Is it not cool anymore to actually tell your child off?

[HulkSpiderParent]

Aibu to think that maybe some parents could actually say 'hey that wasn't nice' or 'don't push'. Or am I in the minority now that has to endure filthy looks when I tell a child off for behaviour that the parent should be pulling up?

Examples:
2 siblings on climbing frame lunge towards my ds and follow him and push him over. Parents stood gossiping while I go pick up my ds and tell their child that behaviour was unacceptable. Mother sends her friend over proclaiming to not know what happened and shocked I told them off (children of around 3 and 6. My ds is 3).

A different 2 siblings rampaging around a small play area in a shopping centre, pushing other much smaller children over (offending children about 6 and 3). Older child pushes ds out of the way followed by the younger one who then not only tries to push ds out of the way again, but grabs ds by his shirt. This time ds reacts and shouts 'stop pushing me' and grabs them back to stop falling off the ramp. Crying ensues. I go get ds but say nothing to the child as the mother is there. Sit down next to the mother who gets her dc. Sit awaiting mother to say something along the lines of 'that wasn't nice... you don't push... ' or anything to her dc.
But no. Just the usual rhetoric 'I didn't see what happened..' ...of course not. You weren't watching.
I say 'your daughter pushed him nearly off the ramp and when your son did the same he reacted when your son grabbed him by the shirt and tried to push him off as well'.
'oh well. No harm done hey?' is the reply.

No of course not. You're basically just saying to them it's fine to behave badly and not apologise. Good for you.

I know my child is no angel. I will make him apologise if he pushes or behaves badly which he sometimes does, as do all children.

Aibu though to think that this wet weekend parenting undermines everything I'm trying to install in mine. As in if you behave badly towards others you are held accountable and apologise?

I didn't tear a strip off the father, no. I walked away as it was such an aggressive act. I didn't want to be thumped!

I just didn't understand why the mother didn't leap in and say to her son - aged 8-11 - apologise now you little scrote. Or something along those lines.

I would have been mortified if my child had gone that. I would have apologised profusely. Not glared at me as if I were the wrong-doer!

Myownprivate these were not just lively. They were just left to run and charge into other children. This was not a split second lapse if concentration. They were out of control and she ignored it. Lazy.

I don't normally tell other people's children off and didn't here. I wanted to. I wanted to tell her to stop being a weak role model but I ended up being the weak one by accepting her pithy reply.

I'm annoyed with myself.

I don't hover over him but I'm always watching what he's doing and this is when I can see other people doing zero. Yes bumsexatthebingo they deliberately pushed him.

It is possible to parent with clear boundaries but not use th word 'no' heaps.

It is possible to be a completely permissive parent and use the word 'no' all the time.

I reason, explain, etc to and with my children. It's what works for us. But they have very clear boundaries and are generally, for young kids, well-mannered, thoughtful and polite. If anothr child pushes or hits them, they will stand up for themselves by saying something like "don't push me!" and will complain if the other child doesn't apologise! (I have noticed that the latter is far more effective at getting a permissive parent to take action than me saying anything!) They get quite indignant if another child seems to be getting away with bad behaviour of that kind!

There seems to be a common misunderstanding that labels like 'unconditional', 'positive' and 'gentle' in respect to parenting are the same thing as 'permissive'. They are not. If a parent isn't setting boundaries, etc for their child and guiding them, then the parent is plain ineffective - whether that's because they ignore things, are lazy, or because they provide no actual follow through with "no" or because they have misguided ideas.

I think a lot of people seem to have misinterpreted the not saying no think. We generally don't say "no" much, the logic being that small children hear no a lot and do - as a PP said - tend to filter it out. The point being, save no for when it's needed! To me, that's if the child is putting themselves or another child in danger or being unkind. So in this situation I definitely would have said "we don't push, that isn't nice" and removed DD if necessary. She's only just two, so the taking her away isn't really a punishment it's more of a "that's not nice, look, come over here and so this" distraction. Maybe that is a bit wet, I don't know, but I hear a lot of parents yelling/threatening and it doesn't seem to work!

(On a related note, I don't really work on "never say no" but more "say yes if at all possible" as I think it's easy Tibet into the habit of saying "stop doing that", "leave that alone", etc, etc so I really question why I'm saying no, and whether I actually need to. As above, part of this is the impact on other people so if DD's behaviour was negatively impacting on someone else that would be a reason to say no!)

My ds is 3 I loose count of the amount of parents I see ( or don't see) watching their kids or letting them wreck toddler classes for the other kids.
It will come back to bite them in the bum when their teenager has zero respect for them.

i have a 22 month old and we see this behaviour a lot...

My question though... If someone hurts DS or does something that I don't agree with, what do I say to DS? Do I let it slid or do I say something?

I feel like saying nothing and the other child 'getting away with it' is also a bad lesson for DS.

This is what upsets me Luckystar1. What do I say when my ds is hurt and the other parent just says 'oh well no harm done'. It's actually pathetic.

I just wanted to shout 'are you kidding me you lazy person'. Why have 3 kids and not bother looking after them properly. Grr.

mine once tried pushing another kid off the slide. he was most put out when he had to stay with me for the rest of the time. it is not fun doing the disciplining. not fun implementing the extra supervision. I would have much rather chatted, but it is what you have to do.

