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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this takes not vaccinating to a whole new level

999 replies

Swanlaked · 26/09/2016 12:31

DD has a child at school who has cancer. The school sent a letter home asking all parents to please think about giving their child the MMR if they haven't had it and also to inform them immediately if any child was in contact with chicken pox.

One of the mums at the school is still refusing to have her 3DC vaccinated. No health issues it's big pharma/poison/conspiracy theory crap

AIBU at this point to think the school should seek removal of the children and tell the bloody thicko to find another school for them?

OP posts:
LadyConstanceDeCoverlet · 27/09/2016 16:58

I could turn that around and ask why do you vaccinate and assert that it is safe to do so, if you are not a "medic or a statistician with a specialism in then area"?

That doesn't work, Atenco, since the person to whom you are responding doesn't claim to have done their own research or to know better than medics or specialists.

Yawnyawnallday · 27/09/2016 16:59

"my cousin is a doctor who opposes vaccination."

If that is in this country and the cousin tells their patients not to vaccinate they may be struck off.

EllsTeeth · 27/09/2016 16:59

"And by the way, my cousin is a doctor who opposes vaccination"

I hope he/ she isn't practicing!!

Gileswithachainsaw · 27/09/2016 17:00

If you don't trust that process, how can you even trust the food you put in your mouth?

Alot of people actually don't in the wake of genetically modified foods and air and sea pollution and improper preparation/hygiene/storage methods .

With allergies on the increase.

Parasites
Bse
Mercury levels

Etc

Food has been under suspicion fir a very long time. There are states in America I think where they are free to label about gm foods but there are no laws enforcing it.

Difference is you have to eat.

You dint have to vaccinate

WinchesterWoman · 27/09/2016 17:05

My analogy is appropriate as you acknowledge. Each medical intervention, treatment or drug must be individually tested and stand or falls on its own merits

WinchesterWoman · 27/09/2016 17:06

Therefore smallpox is wholly irrelevant to mmr decision making (or any other jab)

MermaidMartian · 27/09/2016 17:08

gonetoseeamanaboutadog Yeah, I'm from the sensible sea, it's lovely here, I'd invite you to visit but I don't know what I'd catch off you.

Yawnyawnallday · 27/09/2016 17:08

So we test retest peer review etc etc before every medical intervention? Not feasible, economical or reasonable. They didn't even do that in the Middle Ages.

JeSuisUnChocoholic · 27/09/2016 18:00

Remind her that smallpox was eradicated because of vaccinations. As were many other diseases in Europe.

LadyConstanceDeCoverlet · 27/09/2016 18:00

Winchester, in a discussion about vaccine, any vaccine is relevant.

bumbleymummy · 27/09/2016 18:05

I'm not sure the smallpox vaccine is the best one to judge current vaccines by given its known side effects.

oblada · 27/09/2016 18:21

Can't read the whole thing but just glad to see some sensible people on here who actually have a researched viewpoint and decide not to vaccinate their kids/themselves. I'm not opposed to all vaccination but I do think it's much more complicated than a lot of people here are making it out to be and there are very valid scientific arguments against (certain) vaccines. Let's not forget where the vaccines come from: money making organisations (like baby formula! Ha another debate!). Not charities. And a lot of shit come from 'government approved' programmes/industries so yes I would encourage anyone do to their own research and decide what is best for them/their kids!!

Oh I'm a hippy brought up on homeopathy and few vaccines (where I am from some vaccines are indeed mandatory, others are elective) as I have had serious allergic reactions to some antibiotics and vaccines...
I'm also married to a man working in the vaccine industry so we sometimes do not have the same view :)

oblada · 27/09/2016 18:22

And every vaccine is different - different risk factors, different side effects and therefore it is not mandatory to take a blanket approach to this subject, far from it.

EllsTeeth · 27/09/2016 18:27

Oblada of course charities develop vaccines - Wellcome Trust for one

SandyPantz · 27/09/2016 18:35

Surely there's another option here

The school could instead request that the parents let them know if their kids have been vaccinated, then make a reasonable adjustment, i.e. swap the non vaxers with vaxers from another class so that the child who is undergoing chemo is in a class full of vaxers?

Obviously it might be tricky with the streamed classes like maths, but they could see which class has less non-vaxers and differentiate for the child undergoing chemo within that class

So they're not sitting next to non-vaxers all day, and everyone's right to refuse to consent to vaccinations is respected (and by respected, I don't just mean by the school! at the school gates too)

Beg2differ · 27/09/2016 18:42

Good grief?, I can't believe the utter drivel, bullying and nastiness being spouted on this thread.

