to let dd go vegan (at least partly)?

[marvelousdcomics]

DD is 14 and wants to go vegan. She has presented me with facts, statistics etc. She wants to do it for her health, animal cruelty and the environment. Due to her past EDs (anorexia, bulimia & binge eating) I've said as long as she doesn't start cutting her calories ir anything, we'll see how it goes. DP is completely opposed to it, however. He says we need meat & dairy etc. Should I let her? I was going to insist on including fish occasionally but DP is even against that. WWYD?

Tell her you want to do more research and talk to her Drs (I'm guessing you haven't yet?). Work with them to make a plan, part time vegan, gradual change, only vegetarian, reevaluating at a later date, whichever is best. If you decide after research it isn't the right thing to do explain and offer to revisit in x time, or after y goal is reached if she still feels the same. The fact you have thought about it and looked into things instead of an automatic no will probably mean a lot to her. I'd want the Drs insight before deciding either way if it was me.

Quorn - eggs from chickens in your own garden aren't full of anything. They are helathy and nutrious. Chickens can be eaten after egg laying ends after a few years. They eat kitchen scraps so very efficient. No all meat/ dairy/ eggs are 'bad'

Quornflakes.

I am talking about balanced diet that includes organic meats and vegetables.

Plus I think Minimoan made a very valid point. its about OP DD. We are healthy adults and she is child with ED.

TempusEedjit - completely agree a vegan diet consisting of Oreos and skittles is a really bad idea but so is a carnivorous diet consisting of Oreos and skittles. I have to ask why did your 14 yo DSD end up cooking her own meals or if I have got that wrong why wasn't she cooked more than pasta and risotto?

I would like to challenge a few posters here about the apparent automatic assumption that if your veggie/vegan you have you take supplements? Why? A balanced vegan diet is as easy as any other, its as likely a carnivore would need supplements, but does anyone ever take them to the doctors about what they are eating?

I have a friend whose teenager recently went vegetarian, parents were very worried and took her to doctors, iron test showed levels weren't at high end of normal so they have decided to put her on supplements, seriously the level of education in some people is so low.

Artandco - I bet you £10 pounds that you don't only eat eggs from your own garden raised scrap fed chickens. Do you really scrutinise every single food/meal you eat to filter out all meat/ dairy/egg products from your diet and only eat eggs from home. If you do then you are pretty close to a vegan.

Quorn - no I don't , because I live in a flat. I do buy local and as ethical as possible though. My parents however do, they have 8 chickens, 6 ducks, bees and two goats. They only eat eggs they produce, only consume their goats dairy produces ( milk and cheese and yogurt), and they make honey. They eat the birds when they are too old. No way are they vegan, they eat meat and dairy!

Prostolos13, I have said I have no experience of ED,s I am only defending a vegan diet. The only opinion I have on ED is that it seems to me that forcing someone to eat a particular food against their will is as likely to cause an ED as allowing them to try to be vegan.

You do realise organic does not mean their is no chemicals added to food? And despite decades of research scientific studies do not show that organic products are more nutritious and safer than conventional foods.

Quorn flakes... This isn't about the pros and cons of a vegan lifestyle, since you have no experience of eating disorders then you cannot reasonably comment on this. Forcing someone with anorexia to eat things they don't want to is pretty much the treatment.... For someone still in early Ed recovery this is a massive no no. Eating disorder units would completely agree. Once you have an Ed mindset you are always at risk and cutting out a food group is akin to a recovering alcoholic having just one drink....

Op.. your daughter should be eating three snacks, three meals to keep her safe. Veganism will not keep her safe.
Good luck

Artandco, so you buy local and ethical great, does that include all the millions of foods that have eggs, milk etc as an ingredient?

If your parents grow/produce their own milk, cheese yogurt and meat then they are very rare and I applaud them. And if you understand anything about the ethics of veganism them you would understand how close they are to it. I am not against eating meat its the production of meat that is a problem. And I still am a bit sceptical that your parents who live on a 'self sustaining farm' never go out to a supermarket or restaurant and buy anything that has a mass produced factory farmed ingredient in it.

Way to derail a thread with a few personal agendas.

This thread isn't about ops dd starting a vegan diet imo. It's about ops dd starting a restricted diet. Replace vegan with gluten free, dairy free, paleo whatever... It ultimately boils down to a teenage girl with a history of eating disorders wanting to restrict her diet in some way and op wanting advice on that.

Quorn - It's hardly a farm, it's a large garden. And no, I try not to buy stuff mass with animals produced in supermarkets etc. Many people I know don't often either. Many vegan products are made just as unethically i.e. Palm oil. It's still vegan, but people aren't better if they consume that instead of an egg!
Quinoa farming is doing terrible things those areas right now as overgrown.
It's not vegan v meat, it's being ethical in general. You can be a very unethical vegan, as well as an ethical omnivore.

quornflakes I thought my post was clear that DSD wasn't eating a balanced vegan diet and that I wasn't blaming the vegan diet as such. At least when she was/is vegetarian she ate lots of Quorn, cheese and eggs, and therefore because she was having proper protein-filled meals she was eating a lot less of the Oreos and skittles etc in between.

