Is it not cool anymore to actually tell your child off?

[HulkSpiderParent]

Aibu to think that maybe some parents could actually say 'hey that wasn't nice' or 'don't push'. Or am I in the minority now that has to endure filthy looks when I tell a child off for behaviour that the parent should be pulling up?

Examples:
2 siblings on climbing frame lunge towards my ds and follow him and push him over. Parents stood gossiping while I go pick up my ds and tell their child that behaviour was unacceptable. Mother sends her friend over proclaiming to not know what happened and shocked I told them off (children of around 3 and 6. My ds is 3).

A different 2 siblings rampaging around a small play area in a shopping centre, pushing other much smaller children over (offending children about 6 and 3). Older child pushes ds out of the way followed by the younger one who then not only tries to push ds out of the way again, but grabs ds by his shirt. This time ds reacts and shouts 'stop pushing me' and grabs them back to stop falling off the ramp. Crying ensues. I go get ds but say nothing to the child as the mother is there. Sit down next to the mother who gets her dc. Sit awaiting mother to say something along the lines of 'that wasn't nice... you don't push... ' or anything to her dc.
But no. Just the usual rhetoric 'I didn't see what happened..' ...of course not. You weren't watching.
I say 'your daughter pushed him nearly off the ramp and when your son did the same he reacted when your son grabbed him by the shirt and tried to push him off as well'.
'oh well. No harm done hey?' is the reply.

No of course not. You're basically just saying to them it's fine to behave badly and not apologise. Good for you.

I know my child is no angel. I will make him apologise if he pushes or behaves badly which he sometimes does, as do all children.

Aibu though to think that this wet weekend parenting undermines everything I'm trying to install in mine. As in if you behave badly towards others you are held accountable and apologise?

There are loads of ways to tell a child off without saying no.

Fucking stop that.
What the fuck are you doing?
Why in God's name would you do that?
What are you up to now you shite?
Will you stop that?

I teach in a secondary school. There are a lot of kids there who are not used to being told no.

Fucks me right off.

My DD is 2. I tell her no when she does something she shouldn't. She is, funnily enough, really well behaved. Her cousin, on the other hand, is allowed to do whatever the hell he likes, including chucking a brio train at dd's head, and family just chuckle about him being a 'typical boy'. No, he's not a typical boy, he's a typical shit. Because no one is teaching him to be otherwise! Gah!!

Ah yes the typical boy thing.
I get this all the time, it's alright for you, you had a girl.

The children pushing others out of the way

Trainee BMW drivers :)

We practiced not saying no to my dgd until she was two. Always finding a way to stop her in a more creative way. I think it is a good discipline for the parents and means the children do not become deaf to that word.

But I think some people have different priorities for their children.

I remember, long before I had a child of my own an American father telling what he wanted for his daughter. Nowhere in his list was a desire for her to be a positive member of society, I was quite shocked. Where I now live in Mexico City, that is the first thing on anyone's list.

Over many years I've found that the majority of parents (and teachers...) have selective vision. You've just proved it - YOU can see this sh*t going on, but they are CHOOSING to completely ignore it, head in the sand, it's not happening it's not happening it's not happening.

I remember a birthday party and as usual I was watching DS as he climbed the slide in a bunch of other children. This little shit kid pinched him hard on the arm the little git. So I said straight away to him, "I saw you pinch my son, don't do it again!!!".

I'm sorry, but there's no sodding excuse. Open your eyes you pathetic, apathetic couldn't give a shit parents.

Sometimes. No. because I say so. Is an acceptable answer in my book.

Nah, not trainee BMW drivers, trainee Audi drivers!

Atenco, 'we practised not saying no' are you shitting me?!! /being a positive member of society shouldn't preclude you from being told off if you've blinking well done something wrong!

Jesus give me strength .

I LOVE children, I RESPECT children but for Christ's sake...

I have limited sympathy for teachers in general (sorry), but god help us, they must have a sodding nightmare dealing with the nappy clad don't tell them off kids of today. You have my sympathy on that.

'Raising your children without boundaries is genuinely child abuse IMO. It's neglect of a child's emotional and psychological needs.'

Completely agree with this. Setting boundaries, saying no and being unpopular sometimes are hugely important parts of parenting

OP I totally understand.

Though in my case, I think it's worse as its obvious to outsiders (DS has speech difficulties) that DS has SEN and God forbid you don't tell off a special needs child.