I think the advice on 'no' is mainly aimed at toddlers isn't it? At that age far better to reserve 'no' for dangerous and hurtful situations than say it all the time about little things you don't want them to have. Distraction and re-focus is a better technique. That means that when they they get a little older they understand that 'no' means no and is non negotiable. I haven't actually met many overly permissive parents, ime most discipline their dc in the situations described by the op. Maybe I'm just lucky though. I do think age and the child's development plays a big role in how situations are dealt with.

I've always told my daughter off if she's misbehaving despite the inevitable fall out and tantrums. It is easier not to bother so I suspect the parents you describe are just lazy. Good parents help their children learn about and respect boundaries, they don't just let their DC do whatever they like.

I wonder if the child's personality plays a part as well. DS completely ignores any attempt to distract him whereas no is marginally more effective.

Don't do this, do that approach works best, but I can't wait until I can properly reason with him (he's just shy of 2).

My children have autism so it's completely different parenting. The way I deal with it depends on their level of understanding but I will tell them off if they knowingly behave badly (would never punish a meltdown for example).

Incidentally DD who has PDA cannot cope with the word no. She has a complete and utter panic attack and meltdown. Doesn't mean you can't say no to her, just means you have to be creative with how to express it.

The reason I've posted is that I'm sure on the outside when I'm dealing with a public meltdown I look like an ineffectual parent not giving any discipline. Hell I've been tutted and told exactly that too many times - but I refuse to punish my children for being overwhelmed and expressing that in the only way they can.

But my kids do have boundaries. I do try to teach them right from wrong to the best of my ability according to their individual levels of understanding.

Just think before you judge. Is the kid a 'brat' (ugh horrible word) or is there something deeper going on that your judgment is really not helping with.

Bishop my DS has a similar profile to your DS. I would never punish DS if he is having a meltdown (I tend to hold him tight and just ride it out); but when DS was hitting me out of frustration (despite the fact that I am and then continually working on his communication skills) I found that re-directing, ignoring him etc wasn't helping, in fact he got worse. What helped was that I was using a consistent approach XYZ.

I agree notgivingin. The main point I wanted to make though was that to parents of my children it may look like we aren't dealing with things 'properly' - we are!

Was meant to add Bishop that I agreed with your post too .

Especially when DS is having a meltdown (which looks like a spoilt brat to outsiders) and they tut and sigh when they see me hugging DS.

my nt

I would never judge how parents respond to meltdowns or tantrums. My Dd is NT but if she is in a rage you have to let her sit on the floor and scream otherwise it just escalates and prolongs the incident. That being the case I'm sure all the mums of SEN children on the post would never stand by while their DC hurt or intimidated another DC. It's a different thing to different parenting styles and techniques.

That's great gamer but sadly from experience you're very much a minority

And imo telling a random child off is rude and sanctimonious. Not your place to discipline someone else's child, and it's not going to benefit you to do so - you'll never see the kid again.

It absolutely is my place to tell some kid to stop doing something injurious to me and/or mine - and if you meet me, and you or your child are doing this, I will tell you to stop, and I really couldn't give a flying fig if you feel that make me "rude and sanctimonious" because letting you kid misbehave is ruder.

Absolutely wasonthelist

Telling a child to say sorry can be counter productive too and make the situation worse. Don't get me wrong, I always tell ds to say sorry but you can't force them to do so. For this reason I usually tell him I'm not happy with his behaviour but give him 5 minutes to calm down before asking him again to say sorry. By then he's ready to do so. He's also a child who responds better to me telling him what/ how he can do something rather than just telling him he can't do it. He's a fiddler so instead of telling him he can't fiddle with something, we suggest he fiddles with something else that we don't mind him having. Aggression directed at others is a non negotiable no, followed by punishment. He is also very aware of dangers and that no means no in those sitiations too. He rarely argues in either of these circumstances and is generally a very happy, helpful and laid back little boy with bags of empathy - and we've never had to smack and rarely shout at him to get our point across.

Now my son is 3 i don't always ensure i can see him at all times in a soft play and i thankfully don't have to climb every ramp and slide anymore... i don't think parents of 3 and 6 year olds should be expected to watch them at all times.
But, if i saw the aftermath of an incident or if my son was anywhere near another child crying or if another parent said something to me or him then i would absolutely speak to him about being more careful with younger children or not pushing or whatever. It is because I do this that mostly he plays well and doesn't push or shove and i feel i can let him crawl down a tunnel without me squashing my way after him now.

Well said wasonthelist. This dogma that you must never be 'judgemental' or interfere with anybody else's 'parenting style' is nonsense. If your child's behaviour is dangerous or nasty, and you're not dealing with it, then you can't expect everyone to be as indulgent as you are and you deserve to be challenged on it, or for your child to be reprimanded if you're not around

Define 'nasty'.
If it's harming no one else then you have absolutely no right to judge or intervene and can actually make things worse.

It's unlikely my children will ever harm you or your children as we work 1-1 at all times in order to prevent that.

They're far more likely to harm themselves to be honest.

Yet people still think it's perfectly acceptable to try and intervene or verbally abuse me telling me to do something when I am doing something thank you very much.

Ok - 'If your child's behaviour is dangerous or nasty, and causing a problem for someone else, and you're not dealing with it.......'

If you're' working 1-1 at all times to manage your child's behaviour, then you're probably not the sort of parent I'm referring to