To think home schooling should be better monitored?

[Mollymoo78]

One of my FB friends from my toddler group days has announced on FB that she's home schooling her four year old. She was always very very attached to him and never had a moment away from him ie a night out. She breast fed him well into his fourth year and carried him in a sling when he got tired. I guess what I'm saying is that I'm genuinely wondering if her decision to home school has more to do with her being reluctant to let him go.

Her comments on FB are "well I have no precise plans as to what I'm going to do but they learn through play at this age anyway so it doesn't matter". I just felt quite uncomfortable reading that. It all sounds very vague. My dd has started school recently and loves it - the socialisation with her peers and older children, the physical activity, getting independence and rewards for her achievements. She's playing yes but she's also being taught to read and write. But what if this boy isn't given these things - who is going to be checking up on the education he's being given?

I don't mean to put a downer on homeschooling - I've no doubt it's the perfect option for those whose children don't gel with school but shouldn't you at least try school first? Am I wrong to question this in my mind?

Ofsted at least?

Ofsted are responsible for inspecting schools and other institutions where I might choose to send my child to be educated. They are not responsible for inspecting me. I am not accountable to Ofsted. What constitutes an appropriate education for my child is my decision, and if I think school is the most appropriate route, Ofsted is empowered to make sure that happens to a good standard by inspecting the schools on my behalf.

Yes I do think there should be better monitoring.

I also think there should be an application and testing process for parents that want to HE, to ensure they have the ability etc to do so. And if they are not deemed capable, the request to HE should be refused.

All you see on MN is the golden side of HE - that dc have so much freedom, they control their own learning journey, they go off to Uni and are so well socialised etc etc.

In RL I only know of one person (adult) who was HE and she blames it for almost ruining her life. No abuse - just a lack of opportunities, interaction with peers and 'normal' things most kids do.

Whatever: You think you should have to apply to the Government for the right to decline to put your child's education into the hands of the Government? What a bizarre thought. They're your children. If anything, you should be inspecting the provision provided by them, not the other way round.

So hypothetically Trifle, you believe that you as parent should have complete control over what (or even if) you teach your children?

What if you, or another HE decided that reading was unnecessary...you weren't going to bother teaching them? That should be allowed, as you as parent have decided it? I mean, afterall, how very dare anyone else dictate to you minimum standards to which as an educator you have to adhere to

As a society we have a responsibility to ensure all children have access to education...and no, I don't think that individual parents should be allowed free reign. Because some people are incapable/misguided/abusive/uncaring. And there needs to be minimum standards and controls in place.

I do believe that, up to a point. And I am a teacher. The law says I have to provide my child with 'an education' but rightly gives me a lot of freedom to decide on priorities within that broad definition without reference to what the majority think about those priorities.

However, I do agree that there is a point at which it is reasonable to say that nothing I am doing constitutes 'an education' and therefore a school attendance order can reasonably be issued.

And how would that be picked up, without monitoring of what you're doing?

I have a friend who homeschooled her children through primary. At nine years old the eldest couldn't read or write properly so she sent her to an alternative school. It was super flakey and I was super judgey at the time.

Said child has just completed a-levels and received a clutch of a's and b's including an a* in English. She's off to a Russell Group uni. She's lovely, opinionated and engaged with life - a lot like her mum, in fact.

So it all came out in the wash... I stand corrected on my judgemental attitude.

YABU OP

"In RL I only know of one person (adult) who was HE and she blames it for almost ruining her life. No abuse - just a lack of opportunities, interaction with peers and 'normal' things most kids do."

Same here. She was advanced academically, but behind socially. I do think the social problems were perhaps what led to the home educating rather than what caused it, but it didn't seem to have helped.

I'm quite surprised by the number of people on this thread saying that Home Education is as valid a choice as school as I don't think that's the general opinion among the general public as a whole.

Trifle - you seem to think your child is your possession. He/she is not. You're responsible for their care, but you shouldn't get to decide everything about their upbringing as you live in a society and your child needs to grow up to be a functional member of that society.

A NT nine year old being unable to read would be a massive failing IMO.

The general education of my dc's has expanded so, so much since they were able to read. I don't just mean reading for readings sake, or even just learning through books - but being able to read road signs or the instructions on a board game or the menu in a restaurant unaided - all of which can generate discussion with typical inquisitive young kids.

Oh, and my friend's son who has been in well regulated Ofsted education all his life just got 3 U's in his Alevels.