The reason why DSD was cooking many of her own meals whilst vegan was because she has two siblings on the spectrum who would have had major issues with having their diet changed. Their mother (who works full time in a demanding job) wouldn't have had time/energy to cook separate meals every day especially as DSD is old enough to cater for herself. I'd cook for DSD when she was was with me & DH at weekends because I had the time to do so, but this was only two evening meals a week because she was out with friends during the day.

Minimoan I DO have experience - 20 years of anorexia.

user1471541923, your partly right. This is about ED but it is also about is veganism healthy and also is it possible to get a teenager to eat something against their will. So I can comment reasonable.

NHS ED units do support vegans, so its just wrong to say its a no no.

I do know trying to trick or force someone to eat can make things worse.

Artando palm oil isn't vegan.

Every patient in an Ed unit has to be forced to eat, or threatened with tube feeding.... Without forcing in nutrition they cognitively decline and can't get well.

How is palm oil not vegan, what is it made of then?

For anyone who has misunderstood, dd had anorexia, then bulimia. She is in recovery for binge eating right now. They've all taken a toll on her body. I'm just concerned and want the best for her. Thank you everyone

Alba - how? Palm oil is made from a plant

TempusEedjit - I wasn't having a go at your post, I am genuinely interesting in what happened! Thank you for replying.

Artandco - "I try not to buy stuff mass with animals produced in supermarkets" - So in other words you do buy mass produced stuff with ingredients from factory farms.

Simplistically palm oil isn't vegan because of the practices involved in its production. Vegan is not as simple as meat verses plant, its an ethical system based on a plant diet. Of course you can get unethical vegans and ethical meat farmers, but that comparison is like making ethical coal miners comparable to unethical solar farmers, its just worlds apart.

I am against the destructive Quinoa farming as much as I am destructive meat farming, but as this is a text based forum and we are forced to use labels such as vegan that only define us in a very simplistic way.

user1471541923 - Every patient in an Ed unit has to be forced to eat
But they can't be forced to eat a particular food that is against their belief system, a vegan could not be force feed meat.

frikadela01 - Way to derail a thread with a few personal agendas -
Your right I have, I didn't plan to get so invested in this thread. So goodnight. Apologies marvelousdcomics.

In reply to Quornflakes ... who by her own admission "has no experience of ED's" but is commenting on this thread about a child who is currently suffering, and requiring specialist treatment, for ED's ...

Community/outpatient ED services may support support highly considered and balanced vegan diets in patients that are at a lesser medical risk, BUT as I stated all inpatient units (that I know of/have attended) do not allow vegan diets.

This is due to the need to refeed patients who often critically/severely ill on admission (with critical electrolyte, potassium and blood sugar abnormalties and hypo-metabolism amongst multiple other medical issues (caused by severe anorexia/bumimia/occasionally chronic binge-eating).

These patients need to be refed quickly and medically safely to prevent fatality (in the case of anorexia/chronic bulimia). Due to the body's inability to digest many foodstuffs when the stomach has severely shrunken/digestion system is entering 'shutdown' ... and therefore the need to refed quickly on foodstuffs that the body is able to easily digest when in a dangerously ill state is a priority ... inpatient units will refed only following a vegetarian, pescetarian or meat-eating diet (not a vegan diet), in my experience.

It was explained to patients that it is not about prejudice against vegan diets, it is about acting in a medically-safe manner to refed them quickly. And yes, in the case of anorexia, the patients are forced to eat many, many things they don't want to ... against their wishes ... in order to save their lives! ED inpatient units do a great job, so I just want to clarify why they take this stance.

I realise (thankfully) the OP's DD is not in need of this level of treatment currently, but feel the OP is asking out of concern due to her DD's past/current history of ED's ... not because of a need to be educated about the pro's/con's of a vegan diet. I will 'bow out' now, but hope the OP finds some of the response's on this thread will give her 'pause for thought' ...

Veganism is brilliant and I wish everyone was. However, if you're really worried, perhaps suggest a half way house with very cruelty free eggs and dairy. Check out 'no slaughter' options e.g. 'Hen nation' eggs and 'ahimsa' milk. And for anyone who doesn't realise that milk and eggs involve cruelty and slaughter, I suggest watching 'earthlings'. It's free on YouTube. It's important not to be ignorant.

Artandco because it's generally accepted that it's not sustainable and harms the habitat of a lot of animals. For that reason many vegans don't consume it.

Minimoan there's now many kinds of nutritionally complete liquid foods that are vegan - like Huel - which I hope will eventually be included for refeeding (currently Ensure is used which is full of crap). I've been using Huel in my recivery, it's extremely digestible.

Actually OP that might be something to consider for your DD - here's a link:

huel.com/

It might be ok but I would question if it is an excuse for her to reduce food intake.
Whenever I have restricted my diet I have got depressed. Invariably I was anaemic and it wasn't really true depression. Taking a few iron tablets won't help and a proper diet is what is needed.
If she is on Instagram I would be checking that she isn't following that Ella or those Helmsley sisters who all seem to encourage odd eating disorders under the guise of eating healthily.