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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Or are my neighbours complete IDIOTS 😂

795 replies

Lilianna123 · 19/10/2016 17:51

Another neighbourly dispute, same neighbours that claimed our cat was teasing their dog, and the same neighbours who accused us of stealing blackberries off their bush that happened to grow over my fence.

Well if I hadn't thought they were ridiculous before, I definitely do now.

Woke up this morning to find a note through the door saying they have had a new piano delivered and due to space they were limited on places it could go indoors (not our problem) they are saying where they have placed it is under a window and their view from the piano is a large oak tree which is in our garden. Their problem is that they are saying the many birds nests that are in this tree are distracting and these wild birds are making too much noise therefore distracting them from the piano.

There isn't even a suggestion in the note of what they'd like us to do about it. Not that I would even consider taking any action towards the tree but FFS what on earth are they doing? They don't have a bloody leg to stand on??

OP posts:
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Holldstock1 · 20/10/2016 20:20

Hi I'm so sorry to hear about all this. I've read this whole thread and laughed at lots of it, but having a nasty neighbour living next door is no laughing matter to live with.

I would be pretty careful about what you say and write back to them and anything that is said by either you to them or them to you, have it said in front of independent witnesses and any correspondence you might make about it to them, I would put cc to (appropriate authority i.e. Council, Community Police Officer, is there a Council based Neighbour liaison person for helping to settle domestic disputes? etc). That way you have verification of what is said and they can't say you are being unreasonable, swearing at them or threatening them etc etc.

I would suggest the first thing though is to get proper advice about what your rights are with the tree in your garden (yes I know it sounds crazy). Also find out what your neighbours' rights are about the tree in your garden - i.e. if they could claim it blocked their light, roots might be invading their property damaging fences or walls, you name it ask about it (find out what they could use against you should they go that route - after all he probably wouldn't be stupid enough to say to the Council or Police it was due to birds distracting him from the piano!). Forewarned means you are prepared.

Be sure about what a TPO actually means for you if you get one.

I would also ensure that you log everything that you are sent from them, keep everything. Take pictures of the tree in case anything does happen to it. If you are truely worried about what action he might take without your consent you could put a camera onto the tree which would show any 'work' he might do to it, but I wouldn't tell them that unless you mention you are putting a 'Birdcam' in for birdwatching. To be honest I'd probably not even tell them I was doing that. I'd also keep a log of all the piano practice -dates, times it starts, times it finishes, and whether you can hear your TV (check volume level on your TV) over it. I'd note beside them which piano practice sessions were difficult for you.

Did you say they've complained about your cat and their dog???? I'd note that down as well on any logs - date, what's been said etc. If they are starting about one thing they might likely start about others if they don't get their way. Andy sounds like the sort.

It might be worth getting the tree assessed by a tree surgeon when Andy/wife is not around, and maybe a report that its not blocking light, roots causing damage to their property etc, but I'd get that advice from the Council or whoever first off, as you don't want it to appear that you are thinking of taking it down.

I would also suggest do not lose your rag (I probably would as I'm short and stroppy but in this sort of instance it doesn't do you or your standing any good to be seen to be anything other than reasonable), so do not send any nasty notes or stroppy comments (even though he well deserves them), and do not swear (tempting I know) at him or touch him or his wife in any way (even a friendly touch on the arm to say can't we just get past this - you don't know what someone like that might say in the future - Watch Nightmare Neighbours/ Neighbours from Hell on TV).

Personally I'd put up the fat balls etc - its cheaper than a solicitor and take pictures of it being done. So you can be seen to be the one being reasonable. But that would be the only concession I'd make.

I am an older beginner on the piano myself, and have been playing for a year, and I can tell you it can get noisy (especially with the Tourettes I develop when practicing a new piece!)- luckily for us our piano is sited in a well insulated garden annexe on an outside wall but not with the sun directly on it - that's really bad for a piano - sun and even central heating or underfloor heating especially can really ruin a piano. So I don't have to be considerate of who might hear my practices, but if the piano were in our semi detached cottage, then yes I would. Its not reasonable to be doing that early in the morning or in the evening, or during primetime TV. I'd have to think about our neighbours and be considerate.

If you Google re pianos, you'll see that you can get electric keyboards but also something called Silent Pianos which I think are like normal acoustics but allow you to fit headphones to avoid the problem of annoying other people. He could also stand it on a thick rug to lessen the noise and I think you can also get something fitted into pianos to lessen the volume - I'd check that out (I might be wrong), my piano was a free one off of Freecycle, not the expensive instrument Andy's probably bought. I've seen pianos on the internet listed for anything from £2000 - £10,000 + secondhand (bang goes me upgrading!) so if I were spending that sort of money I'd want to make sure light and heat didn't ruin it. And I'd also google about soundproofing as if you were buying a piano and wanted to lessen the noise for the neighbours and what a neighbours' rights are re noise and pianos. i.e. be knowledgable so that YOU can be the one who is always seen to be reasonable and actually know what they are talking about in a calm sensible way.

I'd do all of that sooner rather than later, especially getting that advice.

