To be angry that MIL may have indoctrinated my child?

[FruitCider]

I've been away for just under a week volunteering abroad and got home this morning. My mother in law (reverend) has been to stay with my partner whilst I went away. I'm completely atheist, partner is agnostic. MIL tried to give me a nativity set at Christmas for DD and a book full of bible stories, I declined and said I didn't want my daughter exposed to religion by people with a bias to a particular religion until she was 7/8.

I've come home today and my 3.5yo DD is continuously talking about Jesus, how God made the planet and told me I should thank god that my journey was safe. My partner says MIL had not mentioned religion when he was at home but he had to leave DD with MIL on Tuesday and Thursday whilst he went to work.

I'm absolutely RAGING! AIBU to be this angry? I literally want to banish MIL from my house and tell her she is not allowed contact with my DD for the foreseeable future.

Also is my DD likely to forget about God as she grows up if it's not mentioned again? Or is she now indoctrinated forever?

Sorry to those who may find this post offensive, I just wanted my DD to make her own mind up when she was old enough to understand that religion is a belief and there is no firm evidence for a God. She could have decided herself to be a Christian and I would have accepted that.

Regarding your MIL presenting her beliefs as facts- as a reverend I would expect her to believe that the Bible is factual, that is the very essence of the religion, so there's no way it would ever cross a Christian's mind to say "I believe this..." as to them that would be like saying "I believe the sky is blue" as for Christians the Bible is a book of truth IYSWIM in the same way you believe what you believe.

this is insane. Your DD knows someone who has a strong faith, this is NOT a problem for your average atheist

I guess I'm not an average atheist. I really dislike all organised religion, as a feminist I view religion as a tool to have power and control over women. Having said that, I'm able to converse with others respectfully about their views. What I DO have a problem with is someone teaching my child their views as fact.

I think I'm going to hang on a few days before having discussion/getting DP to have a conversation with MIL to assess exactly what MIL has said to her.

i wouldn't worry, attempted indoctrination can go a bit wrong with children when it's for a short time only, especially at a young age. DD1 went to a church school for a couple of terms, and all she took from the very high church religious education was that if she ever did anything wrong, Jesus made her do it. She got very angry with me when I tried to send her for a time-out as it was Jesus's fault, so he had to have the time out, not her

A term at a secular school and she's taking responsibility for her own actions again.

Regardless or not of whom you arranged to babysit your DD whilst your DH was working, I repeat, as you are so enraged and untrusting of your MIL you won't be leaving her unattended to babysit in the future?

I'm really not sure. We have a lot of problems in our relationship anyway. I lost respect for her after she called me a whore for having her sons child out of wed lock!

Sorry one last thing- it's very offensive for you to dismiss Christmas as a non Christian celebration and attempt to reclaim it as something secular. It is widely accepted that non Christian people celebrate Christmas now, however for you to attempt to dismiss the message and beliefs at the very heart of that is actually abhorrent and I think you should apologise for that.

I really dislike all organised religion, as a feminist I view religion as a tool to have power and control over women

so do I. However it is a FACT (and your average athiest quite likes facts) that the world is populated with many people who firmly believe in their religions.

You're not going to give your kid great tools for navigating the world we actually live in if you want people to hide/dump down the fact that they really really do believe in their religion

however for you to attempt to dismiss the message and beliefs at the very heart of that is actually abhorrent and I think you should apologise for that.

Err.... I said I celebrate the message of doing good deeds for others. I certainly will not be apologising for refusing to celebrate Christianity at Christmas!

Not RTWT (apart from her calling you a whore, that would have been the first and last straw!) but YANBU

My mother is a very committed christian, yet she defends my atheism to her church friends. A couple in particular keep asking when I am getting my youngest three DC baptised as I did my eldest three (I used to have faith and was a member of her church). She says that as I respect her faith then she must respect mine. I know that they dont get that and think that she should try and get me back into the church.

She would never do this and understands that I would be fucking fuming if anyone else did, against my express wishes.

I certainly will not be apologising for refusing to celebrate Christianity at Christmas!

That is NOT what you were asked to apologise for!

Thought there might be a backstory Fruit.

FWIW I'm with you on the feminist issue with religion.

That she called you a whore is a massive drip feed indicative of a lack of resort. Did she also call your son a whore?

Of course she didn't call her son a whore sorry didn't mean to drip feed, maybe I'll edit the op to mention the poor relationship that I've worked hard to rebuild.

I don't understand why you're getting such a hard time. Normally you mention religion on MN and people go nuts especially teaching it in schools.
I'd be miffed too, I don't do religion, my children are withdrawn from collective worship at school and they know that bible stories are just stories and not based in fact.
They have RE lessons as part of the national curriculum but it is very much taught as some people believe this but we do not.

