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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Dog pissing and shitting over everything. AIBU to PTS?

212 replies

ImportSave · 18/11/2016 11:56

I've just caught my dog pissing all over a fairly new side table. He stood and did it right in front of me, despite being less than two feet from access to the garden. I chased him out into the garden and cleaned it up,only to find he'd crapped in the kitchen without me knowing about it. I've shut him in the (tiled) kitchen, where he's howling and barking to be let out. He's ruined an expensive carpet through this.

Not to drip feed, he's about 17, a small crossbred who has free access to the outside and is walked daily. The vet has checked him several times and can find no physical reason this. I've also cleaned the carpet/furniture with enzyme cleaner, bio soap power and have had it professionally cleaned. My house stinks. I have a niece who will soon be crawling and I can't have her over if she's going to be crawling in dog urine (or worse, poo.)

I'm honestly thinking about having him PTS. I've owned him since he was a tiny pup and it would probably break my heart to do it, but I can't take much more of this mess either. I'm sitting here trying to get some very important work done and all I can smell is piss. All I can hear is him howling because he's been shut in the one room with a floor he can't ruin.

AIBU?

OP posts:
PaulDacresConscience · 18/11/2016 12:32

I wondered about canine dementia as well. It's one of the most common signs.

AlexaTwoAtT · 18/11/2016 12:32

Shutting a dog away? You are cruel.

KevinMcCallister · 18/11/2016 12:32

My dog started weeing with no medical cause. It can happen. He's now been given a drug to help curb the incontinence. It works. He was swamping in his sleep and dribbling.

You might need to be more proactive with more regular supervised toileting trips outside. YANBU to have him PTS on the info you have given.

Gileswithachainsaw · 18/11/2016 12:34

I am also thinking dementia.

I'm assuming arthritis/joint pain that's making him reluctant to go outside in the cold has been ruled out?

Think I'd pts too tbh.

It's very stressful for them to live in house where there's mess everywhere and being unable to control the bodily functions.

At 17 I'd also think very carefully a bit the testing offered and how painful/stressful it would be compared to pts

callmeadoctor · 18/11/2016 12:34

Sadly, he is 17. Coming to the end of his life, he probably has dementia. He is also starting to lose control of the muscles that control urine and faeces. Bless him, he probably feels bad about it too. You surely must know OP that it is the right time to say goodbye. Make the appointment now. My Vet came to the house so he could be put to sleep in my arms, that is the final act of love that you can give him. xx

OhTheRoses · 18/11/2016 12:35

I don't think you are being unreasonable op. You have given him a long and presumably happy life. He is very very old.

When I am very old, if I become incontinent and have limited quality if life I would like a living will and an assisted suicide. I wouldn't let an animal suffer that which I'm not prepared to.

InformalRoman · 18/11/2016 12:35

Could it be a kidney problem that hasn't yet been diagnosed? I'd get him checked again in case it's something that couldn't have been picked up previously.

Onenerfwarfrombreakdown · 18/11/2016 12:37

As he is 17 could it be like doggy dementia, he's forgetting what he's supposed to do? Or leaves it too long to get outside, like a toddler waiting until the very last second because they are distracted? Has he been checked for nerve damage/spondylosis in spine which can affect him feeling the urge?

My elderly lab has arthritis and some loss of nerve sensation in his rear end so doesn't always feel or know when poo is coming. We take him out very regularly and know his routine but occasionally there is an accident. However we don't shout at him, lock him away or punish him cos he doesn't know! He wouldn't understand what he's done wrong and would just be miserable. Please don't punish your dog.

Sugarpiehoneyeye · 18/11/2016 12:38

OP, he could have the onset of Dog Dementia, don't be too hard on him.
Could you clip his lead on, and take him round the garden, every 30 mins or so, just to see if it makes a difference at all.
I would still seek another opinion, before you PTS.

YouHadMeAtCake · 18/11/2016 12:38

It may well be not be physical , have you heard of canine cognative dysfunction, at that age would make sense. For someone that has had him since he was a puppy , you sound awfully cold and detached. You have had him a long time, you know him, he's not doing it to piss you off. He is very old and will be very distressed by your behaviour. You speak about him as though he's an inconvenience rather than a much loved Pet. It is a scary and stressful time for him . I wouldn't be putting possible visitors over welfare of my very elderly dog.

Original poster
ImportSave · 18/11/2016 12:38

I will be replacing the carpets (with lino!) soon. Baby gates on both the kitchen and living room door and one across the stairs.

I'm not being cruel by shutting him in the kitchen ffs. He has a nice soft bed and the kitchen is probably the warmest room in the house!

Honestly it's grim. The first thing I do every morning is clean up the piss and shit that is all over the kitchen floor.

At this stage, I don't think I'd put him through more tests (he finds the vets very stressful).

OP posts:
diddl · 18/11/2016 12:39

So does he usually take himself into the garden, or does he have regular walks?

callmeadoctor · 18/11/2016 12:40

Cognitive Decline its called, it is really time to let him go OP xxxx

TripTrappedNow · 18/11/2016 12:42

17 years old wow.

