to think eight months in prison is a bit excessive for throwing bacon

[CondyLisa]

www.thesun.co.uk/news/2095440/two-polish-men-bombarded-london-mosque-with-tesco-bacon-after-oktoberfest-booze-binge/

"Blackfriars Crown Court heard that the pair had bought a packet of bacon at a Tesco after drinking heavily at the festival but could not remember going to the mosque on Sunday night, October 2.

Prosecutor Carol Summers said the mosque’s caretaker had at first thought the Polish pair were worshippers but was stunned when meat was thrown at him.

The men threw several rashers of bacon, also placing a third piece in the shoe of a worshipper."

They appear to have no prior offending history.

Obviously whether you are at a church, mosque or community centre, you shouldn't be hassled by drunken yobs and it is right that they should be punished, but this seems to be a de facto blasphemy sentence more than anything else.

I don't see that throwing bacon is more serious than, say, yobs ripping up flower beds that people have worked on, and which provide at least as much social utility as a place of worship - but the latter attracts a sentence of community service, whereas we have eight month prison sentence for some bacon.

It is racially aggravated assault. Yes the sentence is ridiculous - they should serve longer in prison!

YANBU

Our justice system has 2 speeds, and it's frightening. It will only bring more hatred and anger. Stupid pranks against a Christian church and a mosque are not treated the same way at all. Well, the level of open racism is growing, look at the brexit results. Double standards clearly do not work. It's awful.

It is disproportionate. As is the additional 2 month ban for Lewis Smith for his ridiculous antics. He had already publicly grovelled aplogised, visted mosques and repeated his grovel apology, received hate mail and death threats - none of whcih seem to have been investigated, I note!

We have hit that time in our religiously segregated community when we seem to have to be especially careful to be seen to abhor and punish some stupidities more than others.

I mean, throwing bacon is not a cirme, nor is hiding it in someones shoe.
Being offensive is not, in itself, a crime.
Being a total fuckwitted pillock, is not a crime.

But when all of the above are aimed at a Islam then we have to be seen to act as though we think it is worse that physically maiming someone!

And yes, I know it was a 'hate crime', I am not disagreeing with that, just he level of punishment is out of sync with the Act - 1 -2 months or a level 1 fine, under the curent legislation - Section 2 of the Ecclesiastical Courts Jurisdiction Act 1860 (and no, that date is not a typo).

Personally I think that that attitude is far more 'white prejuduce' and patronising than any other. How middle class of us, how protective and sensitive we are being. How sweet of us to care so much for Them!

It is that attitude, on all sides, that will prolong the racial, religious and cutural schisms in the UK.

Saying "Total twattery, have a fine, and your stupid faces all over the local paper" would have been enough.

Apologies for the typos, I am still eating my porridge!

The original intent of a 'hate crime' was that if a violent crime could be proven to be motivated by hate towards a protected class, it would be considered an aggravating circumstance. This is eminently sensible and I applaud any attempts to throw dangerous, violent racists in prison.

It was not designed to provide a sanitised backdrop so we can live our lives free of offense. If Muslims are so offended by pork or Christians so offended by poppy burning then I suggest they go live off the grid somewhere.

The tile is so misleading, it was 8 months for a hate crime, not just chucking some bacon, they went out of their way to harass and distress people that were just going about their business. Yes their's massive inconsistency with sentencing in the UK but just because someone else got a lesser sentence doesn't justify doing the same for these men, this sends a very strong message in this current environment that hate attacks will not be tolerated, regardless of how many think that it's not that a bad a thing to do. I'm proud of this sentence!

I don't really see what a prison sentence achieves here that community service/fines etc. wouldn't achieve just as well, and at vastly less expense to the taxpayer.

Don't think Lewis Smith thing and this are the same at all. Lewis Smith acted like a tool and apologised, that should have been enough. This bacon thing is intimidation and going out of their way to frighten and upset people. Not the same at all.

I think the main issue is the punishment for the muslims burning poppies was not severe enough so people focus on the double standards of that rather than how offensive the crime was..

I'm proud of this sentence!

Well, I am ashamed. Any way to tell muslims and christians that they are not equal is wrong (or atheists, or buddhist or whatever). Promoting inequality and difference in any way is twisted. Take another example: anyone spitting on a woman should receive the same treatment. It does not matter if you spit because she is wearing a veil, or because she is not!

The original intent of a 'hate crime' was that if a violent crime could be proven to be motivated by hate towards a protected class, it would be considered an aggravating circumstance. This is eminently sensible and I applaud any attempts to throw dangerous, violent racists in prison.

