To think only 3 of the 15 migrant children look under 18

[AmyMiller]

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3843900/amp/First-migrant-children-arrive-UK-Calais-French-prepare-raze-Jungle-camp-ground.html?client=safari

This is so ridiculous, many of them look around 25.

Please bear in mind that, in many developing countries, babies are mostly born at home and things like birth certificates don't exist, so many people really have no idea exactly how old they are, esp if they've lost their mother. Yes people cheat but across large parts of Africa and Asia "about 16" is a perfectly valid answer.

Astley I've no idea what you think a 25 year old could/would do to your daughter that a 14 year old couldn't.

Where I lived in Nigeria it was common to see much older children (14/15) still in primary school as you only came to school when your family could afford it and you couldn't move up a grade til you'd passed the last one. It was fine. I don't think age is as much of a problem behavior-wise as trauma, and trauma is likely to be a very real issue for these young people. Let's hope as a country we support them with this rather than dumping them in bedsits and expecting them to cope.

I've no idea what you think a 25 year old could/would do to your daughter that a 14 year old couldn't.

We really must get rid of those pesky consent laws we have in this country.

Also all laws related to adults and minors being treated differently in law.

25 years olds are no different from 14 year olds in any way.

In some parts of the world women are so poor they can't even remember what decade their child was born.

"where are the teenage girls?"

They're in brothels, working, because we left them alone in camps to be preyed on. Hth.

If only there were some technical way to verify their age. Like others, I was astonished to see the pictures of the "children". And yes, I do know quite a few Asian teenage boys with whom my ds is friends. And none of them look as old as these young men! Even the one with a beard looks - well, like a teenager with some facial hair, not 30.

I posted on another thread that dsis had a similar experience to the teacher poster. She was doing supply teaching in a Kent school with quite a few asylum seeker pupils and was appalled at the behaviour of the "15/16-year old boys" in her classes. They were making lewd comments and gestures at the girls and at dsis. Upon reporting this under safeguarding, she was told that they had no paperwork, and that they had to be compassionate. What was worrying, she said, was that the girls themselves did not seem to be objecting, and these boys looked around ten years older than the girls. If I were a parent I would be beyond furious to find that schools were being so cavalier about this.

Bitofacow

If only 10% of those who arrive in Italy ask for asylum, and said asylum is granted to only 30% of those (so 3% of total who arrive) then they are either looking for better opportunites or not asylum seekers.

They're in brothels, working, because we left them alone in camps to be preyed on. Hth.

Who is the "we" is this passive aggressive sentence?

God I hope we never have this war on our doorsteps, see how far all your argumentativeness gets you then, coming from the same sort of mumsnet users that spend their weekends belittling the saturday girl in next over returning an item, and loving every minute. Vile people.

I for one don't care how old these boys are, if they are safe, warm and secure here then I as a British citizen welcome them. We are placing people that have relatives here that can house them at the moment so that also plays a factor.

If there were unchaperoned minors you would slam the parents for being lazy not coming with them, even though they probably died at sea.

Truly truly vile, entitled greedy people you lot are! Disgusting!

I do know how to use Google, of course, I was engaging with you to verify what you were stating. Unfortunately, as you seem to be attempting to deflect this with insults, I will not be continuing with this direct communication between us as it has become obvious that you are determined to be facetious, as you have been on many other occasions with many other people on here.
Your one sided opinions are not facts, no matter how many times you insist they are.
However, as I said, it is the equivalent to playing chess with a pigeon, so I'm out.

You asked for sources, I gave you official sources. You on the other hand did not bring official sources to dismiss what I was saying.

I've said numerous times before that I respond in kind so if I was being facetious that was a direct consequence of your posts.

Toodle loo

The sort of people that deliberately park over their elderly neighbours driveway for the sake of it and claim it's their right of way. Sometimes just don't be a douche.

I for one don't care how old these boys are, if they are safe, warm and secure here then I as a British citizen welcome them.

Yeah.

Fuck the international asylum system.

Let's just do whatever gives British people a warm glow.

Fuck the actual child refugees whose rightful claims are being denied by grown men.

As ling as I get to see peopke hugging on telly, I'm all right.

barbarianmum presumably you don't see any need to have police checks on adults that work with chikdren then? If it's ok for a 25 year old to be in a class with 14-15 year olds, then why bother? Lets just make it a free for all, eh?
Oh wait, thats already happened hasn't it. In Rochdale for example. 14 year olds are free game as long as we're all politically correct and non - racist.

All I can say is that my experience is very, very different.

The boys I work with are respectful and mostly charming. They are grateful, enthusiastic and just relieved to be in the UK and in education.

As I have said previously my teenage sons have met and spent time with some of these boys and young men. To the benefit of my boys who realise exactly how lucky they are.

