To expect books to be marked at least once in ten weeks

[Cabbagesandcustard]

DD started secondary school at the beginning of Sept. In some subjects (geography, science) her teacher has not taken in / marked her book once since then. Is this normal / acceptable? Or should I be on the phone to the school having a moan?
School is rather a closed shop: they don't seem to encourage parent-teacher contact apart from at parents consultation evening and it can be hard to know who to contact. Year Head? Head of Dept?

So in every lesson with say twenty five students in it you are going to have a conversation with them about the quality of their work?

Questioning is an important part of gauging understanding but realistically can't include the whole class every lesson.

I am not slt ( deliberate choice, did that sort of management shit in previous career)
Still agree with winters

Winters: Fair enough. Call it professional difference of opinion. I believe expectations for marking are too onerous in general, given what teachers are expected to do in addition to it. I love marking btw - it is a really important part of my job. But when I find myself doing it at midnight or during half-term because data is due for all my classes (again!) and I have only just finished my planning, I start to think it isn't just 'my job', it's unreasonable workload. Maybe your school is different, I don't know.

I hate data and I sympathise.

Ultimately though, an eleven year old doing his best and trying to produce his best work is not going to be doing it at sixteen if he's learned his book is never looked at.

But assessment isn't just about 'weighing', it's about 'fattening.' It's about providing feedback in order to improve.

I addressed assessment for learning (fattening) in my post. ASL does NOT need marking. It's often instant within a lesson. Marking AFTER the lesson is too late. I need to know WITHIN the lesson how the children are doing, so I can address it within the lesson. Addressing it the next day / week is too late - you have missed teaching opportunities.

Also just a thing to bear in mind- if your DD has been absent or not had her book with her in the lesson it is possible that the classes books have been taken in and marked but hers wouldn't have been. As a secondary teacher when books are taken in it is very rare I am given a whole set- usually some of the class have lost/forgottenntheir books or are absent. When a teacher teaches 8 or so classes it is unlikely they will then have the time or inclination to then make a list of students whose books they have not seen and chase after them in future lessons. If students regularly do not bring their books in or are absent then it is very possible that the students book might not get marked in 10 weeks.
Not saying this is neccessarily the case of your DD- just a possibility.

And you can do that with between twenty five to thirty children as they write an essay, can you?

You must be more skilled than I am :)

Secondary English....
tick and flick
Sticker every two weeks with goals
One assessment per half term- done and marked on same day.
Glad I am not a primary teacher :)

wintersbranches: I don't disagree, but schools have to find ways to make workload manageable irrespective of that. If teachers are leaving the profession, that's a sign they are starting to say 'Not my problem' because the work is unreasonable, and no-one wants that.

Elegant
I find the work life balance good.
I drop my own kids off at before school care at 1/4 to 8 then go to work.
They enjoy a variety of after school activities, i pick them up, we chat on the way home.
I then get to sort out home stuff/dinner/help my own kids with their homework/ take them to rugby training etc for as long as i like, and fit the marking to suit me around during weekday evenings. i never mark/plan when i get home on a Friday

I think the core elements to teaching are planning work and assessing work.

No matter what anybody says, if these things aren't being done, something is wrong.

winters, as I said that is one example, though I do speak to every student like that at least once every two lessons. I plan tasks that allow for conversations to take place. It isn't hard, the conversations I am talking about take 1-2 minutes each. Fortunately, because I don't spend all my time marking I have the time to plan lessons in that detail.

Even better than that, because we don't do onerous marking in my school we have study clubs every day in my faculty where students drop in and get one to one help if there is something they are finding hard.

I appreciate this may be subject specific though - I said upthread I don't how English teachers do it.

wintersbranches: Oh I agree that something is wrong, I just don't always agree that it is the staff

Maybe I am

There's no set fast rule, sometimes it's with individuals, sometimes it's with groups and sometimes the class, but during the lesson, I expect to have a handle on how the children are responding to the lesson.

I do aim to 'touch base' with each child during the lesson (to a greater or lesser degree), but that's my personal aim, though.

dr270r0
But you have to
As i mark books i put what they look like into the app i use, i then make a note of those kids whose book I don't have.
I write their names on the board at the start of the next lesson. They mostly get speed marked whilst the rest of the class are responding to the qiestions i have written for them during my marking.

One example, could be half way through maths, I might read out some answers and get the children to self mark- instantly you see who has got right/ wrong answers and can go and help those who need it.

Amelia
You must have much smaller classes than me, main school are 28-31, sixth form 24-28
If i speak to each kid for 2 mins per lesson, actually most lessons i cannot fit that in (55 min lesson, come in, sit down, books out, straight to independentl learning task, quick plenary, gives you max 45 mins per class) so enough time to speak to only part of the class and they do a tually need teaching sometimes!

So if everything can be learned through verbal communication rather than written, and books don't need to be marked at all, perhaps examinations are outdated as well?

wintersbranches: Not sure how that follows?

Trifle it follows because students are assessed for the most part on written communications.

Therefore to ensure their success in exams, a teacher has got to assess their written understanding. There really isn't a way around this.

wintersbranches: Sure, but how does it follow that the feedback needs to be written down?

Because to give detailed oral feedback to thirty students would leave no time for teaching.

Because you would need to memorise what you wanted to say to thirty students in relation to their work.

Because the students would not be able to memorise it - written feedback gives them something to go back to.

Am I really having this conversation?

Trifle, let's say I read thirty essays. I decide not to mark them but to give verbal feedback.

I say to Emily - you begin well but then lapse into storytelling. Your quotations were too long - try to hone in on one particular word and think what it tells the reader. You brought it to a strong conclusion which was good and you addressed the question well.

Am I really going to remember that X 30?

wintersbranches: You are. No-one is saying feedback needs to be every lesson. And the student can write it down. And why would I need to memorise what to say when I have their work in front of me?

So you are going to walk around the classroom giving the feedback while the students write it down, is that right?