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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Large Families

686 replies

Czerny88 · 10/09/2016 17:56

I'm trying to understand the psychology behind people having large families (by which I mean anything over three children, I guess). NB I'm thinking about people in the 21st century, in the West, with access to contraception and low infant mortality, who don't belong to a culture where it is particularly encouraged to have a large number of children, such as Judaism. And obviously there are circumstances such as multiple births which don't apply.

My visceral feeling is that it is often wrong on many levels. In attempting to enunciate why, I would say people should not have more children than they can afford, than they have time to care for, than can fit comfortably in their living accommodation.

And even in the case where the parents are very wealthy, have a huge house and extra support such as a nanny, there is still the hugely important issue of over-population. It feels like we are at capacity already, without room to increase the population by the amount would result by every couple having even three children.

I'm trying not to be too goady or right-wing, and I have personal reasons for the way I feel (I am involuntarily childless) so please don't be too harsh, but it's something I struggle with ideologically as well as emotionally.

So... AIBU to think that people should be more responsible about how many children they produce and not act solely on their own desires regardless of the potential effects on others? Or is that an unrealistic, draconian expectation?

OP posts:
Mammyofsixgirls · 11/09/2016 11:23

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MuseumOfCurry · 11/09/2016 11:29

It's true that birth rates are way down in the West, but I'll never understand why anyone feels that as a Westerner this makes them more entitled to have a large family than someone in say, India.

The most worrying environmental effects are global rather than local e.g. polar ice sheets melting.

I'm appalled at the people who claim that their large families are OK because they somehow know their children will be high earners. They own the moral low-ground.

4plustort · 11/09/2016 11:32

Can I ask why you are on mums net if you have no children?

MuseumOfCurry · 11/09/2016 11:34

There are lots of people on MN with no children.

Gwenhwyfar · 11/09/2016 11:34

"people aren't nearly so judgemental about people whose kids just happen to be furry."

You think so? I think cat ladies get just as much judgement, partly because the hygiene issues affects the neighbourhood not just the house and ethical considerations.
www.care2.com/greenliving/can-you-have-too-many-cats.html

EllenDegenerate · 11/09/2016 11:34

Au contraire Museum my large family is OK irrespective of the future economic propensity of my offspring.

How very arrogant of you to presume that I would either seek or require your approval.

Bless you.

Waltermittythesequel · 11/09/2016 11:35

The why are you on MN thing is done to death.

There are plenty of reasons for someone to be on here.

I think OP has been a bit of a knob and fully aware of what she was doing, but she has every right to post here same as anyone.

MuseumOfCurry · 11/09/2016 11:36

Ellen, I'm paraphrasing previous posters. Take a look upthread a bit why don't you.

miserablesod · 11/09/2016 11:39

I hate the term 'breed like rabbits'. So vulgar and usually said by jealous bitter people. But it wouldn't be acceptable for us to pin a vulgar label on an infertile woman, which i wouldn't anyway was just making a point. M Again double standards! We are actually humans with feelings too, we don't lose our feelings because we 'popped out' so many kids or 'breed like rabbits'. Angry

Arseicle · 11/09/2016 11:40

"people aren't nearly so judgemental about people whose kids just happen to be furry

I think you have to expect a few raised eyebrows if your children are actually furry. If you are merely anthropomorphising your cats, then you'll get a few eye rolls as well, because they are pets, not children.

Ricschick5 · 11/09/2016 11:43

It seems to me if people were happy in their own lives they wouldn't have time to look and judge other people. It's know ones business how many children people have! As long as there looked after and loved keep ya nose out. Imo
Oh and we have 5 children. Considering no6 😆

EllenDegenerate · 11/09/2016 11:45

Museum I've read the full thread.

I am perplexed that any parent feels that they should justify their family size to other people on an Internet forum, irrespective of the means of supposed justification.

I consider it ludicrous that people appear to require parents to provide them with said justification.

