'It might not have been rape, she might have had sex and regretted it afterwards'

[BravoHopeful]

This statement makes no sense. If you had consensual sex and the next day regretted it, why on earth would you go through the whole horrible experience of reporting it to the police and everything that follows? You would just move on and put it behind you.

It's always trotted out as a likely explanation in 'date rape' type cases. But it makes no sense whatsoever. AIBU?

No I don't think 5% is acceptable. The conviction rate should go up and the number of (reported or not) rapes should be going down.

Organisations like Womens Aid do fantastic work in providing help support and education, its the feminist views I struggle with. Saying 'men shouldn't rape' is right, but how are you going to implement that?

How do you think we can ensure rape conviction rapes go up, and the number of rapes goes down, korma?

Comforting but the reason people are saying simply men shouldn't rape, is because for years women have been told what they should wear, where they should go at night, who they should have sex with but it's not really working.

The law is letting women down because of rape myths. Did you read the link that mumsnet posted.

The moment you start to place some blame on the woman for being raped it escalates. From a promiscuous woman in a hotel to a woman in a violent relationship, to a student walking home in a short skirt, to a woman who flirted with a male friend.

Where does it stop? When do we say no, it wasn't her fault she got raped?

Your views of acceptable behaviour for women will differ from others.

For you it might be the women who kept going to hotels, to others it might be the woman in the short skirt.

To the general public there's a big difference between a woman who is promiscuous, who frequently goes off to hotels with men she doesn't know, leads men on as though she is going to give consent, is lying on the bed naked etc, and a woman trapped in a DV relationship, living in poverty, desperately unhappy. One has choices the other doesn't. One could have prevented their situation

ARGH please STOP with the victim blaming Comfort. How come you never post about your horror regarding what rapists put women through - even the ones who "could have prevented it" (they fucking couldn't BTW)? It's all about how women can be blamed. Go and read MNHQ myths before you come back posting tripe like that

korma

Try and understand that your attitude is EXACTLY why these threads get heated. It's exactly why there is so much anger. The women on here, for one reason or another, have educated themselves on the reason we have the lowest conviction rate in Europe. There ARE reasons. It's not chance, it's not because we have fewer rapists, it's not the 'grey area'. It starts with unenlightened, uneducated views like yours. Historically those views have allowed rape to flourish.

I'd you feel this is just a feminist viewpoint and far too militant for your taste, PLEASE take a few minutes to read up. There are zillions of well-researched, educated, entirely sensible and balanced websites.

Seriously, just google 'why women get raped' and read the, say, top four hits.

Then come back.

Women's Aid was launched by feminists.

It seems your gripe is with feminism, more so than it is with rapists, and you're really not worth conversing with.

To suggest there's only one kind of rape victim is disgusting, you horrible little misogynist.

I want Korma to read. I want her/him to take 5 minutes to see whether there is the tiniest outside chance that she/he is wrong.

I want to see if it makes a difference.

so a Trump donor who was spouting the "regret" bullshit has finally conceded that he was wrong, twenty years later.

In the 1995 book, The Diversity Myth: Multiculturalism and Political Intolerance on Campus, Thiel and Sacks wrote of Stanford’s sexual assault policies: “It is ludicrous to believe that anyone who had been forcefully violated would not know it and bear physical marks.

Looks like not much has progressed in Stanford in the last 21 years...

I know we are clever enough to rebut korma.
I think the post should be deleted because it sends a message about what is acceptable to say and what's not.
Also there are very courageous women on here who've shared their stories that I assume will find that post upsetting.
If we can delete posters for misgendering, why not for total misogynistic tripe?

korma isn't going to read anything datun as their views are clearly a deeply held belief. They will just write it off as "feminists"

On feminism:

all women are feminists unless they are willing to hand back their right to equality, to vote, to education, to equal pay.

Felas I hear what you're saying, but it should still stand. It is the essence of what I'm saying really. If Korma is a future jury, I want to at least try some enlightenment. If only one other person reads it and then reads the counter-point and mind-shifts ever so slightly, it will be worth it. But it does go to show how ingrained the beliefs are.

I'll be surprised if korma does read it. But the next post would be definitive if she/he didn't, in my opinion. If you read it, you can't help but be possessed of a little more knowledge. If you don't and continue in the same vein, then that says all you need to know. At which point, I'll ignore her/him. (Anyone know if korma is male or female? Getting fed up with the / ).

I find that post upsetting. I imagine korma would think that about my rape. But it needs to be strongly challenged and we need korma's post to demonstrate the level of ingrained ignorance there is.

Also at different times in my life, both korma's descriptions could be applied to me. They possibly aren't unrelated. That's why it's so important to challenge korma's lazy assumptions, because victims of rape are people, and no one "deserves" to be raped.

Venus I was going to say something similar.

Those women korma describe, the promiscuous one in hotels and the downtrodden victim of dv. They're one and the same.

Most of us don't live our lives as nuns.

I'm not victim blaming. I said if a jury were presented with the evidence of he said/she said and without any other evidence how are you going to reach a guilty verdict ? Those cases won't even get to court.

My argument is women should try to protect themselves not only from rape, but assault, robbery and murder, like the Suzy Lamplugh advocate. The argument up thread is that it is men who needed educating, women can do as they want.

You are advocating for them to be allowed to use rape myths in their appraisal of the situation.

That's why it's so important to challenge korma's lazy assumptions

At the end of the day you can't reason with stupidity.

You said a woman could have prevented her own rape. If that's not victim blaming I don't know what is.

Technically we could all prevent our rapes by segregating ourselves from all men. Doesn't put the onus any less on men not to fucking rape!!

How should women protect themselves from rape? Or are you suggesting I have to constantly consider that I might be raped in everything I ever do, and limit my life accordingly? That's why your suggestions are so offensive. I didn't fucking set out to be raped.

Korma the trouble with that is it isn't only promiscuous women in hotels that get raped and aren't believed.

It's women raped in relationships, women raped by male friends, women that don't have bruises and injuries.

Promiscuous women in hotels have as much right to be believed as anyone else. These are ancient rape myths, and they're founded in the misogynistic idea that impure women lie and deserve what's coming to them.

Sorry, lighthouse, wasn't criticising your post, just wanted to stress that rape is rape is rape.