Re DH giving formula?

[passremarkable]

So I'm an AIBU lurker. Not posted before except 1-2 comments. Posting now BC feeling quite upset really & keen for perspective.

So background... 1st baby, difficult delivery, ill afterwards, struggled with breastfeeding in terms of milk supply. Baby dropped 86th to 11th centiles. Eventually at 8 weeks went to breastfeeding clinic. Saw amazing MWs who advised on how to give formula tops ups to get my BFing back on track. Had mastitis 4 times but managed to feed till 10 months.

Baby no 2 will be 3 weeks today. Have been hospital in patient for > 50% of time since birth with complications for him & me, but essentially nothing serious/permanent wrong. Both doing well now at home.
I'm so delighted that despite a rocky postnatal course I've been BFing brilliantly. He had one formula top up when I had to leave him on ward for tests (no pump available in time). But otherwise all BFing.

We're home a few nights now. Hubby has been asking to give a bottle +++ since before
Baby born. I've explained umpteen times that given our fertility issues this might be our last chance to have a child. I really want to do it as naturally as possible. I've said in open to top/ups with EBM ideally, but would be ok with formula if baby not thriving or if problem with milk etc. But otherwise I want to BF if I can.

I've not had energy to deal with expressing yet but had collected a little extra leakage (sorry!) & to appease hubbie said if baby got hungry last night while I was getting ready for bed he could offer the bottle. It was only 20mls. I said I would be upstairs & ready to feed him when he was done. So last feed ended 2230hrs.

It's now 3.30am. I just woke up with really sore engorged boobs, top, sheets etc soaking from leaked milk (sorry again buyout washing machine is broken so in royally irritated about unecessarily laundry). He's just brought baby in for feed. I must have fallen asleep earlier. He's just admitted he's given 120mls formula 11-midnight. He reckons baby vomited a third of it (has been reflux anyway).

I am probably so in this right now as to be a bit OTT but I'm really so upset as to feel quite numb.'I don't know where to start to express to DH how Upset I am that he's ignored the BFing plan, made unilateral decision to do something like that.

If he'd just asked Id have explained again. Baby's weight perfect. I'm a bit tired but actually been better past 48hrs than any time since birth. Been in brilliant mood, had visitors. success of BFing has helped my recovery Inthink.

I'm open to formula if we need it having been there before, I know how hard it is for
Folk that want to BF but can't.

Why would he do this now though?
How do I express my upset without throttling him?
How do I get him to support me?

Be gentle. Sorry for rambling....

pass

Now you've mentioned neonates, I understand!

Our twins were in NICU for 16 weeks, on regimented feed schedules, for obvious reasons.

The girls have been home 5 weeks and I'm bf-ing on demand. DH still makes comments like "but they only fed an hour ago", or "how can they be hungry again"...

I've had to draw a lot of analogies for him about how often he eats/is hungry, and that I don't say he isn't allowed to eat for 3 hours after a meal etc. It's slow, but I think he is finally getting it.

The girls used to only wake up every 4hrs in hospital for feeds, but that's cos (as your DH knows), feeds are calculated on weight - e.g. 150mls/kg of weight, and babies are expected to take all of the milk/formula every time, leaving them stuffed and tired; hence sleeping through.

Ahhh, he's got his work head on!

Having had 2 prems through nicu/scbu, I can understand his thought processes - as others have explained up thread, it's a regimented feeding process due to sleepy, prem babies who don't feed well.

Totally different kettle of fish to a breast-fed term baby. Polar opposites.

Tell him to take his work head off & do a bit of reading-up!

As he is a doctor he might respond to the Dr jack Newman book and website. The book is fantastic, it emphasises that in most cases breastfeeding will work if mum has confidence and she and baby can get on with it without interference. Also balanced advice for how to help/ get help if needed. Dr Newman is a breastfeeding specialist paediatrician (something I doubt we have in the UK!).

I do think your dh was trying to help. As he looks after neonates as a Dr maybe he finds it hard to leave all the feeding to you, and feels he 'should' be doing more. He probably doesn't trust that things are going well as he has previously seen breastfeeding as complicating things on his ward e.g. can't measure intake.

Still v annoying but I'm sure he did it with good intentions. Those early weeks can be a real head fuck and people don't always think clearly.