And no all 25 year olds are not 25. Some 16 year olds I've worked with could be 200 because of the lives they've lead and the experiences they've had. I'm humbled by their enthusiasm in the face of extreme circumstances.

But hey if you want to enjoy being shocked and having your prejudices confirmed by others go for it.

And no all 25 year olds are not 25.

LOL

So do you want them treated as centuries old seers as well as children?

Sentimental bullshit makes shit policy and even worse law.

A 25 year old has a different legal status from a 14 year old.

No matter how grateful they are.

Good point, noeffingidea.

Amalfi - are we talking about economic migrants or refugees?

Refugees often do not respond in the way you expect them to. Like survivors of rape and other traumatised people they do not act the perfect victim.
We think we would behave in a certain way if 'it' happened to us but we don't.

When you come from a warzone your interaction with authority may not be the same as someone born and brought up in the UK. While you would arrive in Italy, work with the authorities and do what is expected some traumatised, abandoned children do not always behave like that.

I honestly don't understand why people keep making out the women and girls are still in Syria while the men fled because they were more at risk.

This is simply not true. We have all the figures on the gender balance of refugees. About equal numbers of males and females have left Syria. They are mostly in countries like Jordan and Turkey.

In Europe, refugees are overwhelmingly male.

The group at Calais even more so.

Within the refugee population, women and girls are more vulnerable.

Doinetfine - wow sentimental bullshit - OK I can't respond to that.

Losing all your family, sentimental bullshit.

I suppose I could suggest some adult women still respond like toddlers but lots of toddlers display empathy towards others.

Amalfi - are we talking about economic migrants or refugees?

From official data it would seem that most of those who arrive in Italy are indeed economic migrants.

Refugees often do not respond in the way you expect them to. Like survivors of rape and other traumatised people they do not act the perfect victim.
There is a difference between acting like a victim and willfully telling a false story to be allowed refugee status

We think we would behave in a certain way if 'it' happened to us but we don't. Do you tend to speak for everyone? Or have you data to back up your claim?

When you come from a warzone your interaction with authority may not be the same as someone born and brought up in the UK. I grew up in an area called "The Murder Triangle" in the 1970s and 80s. I have no problems interacting with the autorities as long as they aren't from my own country. And yes, it was a part of the UK and yes there was a warlike atmosphere

While you would arrive in Italy, work with the authorities and do what is expected some traumatised, abandoned children do not always behave like that I'm not talking about abandoned children. I'm talking about adults, mostly male, very few females and from first hand experience

You haven't lost your whole family.

You are just sentimentalling all over otger peoples experiences that are not your own because it makes you feel good.

Meanwhile there is a genuine problem of abuse of the asylum system and you don't care because .

Well good for you. You are an exceptional human being who would always do everything right. I can not claim this level of perfection. I make mistakes, I do stupid shit especially when stressed and vulnerable.

"We think we would behave in a certain way if 'it' happened to us but we don't. Do you tend to speak for everyone? Or have you data to back up your claim?"
I was actually thinking about the thread on sexual assault where many posters have shared that they did not behave like classic victims should.

Anyway I'm off to play chess with a pigeon.

No you're just denying facts and figures and choosing to believe that all those who arrive in Europe are refugees when that has been proven time and time again to be false.

But hey hoo as long as you feel good about it who cares about the genuine refugees being left behind.

This is an interesting addendum to this thread....

www.kentonline.co.uk/canterbury/news/immigrants-in-their-20s-put-25379/

Immigrants in 20s put in Kent schools with pupils as young as 11

Immigrants who lie about their age are being placed in Kent schools alongside pupils as young as 11, KentOnline can reveal.

Headteachers in Canterbury have disclosed that men in their 20s claiming asylum are being dishonest about their ages - prompting concern over the safety of children in schools....

Michael Walters, the headteacher at St Anselm’s School in Old Dover Road, says children are being deposited in schools in a "random and haphazard" way with very little known about their backgrounds.

When contacted, he described instances when schools had been told to expect pupils "who were 15 or 16 only to find that they were clearly 20 or 21".

Mr Walters said: "While we have great sympathy with those unaccompanied asylum seekers who arrive in England in need of education and support, this does present a difficult position for schools.

"We are being asked to admit pupils to our schools with very little information about them. Sometimes there is doubt about where they have come from, and even what age they are."

I bet they are relieved to be in the UK I bet they can't believe their luck

It's pretty shit that anyone would feel that lucky just to be in a country where they have a future.

However we respond to the situations that are leading to mass movements of people, we need to avoid pulling up the ladder.

Pragmatic solutions involve recognising what is desirable as well as what is achievable.

It is not good that the world is full of people, many if them young men, prepared to risk life and limb to get into the EU and reach particular countries there.

[[https://www.thelocal.fr/20161018/interpreter-raped-near-calais-jungle-migrant