What I can't understand is if he's really properly practicing why is he even noticing the birds? My piano is in shade, but its on a north wall next to patio doors looking out onto the garden and my chickens. When I'm practicing the only things I'm looking at is the music I'm trying to read and the piano keyboard if I'm getting the wrong notes. I don't notice what's going on outside because I'm not looking at it. And I certainly wouldn't be able to hear garden birds or my chickens clucking because the piano is loud enough I can't hear that and I'm concentrating. And yes if I was being distracted I'd shut the curtains!

Andy obviously isn't looking or concentrating on what he's playing!

So frankly I'd do what I suggested above and maybe invite him and his wife to some mediation with independent witnesses there, and personally I'd probably invite him to a local cafe or somewhere public to discuss it over a coffee. Listen to what he has to say, armed with what you know about your rights and his (as well as the environmental comments about mature oaks and wildlife alot of the other people here have said), and just firmly say you won't take the tree down, but have put up the fat balls etc his wife suggested as you are a good neighbour and reasonable person. I would tell him it was obviously his decision to learn to play which is great, but that putting the piano where he has is his decision. Obviously he's considered where he was siting it and surely took into account the view and any affect of light and heat has on a piano - he must have had proper advice from an experienced piano tuner before putting it in that position?!?! Therefore he decided to put it in that place and that is his choice and not a problem related to your property. You have tried to be considerate and help him, in the same way you will expect him to be considerate and not practice early in the morning, late at night or at a volume that will affect you and your family. Be sympathetic and encouraging him playing but let him know what you will not be happy to put up with and that you not only know your rights regarding the tree but his obligations to you regarding noise.

Then take it from there. I really hope for your sake he realises he's being a jerk and you won't be bullied and it all works out from there.

Will be thinking of you - Good Luck.

onmybroomstick · 20/10/2016 20:20

Absolutely bonkers

tracyjane41 · 20/10/2016 20:32

When I bought my house it had been empty for about a year as it was a repossession. It was in a most horrible dirty, neglected state and everything had to be ripped out and skipped (2 skips actually). After giving over nearly all of my limited funds as the deposit I had to buy a really basic, white bathroom suite and makeover what was left of the kitchen with the help of my family. As the weeks and months went on I was still arguing with banks, utilities etc who wanted unending proof that I wasn't the wife or girlfriend of the previous owner who hadn't paid ANY bills for several years. After I had finally sorted all this out I started to get mail addressed to the previous owner and gradually realised that he was running up bills, credit cards, taking out loans, signing up for charities, catalogues etc using my address but his own name!! Every week something came through the post wanting money or goods returned etc.
I spent ages emailing, calling and writing to all these people explaining to them what was happening and this was all really stressful. then one day I got in a cab to come home from my local supermarket and as I neared my house and was about to tell the cabbie where to pull up he said "I know where you live, you live in MY house" It turned out that this was the man who'd lost the house and he wasn't too happy about the bank taking it, or me buying it!! He went on and on about all the things he'd done to it and started swearing about the banks etc, now I felt a bit sorry for him and as my own parents had lost a business (which was also their home) and I myself lost my marital home to the bank cos my ex hadn't paid the mortgage on purpose, I could understand where he was coming from. Unfortunately he seemed to be blaming me for his misfortune and I was hastily trying to pay him and get out of the cab at this point. I have been in the house for 14 years now and right up to a couple of years ago not only him, but his sons continued to use my home as their address for all kinds of things, every time I thought it had ended something would come through the post and it would all start again. No one was interested in helping, not the police or the post office, or anyone he signed up to. One charity got quite shirty with me and told me that my house was on their system and even when I explained to them what was happening they said they couldn't put his name on a nuisance list because he hadn't done anything wrong!! It seems to be over now I hope, maybe they had their fun and got fed up, but you have to question the mental state of people who are willing to do this for such a prolonged amount of time.

Sunshineonacloudyday · 20/10/2016 20:42

If I was you ignore them altogether. What have you done to give them licence to tell you what to do. Was you that friendly with them?

Daydream007 · 20/10/2016 20:42

They come from another planet. Entitled and out of touch but in a very quaint kind of way!

Doublemint · 20/10/2016 20:44

It must be hard to spot when an arsehole develops dementia

Really shouldn't have snorted laughed at this.

wingingit2 · 20/10/2016 20:46

@TracyJane christ that sounds awful! I really hope it is over, 14 years and no help with how stressful 😔

SpaceDinosaur · 20/10/2016 20:47

A piano under a window will go out of tune really really quickly.

Idiots!

But then it's going to sound worse... oh dear!!!! Or poor you OP.

WTF did you "do" about Mr TIddles "Teasing" Fido anywhay?!

RustyBear · 20/10/2016 20:59

I'm wondering if you've got a Great Tit in your tree (as well as one next door)

They are lovely little birds, but their call can be incredibly annoying when they keep it up non-stop (which they do).

This is what it sounds like: www.british-birdsongs.uk/great-tit/
There is a certain monotonous rhythm to it that might put a bad piano player off their stride.

DIsclaimer: I am not being entirely serious here...