Does he seem to know it is wrong to toilet everywhere? I get the impression he has forgotten, so maybe dementia type thing.

If he knows he has done wrong then maybe it is simply he can't wait or is finding getting/being outside too uncomfortable. Either might be helped with those puppy pads by the doggy door so he has a better option than your carpet. Helps him and helps you.

The only other thing you can do is limit him to easy to clean areas (baby gate maybe) and take outside regularly like a puppy.

Toolateagain · 18/11/2016 12:43

Our's did this when she developed dementia, she was about that age.

Original poster
ImportSave · 18/11/2016 12:44

YouHadMeAtCake - have you lived in a house with a dog that toilets all over? I'm not putting visitor's welfare over his, I'm trying to look after my own welfare. You say I sound cold and detatched but at this point, I'm having to be because otherwise I'd just keep going on like this for another x number of years and I -can't-. It's getting to the point where if I'm at work or out of the house for some reason, I'm panicking because I'm wondering what mess I'm going to be coming back to. I cried the other morning when I got up and had to clean up a load of piss and crap before I could do anything else. It's really starting to affect my MH.

OP posts:
pigsDOfly · 18/11/2016 12:44

Might have been better to have posted this in the doghouse OP.

It's all very well saying that the OP shouldn't consider having a perfectly healthy dog pts but whatever the vets say, the dog is very old and clearly there is something going on that is causing its behaviour/incontinence and tbh I'm not sure how long I could stick this out if I were in this position.

If the dog has never been properly house trained then trying solve that now is probably too little too late.

Obviously no one on here can really advise you OP. You are the one living with this and you are the only one who can make the decision.

Clearly it's not going to be easy either way, but don't beat yourself up if you do decide you can't live with this any longer and have to have the dog pts. For what it's worth, I'd have every sympathy with you if you did.

Nearlyadoctor · 18/11/2016 12:45

Why ' no more pets afterwards? '. The op sounds like she has been a responsible dog owner for 17 years.
I agree with Wit that you need to restrict access for now and see your vet again. 17 years is a good age for a dog and I personally couldn't put up with it.

AlexaTwoAtT · 18/11/2016 12:45

Sorry OP.

YelloDraw · 18/11/2016 12:45

I would PTS - you can't have a house full of piss and shit, dog can't stay shut in the kitchen. He is old and had a great life. Time to say goodbye. Kindest all round.

mudandmayhem01 · 18/11/2016 12:46

I think it is cruel to keep an incontinent dog going, check with vet if it treatable but many housetrained dogs are very distressed when they have accidents. It is also a health hazard. My friend at a very old dog that was incontinent for a year before he finally died and looking back he regretted keeping him going for so long. Your dog has had a long happy life, choosing the right time to end it is always hard x

Original poster
ImportSave · 18/11/2016 12:48

He's walked either three times a day for 20-30 mins a time and has free access into the garden at all other times. I have puppy pads in all the key spots but it doesn't always help, especially when he's pissing on wooden furniture that soaks the liquid up.

I don't know what else to do. Dog nappies aren't an option; he'd find them very stressful and upsetting.

OP posts:
RhiWrites · 18/11/2016 12:49

My 18-year-old cat was doing this recently so we took her to the vet for investigations and she has had full bloodwork and been diagnosed with first stage renal failure and an infection.

OP, I see you did take your dog to the vets but they don't seem to have recommended any interventions. My cat has:

  • brand new diet of special kidney function food
  • feliway diffusers for mood calming
  • anti-inflamatory medication
  • antibiotics
  • a second litter tray

We have now gone 2 weeks with no inappropriate pee!

So, I think you should at least try some of these before taking a horrible drastic step. Obviously a dog can't have a litter tray but you could up the number of walks. And all the other things might work for him.

I totally get why pee is horrible, my partner was appalled when the cat peed in our bed. But she's sick poor mite, and she needed looking after.

YouHadMeAtCake · 18/11/2016 12:49

Yes import I have , more than once. It's not going to go on for X number of years because he's already 17. This is all part of having pets, you know that, end of life care is just as important as the beginning.It's about managing it and if he is at that stage then yes, maybe as much as it pains me to say it , PTS is the best thing for him

trulybadlydeeply · 18/11/2016 12:50

How many walks a day does he have? Is he emptying his bladder and opening his bowels on all walks? He may need shorter but more frequent walks though.

Though I do suspect dementia, I'm wondering whether it is confusion or loss of control that is the issue. Are his stools reasonably solid?

Either way, I believe he is unwell, and unhappy. My dog went through a time a few months ago where he was very unwell, and he had stopped eating and drinking. I thought we were losing him. he is only young, and we had had no problems with toiletting, but whilst he was ill he just used to let go of bowels and bladder in the house. It was like he had given up, and didn't care. Also seems to be a way of letting me know how awful he felt, as animals do use elimination as a means of communication.

Like I said before, I feel you need some expert advice from vets who will listen. Even if you speak to someone on the 'phone (I can appreciate you not wanting to drag him around).