DS speech is way better than it was but he is getting frustrated... For the past year, when he gets frustrated he would hit, kick me, spit at me... in public too (can you imagine!). A lot of specialist were telling me to ignore his behaviour and to just work on his communication skills (which I have been immensely and continuing to do so) but it was coming to a point that the ignoring his behaviour wasn't helping, the hitting was getting worse and to my shame he started to hit people in public (he didn't hit them, but would grab at their clothing). I thought enough was enough! I read the "setting boundaries for your child book" (which is a book about disciplining children with special needs or strong willed children).

So everytime DS and I left the house, I would always draw out to him what I expect him to do and if he hits he gets XYZ consequence. Eg; DS when we get on a bus you must sit down nicely; if you hit, we will come out of the bus and you will go to timeout.

I brought sand timers... I used count down timer on my phone too, so DS knew how long time out was... also the school he is at now uses this approach.

Every time DS hit me; I would say to him "No hitting"; we would leave re place eg get off the bus; I would find a quiet spot, put on a 2 min timer on my phone, place this in front of DS view and we would just stand there till the timer was up. Unusually, DS was calm, but he would cry as he hates getting told off. I will get so many stares, people tutting at me, a lady went up to DS and said "are you alright" while eye balling me. But I try not to care. I did this approach consistently, it was tedious, I would get tired, but I had to do this.

Now DS doesn't hit, he still gets frustrated but now he knows how to calm down. I even brought him a watch, which has a timer. So every time DS gets really frustrated, he would set the timer on his watch, go to a quiet corner while he calms down.

I don't know if this was the right thing to do; but I'm doing my best.

I live near two high schools and the behaviour of the teenagers is my constant bug bear. They litter everywhere, walk down the pavement in packs of ten and won't budge for other people/wheelchair users/prams, block the doorway at my local shops and glare at you if you dare to say excuse me. Once a boy spat at my pram because the wheel accidentally caught his heel (I apologised immediately), they also kicked down a fence at the back of my estate so the could access our street (there's a greggs at the end of it...). I know that teens can be teens and I sound about 90 but I really think that these rude, entitled, inconsiderate people are the result of some of the parenting described on this thread. If my DS turns out like some of them I will be ashamed.

Oh ffs. Of course parents tell their kids off still. And equally, of course parents don't see every single infraction their child makes and tell them off for each and every one. So the fact you see a child do something and not get told off does not mean that child never gets told off or his/her parents don't care about discipline or something.

And imo telling a random child off is rude and sanctimonious. Not your place to discipline someone else's child, and it's not going to benefit you to do so - you'll never see the kid again.

I work in a job which basically involves, amongst other things, disciplining adults in the workplace. If someone starts working for us and behaves badly or showing an attitude problem, they get one warning and then if they don't improve, they are out. If they behave really really badly they don't even get the warning.

The children who aren't disciplined as children will grow up to be the adults in this situation. Not nice when you are dependent on a job, bills to pay etc but most employers will not tolerate people behaving like brats.

Nothing upsets me more than to see a spoilt child, and it's not the child I judge but the parents who are doing their child such a disservice.
I absolutely believe in discipline for children but it can be done in a 'firm but fair' way, with love rather than nastily shouting at them.

I don't understand this unconditional parenting lark at all. I have a friend who never disciplines her daughter, does whatever she says, and it's just storing up problems for the future because in real life there are consequences and the world doesn't revolve around you.

I think a lot of parents who don't discipline their children are essentially taking the easy way out, as they don't want the 'storm', but that's just letting the child control them rather than the other way round. It's lazy parenting.

I don't think there is anything wrong with telling a random child to behave if they are impinging on someone else's life.

A child I did not know sprayed me in the face with a powerful water pistol. I went over to tell him this was not OK. I hadn't even finished the sentence, "You don't spray people (you don't know)" before the mother had appeared from nowhere glaring at me and then the father directly sprayed me with his powerful water pistol in the back of the head.

It was utterly unacceptable. I was absolutely staggered that the parents condoned this kind of behaviour.

And whoop-de-dooh for all the sanctimonious parents who always reason and never say no. Sometimes when you are out in public you need to just get on with it, and not block where ever you are for ten minutes while you have a discussion with your child about why and how. Just deal with it and set clear boundaries. And don't stop other people having fun because you have some half-baked theory about child-rearing.
My children are lively and questioning, confident and funny. But they know they are not the centre of the universe. They know they are the centre of MY universe, and that's fine.

I'm a strict parent. I have very well behaved boys of 13 and 15, which I expect sounds smug, but I don't feel smug because I think I've done it all wrong.