Sunshineonacloudyday · 20/10/2016 21:03

Open the window and play the bird song. Grin

ElsieMc · 20/10/2016 21:06

Oh dear. We have a neighbour like this who insists our hedge blocks his precious view of "the bay". He seems to have overlooked the fact that there is a long row of huge trees which block the view (not belonging to us) and a rather large church as well. He insists we have a criminal background, which we do not but the mind boggles at what he thinks it might be. He tells us "there is something in your past".

Our grandchildren reside with us and he dislikes our "unconventional" family set up. I think he suspects us of being secret travellers.

This is his holiday home and he behaves in a similar manner at his permanent home. Letters are written to those who fall short of his standards. The poor couple who renovated an old bungalow were written to and told "everyone hated" their house. He complains about oil tanks (we are rural and they are a necessary evil), new builds, untidy gardens, leaf fall, ivy, horses, stables, horse passports (what are they), untidy roads and protection of greater crested newts.

I found an old letter from him the other day dated 2003. The point I make here is that if you concede on this, there will be more, so much more.

He now sends me registered letters (yes, 13 years on), I decline them, he then posts the letter, I return it to his holiday home, and then he comes up (four hour drive) and pushes a note through my door. It is always sarcastic, patronising, mad and full of veiled threats. You just have to disengage and breathe. You cannot make Andy see reason.

PopsyDaisy2207 · 20/10/2016 21:16

I personally like PoltgerGoose's suggestion.
Send them a letter from the birds! 😂

Doublemint · 20/10/2016 21:20

Anyone else decided to watch The Nightmare Neighbours Next Door tonight on channel 5 as a direct result of reading this thread? Or just me Grin

Blatherskite · 20/10/2016 21:34

Not just you Doublemint Grin

2kids2dogsnosense · 20/10/2016 21:43

I feel your pain TraceyJane

My son moved into a flat some years ago - also had been empty for a while, and like the previous owner of your house the guy who had lived there had run up massive debts that he'd reneged on. Worse - by a really strange co-incidence he had the same name and birthday as my son (middle names were different, as was year of birth).

DS was getting summonses and bailiffs letters etc - it was horrendous! You wouldn't believe the carry on that took to sort out. And even now, best part of 15 years later, there is still the occasional debt collecting agency which has tracked the first guy to the address and then followed the wrong route to DS.

What a crock.

StressedOne · 20/10/2016 21:50

Post the note back to them with a measuring tape and instructions on how to use it.
this is too funny, I would be laughing so hard if I got that - such wierdos. Im sure the birds sound much nicer than their piano too.

dangerrabbit · 20/10/2016 22:04

Really funny thread and good advice from holdstock1

Just wanted to add in all seriousness though, if you have a disagreement with your neighbours this needs to be disclosed to potential buyers when selling your house

Just something to bear in mind

waterlily200 · 20/10/2016 22:24

Unfortunately I have not made it to the end of the thread but will continue reading tomorrow. So I apologise if someone has already said this.

As others have said contact the Council and ask for an emergency TPO to be placed on the tree. It needs to be healthy and 'of public benefit' (basically visible). Specifically state that it is under threat.

Take some photos of its condition for your own records. Or if you know they'll be out ask a tree surgeon to give you an appraisal of its condition (this can then be used by insurance company, see below)

Contact your insurance company. Make sure you have cover for the tree. If they do something to it that results in the tree causing damage your liable and it's very expensive without insurance.

In my job I have experience of this and would suggest the above to protect your interests and the trees.

I wouldn't respond to the note as you will end up going back and forth. Also the cheeky side of me would fill the garden with bird feeders :)

Good luck to you, and your birds.

SooBee61 · 20/10/2016 22:32

Birds don't nest in October do they?

annfield62 · 20/10/2016 22:34

Soupdragon

I was more than patient with my neighbours. I think the clue is there when they told me I was "soft" for being nice. But if your anything like they were, in other words your a moaning bother balls then your right. Thank fuck you don't live next to me.

Lilana 123

Start a petion to save your tree

acatcalledjohn · 20/10/2016 22:45

In addition to why would anyone put a piano outside?, I bring you:

Birds don't nest in October do they?

hks · 20/10/2016 23:13

haha i like the replies re sending a note to them from the birds

my father had a similar issue with his neighbours over birds sitting in his large tree at end of the garden ..which was stopping them from sitting out in back garden in the good weather due to the bird noise in the tree and bird poop ( they also have a telephone wire running from main telephone post to their house that the bird's
sit on ) They even offered to cut the tree down ..

Mamawingingit1234 · 21/10/2016 00:52

Dying for an update!!!

Lilianna123 · 21/10/2016 06:43

Have woken up this morning to a loud racket and guess what! He is bloody hedge strimming at 6.30am! DH also says he was in garden last night and Andy was making loud remarks to his wife knowing DH would hear, such as "they are jealous Jane, that's why they are being difficult, they can't have the lovely things we have" HmmGrin

OP posts:
Lilianna123 · 21/10/2016 06:46

Also yes there are no birds nests In October hence why we think there is another reason he wants the tree gone but is trying to use a silly excuse (very bright imagination) if that is the reason Grin

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