As bfing is going well I'd bin the formula. We didn't have any as I worried my dh would give it to get more sleep! He is v supportive of bfing but a crap decision maker when tired, and I think he felt he should be protecting me from the wake ups.

For me co sleeping worked really well as I could snooze whilst baby fed.

Bullshit behaviour. Make him do the extra laundry and don't do it again. I would be FURIOUS.

We've had big chat & think we've ironed it out. Thank you so much to everyone for replies - really great to have soundboard in middle of night for perspective

He totally admits work head & I think he's really sorry. I guess we've been in a lot (term baby but had again probs) so it's been a source of concern for him. He doesn't like seeing me I'll either. He's said he can see baby is doing well etc.

Suspect he doesn't quite get it but I reckon he's going to leave well alone for the time being.

V good idea on that book hopelessly Will look it up. Science is good

I think we're getting somewhere...

I don't think his intentions were all that good. He desperately wanted to feed the baby himself and did what would facilitate that. And OP doesn't trust him now because she's going to bin the formula because she thinks he cants be trusted with it in the house.

That said, I think it's unfair in him that OP gets to make all the decisions about their child. There's a lot in her posts about "explaining" to her husband the reasons for her decisions. But they are all her decisions and not mutual ones.

That's the big problem here. OP you need to co parent and discuss how to fulfill his desire to feed the baby himself perhaps with formula if you can't pump enough. And he needs to stop treating the baby like a toy for his enjoyment and stop sneaking around rather than talking honestly with you.

I must be knackered today btw... Lot of typos. Hopefully you get the gist...

It does sound as if he took a sneaky opportunity to feed the baby.

There's lots of other things he can do.

I would have thought that his job would have made him realise the importance of Bfeeding & feeding on demand!

I think it is really sad and scary that a doctor who looks after poorly babies isn't educated on what breastfeeding a healthy baby looks like. Surely that's the top outcome everyone on the wards should be working towards? As a HCP he really has no excuse for his lack of knowledge.

diddl even when I was beginning to BF on demand in the neonatal unit, the nurses still had to document long each baby fed for, and how often, and look at whether they were having lots of long sucks etc.

It's the on demand bit that caused them 'problems' I think, because they are so focused on weight gain/numbers/feeding plans etc to make babies better

He has behaved like a dick. If he's a medic, perhaps he should read up on breastfeeding.
Chuck out the formula and don't bother expressing unless YOU want to.
BFing is one of the few things in this world that isn't about men and it pisses off the feminist in me when women faff about with pumps and bottles so that their partner can experience the bond of feeding. There are plenty of other ways he can bond with the baby but he should back off from any decisions about feeding, because they are not his to make.

I can't tell if he's trying to help or just wanted to feed the baby. The latter I have no time for. I doubt any of these men who think it's unfair they aren't getting feeding time thought it was dreadfully unfair and how could they ever bond with their child when their wife was struggling to bend over or walk with pregnancy and then had to push a baby out. The process of having a baby is not gender neutral.

"I think it is really sad and scary that a doctor who looks after poorly babies isn't educated on what breastfeeding a healthy baby looks like. Surely that's the top outcome everyone on the wards should be working towards?"

This is exactly what I was thinking reading this!

"BFing is one of the few things in this world that isn't about men and it pisses off the feminist in me when women faff about with pumps and bottles so that their partner can experience the bond of feeding. There are plenty of other ways he can bond with the baby but he should back off from any decisions about feeding, because they are not his to make."

And this! I think sometimes in cases like this there is a strong element of "Doctor knows best" and also even "the Man knows best".

I think you need to calm down and cut the man some slack. Unless you're 100% sure you're never going to make a mistake then let it go.

I really feel sorry for some of the DPs on this thread. They should have no involvement in feeding? It's nothing to do with men? wtaf?! Great co parenting there.

OP, yes your DH did something that you had decided against. However, I think you and a few other posters in this thread perhaps need to get a bit of perspective. What he did, he most likely did out of wanting to be helpful, but without thinking beforehand. Very unlikely he did it to be malicious or selfish or 'to have a go at it'. Again, feel sorry for the DPs of those posters.

Glad you've had a reasoned discussion about it. Don't exclude him from feeding and decisions about it though, it'll only end up breeding resentment on both sides.

