Taking leave shortly after starting a new permanent job?

[IamtheDevilsAvocado]

Can someone sort out this skirmish Oh and I are having:

AIBU that if I start a new job I should be able to take leave over Christmas (in this line of work Christmas isn't a busy time) without waiting for my leave to 'accrue: in some way..? This job has 25 annual days leave attached to it.

AIBU

Depends, some places you can but some make you accrue it first. What does your contract say?

Most you can take before you accrue.

Most places will allow you some annual leave without having to accrue it first.

But also, in most places I've worked in, last in usually covers Christmas if it's required.

If you haven't accepted the job yet - let them know before you start that it's already booked and you can negotiate. IME if it isn't pre-arranged you usually have to chance your luck that other people haven't already booked those days off.

Very much depends on your contract.

You could have to take it unpaid.

Surely what you and your OH think about what you 'should' be able to do is irrelevant? It's your new employer who gets to decide. They may have a specific policy, they may not, and even if they don't have a policy of having to accrue leave first, that doesn't mean any individual request will be granted anyway.

I've had jobs in the past where I couldn't take any leave for the first six months. If this is the case it should be in your contract, and the employer should tell you before you start.

They're perfectly entitled to make you accrue leave before you take it. They're also perfectly entitled to tell you when you can take leave and not allow you to decide.

(They're also perfectly entitled to end your employment within the first 24 months for any non-discriminatory reason, so it may be worth picking your battles carefully.)

Most places will allow you to take AL before you have accrued it. If you then leave before accruing all of it, you will usually have holiday pay deducted from your wage slip.

It doesn't matter what your OH thinks though, the person you should be speaking to is your boss. For all you know, all the time has been booked off by other people already, so what you want could be irrelevant anyway.

It may also depend when your holiday year ends. Mine is calendar years and so I think it would be difficult to take more than you would acrue between now and the end of the year (you would get pro rata holiday allowance until the new holiday year)

Even if Christmas isn't a busy time, it sounds like some people at the company still have to work, in fact Christmas leave may well have been allocated already. I started a job end of November one year and it was just tough luck for Xmas that year.

If you get 25 days over 52 weeks, then if you started now you'd still have accrued about 10 days, surely?

It does vary though. One place I worked, my line manager arbitrarily decided I couldn't take any AL for the first six months, then got sniffy about me taking so much AL in the second 6 months. It wasn't company policy or anything, she'd just decided she didn't think people should take leave in the first 6 months. Another place I went on holiday for week in my second week (pre-planned holiday). So it really depends.

It depends. DSis had to accrue time before she could have it off, but some places don't really mind. They usually ask during the interview stage if you have any holidays or anything booked, don't they?

I wouldn't assume that you would be able to take Xmas leave whether or not leave has accrued as Xmas days may well have been divvied up by now. You will have to check the company's policy as it will vary from company to company.

I varies from company to company. However, its usual to say before accepting a position if you have day booked off already and the new company will often honour these.

Your best chance is to say you have a holiday already booked before you start the job, but unless you have family abroad they might not believe you when it's for christmas.

Otherwise it's entirely up to them.

You should be allowed to take it but whether you'll be able to have the time off is another matter. We've already done names in a hat for who gets Christmas off.

Yes, standard is to mention when they offer that you would like X dates off. I wouldn't worry so much about a few weeks at Christmas, more of an issue with 2 weeks off in August when it's already thin on the ground.

I wouldn't worry so much about a few weeks at Christmas, more of an issue with 2 weeks off in August when it's already thin on the ground.

I don't know about that.

It would be quite unusual for all Christmas holidays to not have been booked by now.

Thanks for replies! Nothing in contract - just wondered what the general feeling was!

We have family we'd like to see all over the world... And after an appalling year we'd like to see them!

You need to suss out not only the contractual things but I'd also say the general "feeling" in the workplace itself.

You don't want to be "her that started in November and then swanned off for 18 days over Christmas while the rest of us manned the phones"

As a colleague I'd feel fairly miffed (although I'd be surprised if you found holiday slots still available tbh, unless it's the kind of place that literally shuts down for a fortnight) as an employer I'd raise an eyebrow.

I think you just need to have a conversation at offer stage. There's no need to say you have a holiday booked if it's bit true - say something like "I have longstanding Christmas plans that mean I need to take X Y and Z off. Can that be arranged now?" If they say sure, get it in writing/email and make sure it's booked into their calendars as soon as you start. If they say no, you know where you stand and can accept or not depending on how important it is.

Just be clear that you're not suggesting it, you're asking to have it completely confirmed or not. Employers are totally used to this and if it really is a problem they'll tell you, otherwise it's normal for people to have made plans under one employer that they need to preferably keep under the next one.

Good luck and fingers crossed!

Oh but I wouldn't take the piss, ask for bare minimum and have a pleasant line in case new colleagues bring it up - "it was such a relief they were so understanding about the longstanding plans I had over Christmas, I'll be first to volunteer to stay next year" or whatever is true.

It should be negotiated during the acceptance of the contract. In my job, it's not optional because the office closes for 2 weeks over Christmas. But one recent addition took a 2 week holiday about a month after starting. He'd made it all really clear at the start so it was ok. I can't remember if it was leave without pay though.

I have a team of 8 and we tend to sort out Christmas in September. Just 2 people needed in the office for the 3 days between boxing day and the 1st. I would never expect a newer employee to ahve to work it with such short notice. Id assume there plans were already set. plus as others have said you may actually be required to take it as they might run out and not be able to be carried over.

The responses here just show the massive variety of workplaces. As your contract says nothing the best step is ask your manager how Christmas is delt with and go from there.

Good luck OP I really hope you do get some time off.

Christmas Day is a Sunday this year so, assuming your office is closed on Christmas Day and Boxing Day then you'll get Sat/Sun/mon/Tues off as presumably the office is closed?

Our office is closed for those days. Our Christmas leave hasn't been agreed yet - we gave to put in our requests by the end of October and then get told if we can have it. I didn't take any time off between Christmas and New Year last year so am asking for it off this year (system in our team is that 1/3 of people in a particular role have to be at work to cover emergencies, so 2/3 can be off . I would be very peed off if my reqest was refused and a new starter was given it.

I would check what system operates in the team you're working in. But don't expect to be granted it.