Monitoring doesn't lead to engagement. It's the big lie education is built on. I'm a teacher btw. Oxbridge educated and apparently 'outstanding' whatever the fuck that bullshit means.

Be careful before you judge and be really wary of believing that the gvt are interested in ensuring excellence in education...

Rubbish. I don't think my child is my possession. But I certainly don't think decisions about their care and education are anyone else's to make, however, including yours. If I decide a particular form of education is most suitable for them, it is my right to offer that form of education before I delegate it to someone else.

And I love teaching but am just saying that education comes in many forms...

The ever-present complaint that 'in many countries children don't start school until 7' - so much of this is semantics. They might not start school - but look at the nursery/kindergarten system in those countries and you'll find it looks VERY much like preschool at 3/4 and reception from age 4/5 etc - just a different name.

My kids are at school. But in the case of DS2 he was wanting (and a personally tailored education would have given him) formal maths education from age 3, and he's wanting to talk about algebra and ideas leading up to calculus at 7.

Essentially there are a few who don't do a good job. Much like there are outliers in all circumstances...a few benefit cheats, a few abusive parents etc etc. To fundamentally alter, and attempt to monitor/formalise home ed to the point that it doesn't suit the majority of those who do it would be hugely unfair. And ridiculous really...by the catastrophising on here you would think hundreds of thousands of kids every year were being failed by He, when in reality it seems to be very few.

There are a lot of kids leaving school illiterate etc.

Whatever: And I don't disagree with you. I just don't think I have the right to impose my opinion worldwide.

If I decide a particular form of education is most suitable for them, it is my right to offer that form of education

And if your 'form of education' doesn't fit with the society we have and into which your dc will need to integrate - fuck it, it's up to you

I hate the 'conformity' line when talking about state education (I know you haven't used that worded but it seems like what you're getting at). Oh no, how terrible for us/our dc to be forced to conform from age 3 by the big bad Government.

Conformity, to an extent, is an essential life skill to enable an adult to be fully functioning in society.

Yes, it is up to me. You make your kids conform if you want. I will decide to what extent I want to make mine conform.

I always feel sick when I see one of these threads pop up. You have a whole bunch of people raising concerns for children whose parents may not have their best interests in mind, and then you have a whole bunch of people who obviously do care very much about their children taking it personally and sort of standing in the way taking offence.

There ARE people using HE as a very convenient shield for abuse. This does not imply anywhere near all or even the majority are, but SOME are, yes.

My father was one of the 'off-grid, don't trust the world' HE'ers, and sought complete control over the whole family (down to making you do 'favours' for food, and controlling the light/heat/water in the house on a reward/punishment basis).

He completely isolated all of us (including my mother who was a teenager when she married him), and spent years physically, emotionally, and sexually abusing us. It only came to an end when one of us nearly died, hospital was the only option, and the whole house of cards came tumbling down.

I was in that house until nearly an adult, and was so frightened of the outside world (believed it to be more dangerous and worse than anything in the home, thanks to my father) that I didn't know there was any chance of outside help.

Some HE children do NOT get any opportunities to socialise - we didn't, it was used deliberately to isolate us as much as possible.

Some HE children do not get to see dentists, doctors, etc - we didn't, many terrible repurcussions from this for many of us.

Some HE children are not being HE at all but are being hidden at home in order to be abused - we were.

I really, really wish that these families could be successfully identified and supported (fucking prosecuted in our case), and that all the loving HE parents doing the best job they can could realise that you are actively standing in the way of families like mine getting help when you react so defensively on behalf of all HE families.

Some HE children DO need rescuing. I wish we had been.

Why is it thought that HEdders are not integrated into society? School is not the hub or gateway to society!

You do realise how unusual that is though Spinning? Home ed wasn't the issue in your family.

Spinning-that is a read terrible situation but you needed rescuing, it wasn't HE that made that the case.

all the loving HE parents doing the best job they can could realise that you are actively standing in the way of families like mine getting help when you react so defensively on behalf of all HE families.

I'm sorry that's simply not true. No one is actively standing in the way of families getting help at all, they're arguing as to why they don't agree that checks are needed. If the government wanted to be checking, they'd be checking and no minority group of home educators would be stopping them.

I'm so sorry for your expediting.

"The ever-present complaint that 'in many countries children don't start school until 7' - so much of this is semantics. They might not start school - but look at the nursery/kindergarten system in those countries and you'll find it looks VERY much like preschool at 3/4 and reception from age 4/5 etc - just a different name. "

Exactly, and I've pointed that out earlier.