Coming to this late, glad you seem to have ironed it out. He may also be interested in research showing that after the first few weeks there is no difference in the number of night wakings in babies who are bf, formula fed, on solids or not on solids. None. A bf baby might feed more often than a formula fed one overnight but the number of wakings is, on average, the same. She has just published a book so I'll find the link.

www.pinterandmartin.com/breastfeeding-uncovered.html

How could my DH be involved in feeding...he doesn't have breasts

Are you seriously advocating every baby should have bottles / DPs should do some feeding? Why?

As I said before, if he felt strongly about formula feeding or combi feeding that should have been a discussion before the act. The minute someone goes behind the back of a sleep deprived mum they lose the moral high ground.

Can't believe the 'calm down dear' attitudes on this thread. We are protective of our new babies and want to feel we are parenting as a team, not have a DP unilaterally go against a method previously agreed on.

He's a doctor! He should have the eloquence to argue his case and the foresight to think ahead to feeding decisions - the fact that he acted alone IS a betrayal of trust.

For me it makes it much worse that hes a NICU doctor. The staff at DS's NICU were so incredibly supportive of breastfeeding mothers (except for one cow who didn't like how frequently we were around at night).

The idea that dad's can only bond through the introduction of a bottle is bunk.

You say you want to feel that you are parenting as a team but are so dead against any male involvement in feeding, down to giving EBM. Why are you so against that? Yes t should be about choice to do that but there seems to be a lot of dictating down to men about it in this thread.
Why should men be made to feel like second rate parents just because they lack breasts? Why does what the father of the baby thinks matter less because of this?

I think DP is seeing feeding as his chance to bond. I think the main thing to do here is ensure that DP gets his time to bond with the baby in other ways so that he doesn't use feeding as his way of doing it. Try getting him to read baby books/sing nursery rhymes with him, and he could be in complete charge of bathtime.

Explain to him that you are really upset about what he's done. However I would explain to him that you appreciate he wants to bond with the baby to and that you are not trying to exclude him from that, and suggest that bath time becomes his time with baby. Explain that it means an awful lot to you to be able to breastfeed this time around, and that introducing formula may confuse him as well as mess with your supply, and it causes you a lot of pain if you become engorged. Explain that you would prefer him to share things with you in future and make joint decisions about the children.

I personally would avoid shouting at him, as much as, like another poster said, they'd throttle him and put him under the patio (I'd feel that way too) because I really do think a lot of this lies in him wanting to feel included. But I don't think you can just let this go either, however a calm conversation on how this has made you feel but how you feel you should both go forward would probably be the best approach to ensure it doesn't happen again.

OP you need to co parent and discuss how to fulfill his desire to feed the baby himself perhaps with formula if you can't pump enough

Why on earth would the OP do that?

The baby is not a doll - I'm afraid daddy's "desire to feed" comes way down the priorities at this stage. The baby is settled and breastfeeding is going well - why should OP have to sit by with breasts full of milk in order to enable her dh to put a bottle of formula into their baby?

So depressing to read yet more posts from women who think it's their job to enable the poor men to feel involved, to find books for them to read, to have discussions around their feelings...what bloody century are we in??

Mothers give birth. Mothers have breasts with which to feed babies, if they choose. Mothers are the ones who need (ideally) a bit of support in the weeks following birth. And yet, here we go again - being made to feel that we must find a role for the men or they'll feel pushed out, the poor diddums.

I'm the last person to be insisting on traditional role models; fathers can and should be involved in many different ways - they can change nappies, cuddle, walk with the sling or pram, do the baths - and in a very few months, help with weaning.

I think there's something very undermining about this sort of behaviour. It's almost as though some men can't take a back seat for a little while - for a few short months, during breastfeeding, the mother/baby relationship comes first. Why would men have a problem with that?

basket if he was dead against his wife exclusively breastfeeding it was down to him during pregnancy to thrash that out.

Nothing excuses going behind the back of a woman a few weeks post partum. It's taking advantage of vulnerability to get his way and it stinks.

I'm always suspicious that feeding=bonding to some people because all the other things that babies need: winding, changing, settling etc. is the dull monotonous, relentless bit and best left to mothers. Whereas feeding is the nice, sat on your arse, gooey eyed bit.

At no point did OPs husband think about what was actually good for the baby.