I did destroy a lot of their creativity and freedom of spirit. They're boring conformists who are in all likelihood going to do mundane routine jobs their whole lives. I love them dearly and am proud in many ways but I don't think making them behave "perfectly" when they were little was necessarily the best approach.

Blimey Pikachu, did you tear a strip off the father?

The current parenting fads of never saying no and endless positive praise for every tiny little thing is really damaging IMO. They are raising a generation of kids that believe they are the centre of the universe, they will grow up as adults with no empathy or respect for others. How are kids ever supposed to learn if they are never told when they are doing something wrong?

Discipline isn't being nasty to them. It's showing them where the boundaries are. I don't subscribe to any specific school of parenting but I think kids need a boundary,then freedom within that boundary. As they get older, that boundary shifts. So for example if a tiny one is reaching for a knife a 'no!' And stopping them followed by a firm but gentle 'no . Knives are sharp, might hurt you.' Or reaching for a plug socket. A 'no!' Stops my one year old for just long enough for one of us to grab him.
As they get older the boundary shifts. No you can't play with knives to ok let's help mummy cook (blunt knife chopping soft stuff) then as they are older still showing them how to cook using a knife safely.
Or spaces - the space they play in expands as they get older. First you watch like a hawk, then you're comfy giving them freedom to play in their room alone, then put in the garden, the park etc. They know where the boundary is.

I can understand positive discipline - but there's a million situations where for safety you need to stop them in their tracks, or make them understand that a behaviour is harmful.
I don't yell, we never ever hit but nobis used a lot - used lovingly but used.
I see my job as a parent as twofold - 1. To keep them safe, warm, loved and nurtured and 2. To shape them into good people who benefit society.

No is, not nobis

(Yells no! loudly at autocorrect.)

I actually don't mind when strangers tell off DS . DS seems to respond better from strangers than me !

I don't think that the word "no" should never be used, but it is very often over used, children become numb to it and it loses its effectiveness.

In non dangerous, non emergency situations I use other words, discussion and problem solving. If she's about to touch a fire or pick up knife "no stop" is obviously appropriate and she stops instantly.

Sadly I think many parents are oblivious and distracted and don't discipline effectively, but I don't think it's because of the use or not of the word no, it's just that some parents are more (possibly too) permissive.

I've told other peoples dc off before. Mainly when we go to the local farm park and the parents think it's fabulous watching their dc 'communing with nature' by chasing the chicken, throwing sticks at the chickens or in the worst case kicking a chicken. I admit that I had very strong words with the child who did the last one.

But frequently I've had to say 'Stop it!' very firmly and loudly to the dc who think animals are something to be tormented. The parents clearly don't give a fuck.

And don't get me started on kids playing on scooters, ride on bikes, roller skates and fucking skateboards in the supermarket. I nearly lost my ankles to a skateboard rider a couple of days ago. How anyone thinks it's acceptable to let your dc of 7/8 years old ride a skateboard round a shop I bloody don't know. But then it would mean saying No to them wouldn't it.

There are parents who don't discipline their children but equally there are parents who go ott and give kids no freedom. It's hard to tell from the op if you are one of them. Did the kids actually aggressively push your son or did they just unthinkingly barge past? I think hovering constantly over children 3+ is unnecessary.
There is a mum at my childs school who is an example of an ott disciplining parent who doesn't let kids play. She was having a right go at her son for pushing mine the other day before school when he did a completely fair football tackle that my son wasn't remotely bothered by - just perplexed as to why his friend was being told off. She tells other kids off who so much as touch her child as well it's quite bizarre.

Littleprincess it's so interesting to hear your viewpoint. What made your experience so hard?

For me, various things.

Early on I had to learn how to self-police to avoid dangerous situations, and sometimes found myself in situations (like being allowed to stay out late at night in Soho at the age of 12) that were either potentially physically dangerous or were emotionally traumatic, as my parents would not say "no you can't/mustn't do that."

It had the effect of making me (feel?) responsible for making the decisions for the family, which put a lot of responsibility on me. This wasn't explicitly about not being told "no" but things like being asked to choose what I wanted for dinner rather than being told.

It took me a long time to be able to hear no (like a job rejection) without being extremely defensive and upset, even though I knew it was irrational, due to never growing up hearing it.

I don't really know how to have a healthy boss-employee relationship. Admittedly I work in a very casual and informal industry, but every relationship I've ever had with a boss or an employee has been more like a friendship or a social/personal relationship. It's sort of nice but sometimes leads to complications.