are people that kill every bit of goodness,of happiness,of hope in those around them. They enjoy doing it..seeing the life drain out,the soul break,the light go off in other people's eyes. They love to see someone cry,chocking,unable to breathe,and they love even more the fact that they're the reason why.

So really, toxic could be code for "sadist"?

VeryBitchyRestingFace · 01/12/2016 22:30

Bitchy but some people are exactly like that,hence toxic. But i agree that it is way too overused.

Oh yes, I agree. Grin. I know a few.

I'm just ruminating on the reasons why OP - and me, it now seems! - might take being called a "fucking cunt" better than "toxic".

Original poster
eyelevelgrill · 01/12/2016 22:30

Great post BillSykes.

Snap re our mums by the way.

That is a really interesting idea in your last paragraph

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