No one vaccinates their child for the benefit of someone else. They do it because they think it's in their child's best interest.
People who don't vaccinate believe the same!

At the moment thank god we still have autonomy over our own bodies. How can someone even think to dictate that it is ok to have something forceably injected against someone's will for the benefit of someone else!

As for people suggesting that benefits, school places and NHS treatment are stopped for those who opt out of the program… Does that apply to taxes or do the non vaxers still have to pay those? Works both ways surely? Apparently not.

I chose not to vaccinate to the current schedule because I believe that vaccines permanently compromise the immune system. That is what I believe and many other scientists and doctors agree. To me that risk outweighs any benefit from most of the vaccines on the current schedule. If you don't agree with me, fine, do what you want, I don't really care. I believe that having a strong immune system is generally the best defence.

And yes, when I was a child I had every one of the diseases on the current schedule. All pretty mild, as they were for most people. Like I said, i believe that a strong immune system is the key. Dont agree? Fine, go ahead and let someone else take responsibility for your health or how ever you view it. But please don't think to dictate what I should chose to do.

The following is stated by the CDC …”Chronic Diseases: The Leading Causes of Death and Disability in the United States. Chronic diseases and conditions—such as heart disease, stroke, cancer, type 2 diabetes, obesity, and arthritis—are among the most common, costly, and preventable of all health problems”

So basically the real cost to our health and the health system are self inflicted diseases…something we have control over. Surely we'd spend our time a little better concentrating on that.

Kew1234 · 27/09/2016 18:45

We need the herd to keep these horrific diseases at bay. We have a moral and social responsibility to ensure that all people who can have the vaccinations do. There should be clearer exemptions for those who can not (they need to be protected by the herd vaccination) then absolutely not allow those who just refuse for no valid reason access to school without a vaccination certificate. A lot of nurseries already won't accept children who haven't been vaccinated (unless for a medial reason). Ps I thought I'd had all my vaccinations, I've always been good about it, especially with lots of travel. Then I got Whooping Cough (outbreak in the States), turns out I was the only one in the family not to get vaccinated (some daily mail esq scare that year). I was so ill, house quarantined for 10 days, I broke a rib from the coughing, burst a few blood vessels - but I was an adult with good health, It can be a death sentence babies and seriously dangerous to those in poor health. I had a dread of fear that I may have unsuspectingly passed it on, I'd been on planes, trains and the tube. Conspiracy theories are no excuse for risking your child's health now or in the future. Propagating and encouraging people to not get vaccinations is a dangerous. Angry

bumbleymummy · 27/09/2016 18:52

Sandy, I get your point but it's not like unvaccinated children are all carrying dangerous diseases around with them. There could be a vaccinated child in the class harbouring CP or flu and they would be the risk to the immunocompromised child.

Jaxhog · 27/09/2016 18:52

Kew1234 me too re Whooping Cough. I do have a compromised immune system, and was out of action for nearly 6 months. It seems my mum (a nurse) forgot to get me vaccinated. Then forget to tell me.

You don't have to guess my position on this.

WinchesterWoman · 27/09/2016 18:52

Winchester, in a discussion about vaccine, any vaccine is relevant.

Well - no. Obviously not.

WinchesterWoman · 27/09/2016 18:54

We have a moral and social responsibility to ensure that all people who can have the vaccinations do.

Unfortunately that responsibility doesn't extend to vaccine damaged children it seems.

What you will get is fobbed off. And your child won't be counted in figures on vaccine reactions.

bumbleymummy · 27/09/2016 18:54

Kew, even if you had been vaccinated against WC as a child, it's likely that your immunity would have waned by now anyway. That's why there have been an increase in outbreaks despite the uptake of the WC vaccine (part of the 5-in-1) being high. Immunity has waned in older children/adults.

kali110 · 27/09/2016 18:56

So vacinations are there to make money? Wouldn't they make more money from people getting ill from the diseases?
I now have a flu jab every year.
When i didn't and got the flu i had so much medication i have no idea how much money they made from me Grin

WinchesterWoman · 27/09/2016 18:58

Kali that's the point. Incurable, long-term drug maintenance immune disorders are much more profitable that acute disease.

Did you look up the WHO and Vitamin A?

kali110 · 27/09/2016 19:01

No you didn't get my point...

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