It was not designed to provide a sanitised backdrop so we can live our lives free of offense. If Muslims are so offended by pork or Christians so offended by poppy burning then I suggest they go live off the grid somewhere

100% agree with this.

Some people get less for actions that caused real physical harm.

And it's not like the people burning poppies get anything similar. And as somebody who has family members in the military I am extremely offended. I just wouldn't want those people in jail for expressing an opinion... but it if throwing bacon is a hate crime then burning poppies is one as well.

Amd the sentencing does seem arbitrary.

YABU. The charge (well one of them) is religiously aggravated harassment because this was directed against people. They threw the bacon at the caretaker, who was no doubt terrified. That is why it carries a stronger sentence than Muslims burning poppies, which is a public protest. But if those Muslims had grabbed a poppy from a veteran's lapel and then burned it? That would be harassment and deserving of a prison term.

I cannot be bothered debating the whole 'you can't be racist against Muslims because Islam is a religion not a race' because it's pathetic. I find that people who aren't racist don't tend to insult Muslims in the first place.

And btw:

"Muslim" is NOT a race!

They're going to get the shit kicked out of them in prison. Not that I agree with kicking the shit out of people in the least, but they have brought that on themselves.

So the tax payer is now going to have to cough up for the cost of the investigation and the trial and 8 months of protecting them in prison to try and stop them from having the shit kicked out of them. Thousands and thousands of pounds. Imagine what else that money could have bought... Personally I think I would have preferred to see them named, shamed, fined and deported, with the fine paid to the mosque, to show that Britain won't tolerate that sort of hatred.

They threw the bacon at the caretaker, who was no doubt terrified.

I'm sure the caretaker is a bit more robust than you assume.

Burning poppies is not on the same level. Not in the same ballpark. I think it's distasteful but I don't think I even believe it merits a fine.

Throwing pork at Muslims, deliberately defiling their place of worship, is a hateful thing to do that offends actual, living people and makes our world decidedly shittier. Of course they should be punished rather harshly.

It's a bit of bacon though. Chucking bacon at a mosque is twattish yes, but 8 months is ridiculous for the crime of Being a Twat.

It was a racial hate crime. They deserve prison.

I don't get the analogy re. burning poppies. Poppies are not a religious symbol.,they are a secular symbol to remind us of service men and women who died whilst in the armed forces fighting for a country. These service people will have included people of every faith and of no faith whatsoever. It would be wrong to link their sacrifices to Christanity (and I say that as a church going Christian).

The problem with it for me is that it essentially says that religion's intolerance of dissent is legitimate. [A concept we previously rejected in the 60s/70s/80s when overturning Christian blasphemy laws]

These sentences passed by our secular courts based on 'religious hatred' are indistinguishable from those passed out in Muslim parts of the world based on purely religious principles.

It might be severe for "throwing bacon" but it is totally deserved for being a complete arsehole and throwing bacon at people with a religious taboo against bacon out of sheer jerkitude.

Those guys need to be taught to not do this shit again, ever.

I wish sexist hate crime was punished as severely, but that's a problem with too lenient punishments for misogynists.

It's not just twattish - it's intimidation. There are kids in mosques. And the whole 'Muslim' is not a race thing is crap too. Most Muslims are born Muslim - it's a part of their identity as religious and ethnic minorities - they may or may not be particularly religious. They may just go to mosque once a year, or every night. The point is, being a Muslim in a country where they are a minority is not the same as being a Muslim in a Muslim majority country. It's no different to standing up to the intimidation or attacks on Christian minorities in say Pakistan. You'd be a twat to argue that they should just change their name from Mary to Miriam and stop being Christian if they don't like being attacked.

" Take another example: anyone spitting on a woman should receive the same treatment. It does not matter if you spit because she is wearing a veil, or because she is not!"

Unfortunately it does though - when a woman in Muslim garb in New York was set on fire, it was international headline news.

When it turned out that three NON-Muslim women had also been set on fire in the same manner, so the target was 'women' as a class and not 'Muslims', the media lost all interest.

The reason that some twats burn poppies is nothing to do with Muslims being 'offended' by then. Why would a Muslim be offended by a poppy?

It's because the symbol if the poppy has been appropriated by the likes of bloody Britain First and the EDL and their counterparts on 'the other side' know that burning them will piss people off and create further frothing and division, which for some reasons, is exactly what they want.

They are two cheeks of the same arse, both as bad as each other. They should be punished accordingly.

they are a secular symbol to remind us of service men and women who died whilst in the armed forces fighting for a country.

Exactly. Hate crimes don't need a religious reason. Have you already forgotten Lee Rigby?