Furthermore I find it ironic that those who imagine that they are entitled to explanation and justification from parents are champing at the bit to label said parents as 'entitled'

SandyY2K · 11/09/2016 11:46

I saw a reality show about a family with 16 children. The children are well behaved and well adjusted. They don't live off benefits and there's a lot of love in that family.

It's their choice. I think it's kinda crazy to be in a constant state of pregnancy and nursing, but they are responsible parents and what they choose doesn't impact anyone outside of their family.

Seeing how calm the parents were in such a chaotic house was amazing.

I really don't consider more than 3 kids a large family though. I'm one of 4 and it doesn't feel like a large, but I guess times have changed.

EllenDegenerate · 11/09/2016 11:48

We are actually humans with feelings too, we don't lose our feelings because we 'popped out' so many kids or 'breed like rabbits'. angry

Less prolific breeders appear to believe that a percentage of our intellect is lost with every placenta we expel.

I must have missed that module of obstetrics training Wink

Gwenhwyfar · 11/09/2016 11:48

Ellen - you're not being told you have to justify yourself. OP was curious about why people have large families. I am too, as are many people because it isn't the norm any more. There have been some good explanations, but many more people just being offended at being asked a question.

Gwenhwyfar · 11/09/2016 11:51

"Can I ask why you are on mums net if you have no children?"

People without children are allowed on Mumsnet 4Plus. In my case I'm here for the interesting discussions. I mainly read threads not about parenting, but will click on some of the parenting ones if they interest me. Sorry, but you can't stop me doing that.

EllenDegenerate · 11/09/2016 11:53

I think that you are confusing curiosity and condemnation.
The OP was quite candid in her disdain for those of us who do not adhere to her prescriptive ideation of acceptable family size.

In any case as I have stated I have much sympathy for the OP as I have previously stated.
My comments regarding justifications and the ironic notion of entitlement on both sides of the debate were in reference to Museums assertion that large families are not 'OK' simply because the children will grow to be net contributors.

Nobody should require her to deem their family size as 'OK' or otherwise.

As I said, I think it is ludicrous.

Arseicle · 11/09/2016 11:55

OP was curious about why people have large families

She wasn't curious, she was judgemental and rude. And many other posters have been more so.

miserablesod · 11/09/2016 12:07

Theres a way to be curious without being rude. Being curious is fine, being rude, judgemental and making nasty comments is not.

EllenDegenerate · 11/09/2016 12:10

OP just posted this here because she felt shit about herself.
She thought that she could deflect those feelings on to those who she perceives to have a surplus of that which she lacks.

She doesn't deserve our contempt, she requires our sympathy.

BuntyFigglesworthSpiffington · 11/09/2016 12:14

I really don't think the OP's posts are as offensive as some people are making out.

onecurrantbun1 · 11/09/2016 12:18

I currently have 3 D.C. and we are considering a fourth in a year or two. We can comfortably afford it and have a large home and garden but it is this question of non-financial resources. I'm not sure whether I could offer each child enough without making personal sacrifices. I guess if I'm thinking that way, and i am nothing special, then most parents have also carefully considered their family size.

The human race is prolific and we will probably lead to lots of problems before we die out, but being very honest my concerns are more about school places and hospital waiting lists which are political points and in desperate need of overhaul anyway. Who knows what the world will look like in 30 years time, never mind several generations?

DelicatePreciousThing1 · 11/09/2016 12:37

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Pisssssedofff · 11/09/2016 12:38

Hospital waiting lists and school places needs resolving full stop. You can't cut off the supply of people needing the services rather than increase the services that's totally back to front.
Equally we need to start actually paying for this stuff. I can't believe the number of pensioners that think the £20 a week they paid for 40 years - rarely uninterrupted- covers 30 years of retirement along with all their health care needs. It's beyond ridiculous

LeaveMyWingsBehindMe · 11/09/2016 12:44

Being curious is fine, being rude, judge mental and making nasty comments is not.

But miserable you've just posted a whole list of all the curious questions you get asked and have taken offence to being asked. So clearly being curious is not fine.