That is NOT what you were asked to apologise for!

I'm also not apologising for refusing to accept modern Christmas as a Christian celebration. One can take the underlying message without turning it into a religious celebration. Christmas has a long history, and was celebrated many years before Christianity existed, albeit under a different name.

I lost respect for her after she called me a whore for having her sons child out of wed lock!

Ahhhhh.
Did she apologise at any point?

I'd be much more upset about that than any talk about Jesus or Creationism (that would get my goat) or Homeopathy (that gets me too).

Hang on, hang on. .. She called you a whore?? Now that's a whole different kettle of fish, and I'm not sure that even the most committed Christians on this thread are going to think that's okay the Bible stories are very clear that Jesus was not in the business of Judging people.

And by the way OP, I don't think you're more athiest than average, I actually think you're less athiest than your average atheist.

The whore comment is a huge drip feed, your MIL does not sound like a nice person, however you do seem to be transfering your feelings towards her onto a disproportionate dislike of Christianity over and above your issues with other religions in general, and if you truely want your DD to have a balanced unbiased view of religion, you'll need to have some self awareness about that

Hmm.

That's fascinating. You either both have to be whores for the unmarried sexy times or neither of you. Or it makes no sense.🤔

OP I couldn't care less if you don't celebrate Christianity at Christmas The offensive part of your post was when you claimed the reason you are happy to celebrate Christmas in your home is because (conveniently) according to you Christmas- you know, the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ- is actually not a Christian celebration anyway and it's something to do with pagans. Very offensive and quite ignorant. Interesting to note that it happens to be Christmas, the most commercial and "fun" of all the Christian celebrations, that you can find justification for. Somehow makes sense you don't believe the pagans had anything to do with lent. Not quite as fun is it?

I'm also not apologising for refusing to accept modern Christmas as a Christian celebration. One can take the underlying message without turning it into a religious celebration. Christmas has a long history, and was celebrated many years before Christianity existed, albeit under a different name.

That's STILL not what you were asked to apologise for

You are so preocupied with your anti christian narative that you haven't noticed that the way you posted about pre-christian christmas traditions was picked up on as offensive and dismissive

OP, I have a friend whose parents had the same "approach" to Christianism you appear to have.
Her parents "anti-" views made her very interested in Christian religions in her teens. By the time she started uni she had been baptised, CoE, and confirmed, and she was a regular churchgoer. She then developed a very relaxed attitude to religion in general and by her mid twenties stopped going to church. However she still defines herself as Christian and nowadays, mid thirties, says she is re-discovering Christianism and is reading Catholic texts (doctrine and philosophy).
I have been raised a Catholic, by devout parents, attended a convent school, and have a very healthy (imo, evidently) approach to all religions and beliefs. Whatever we teach our children, they will decide what they believe in at some point. Keeping them apart of something that is ingrained in Western culture and society is, again, in my humble opinion, not the right answer.

So, if MIL called you a whore, then her son is one too?

Just say that some people believe it, some people believe something else, and that dh doesn't know what to believe and you believe none of it. Say they're nice stories, and there are many other religions which have stories which are just as nice. The people who believe them think they're true but nobody else does.

She'll be exposed to it all through school so you might as well start preparing her now. Don't use mil as a sitter too often,motherwise her beliefs will gain strength in your dd's mind.

Keep telling her stories from other relgions so she can see clearly that there are many different ideas and will understand quite thoroughly the difference between belief and fact. Starting this young will make it easier for her to understand that basic thing.

At this age kids get focused on particular topics - often dinosaurs or Thomas the Tank Engine. So just distract her with a new fad & Jesus will soon be supplanted by My Little Pony or whatever you show her on TV (or her friends at pre-school like). Shielding her from too much TV or Disney shite will leave her more vulnerable to MiL's fantastic stories of all seeing, all knowing deities. Paw Patrol will protect her from this.

The only disadvantage of this approach is that God generally has less expensive plastic tat available for His fans. Your call.

OP to be clear- it is this kind of King which is offensive- "Christmas was celebrated many years before Christianity existed- albeit under a different name"

Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ. Not everyone believes in it etc but it doesn't change what Christmas actually is.

Would you be this obnoxious about other religions, Islam or Hinduism?

Fruitcider, I think there's little point discussing this with your Mil. A more productive way forward could be to introduce your daughter to scientific evidence for theories about the creation of the universe and for evolution - show her the stars and how old they are, look at timeliness, look at rock and fossil evidence. Encourage her to ask questions of adults, including your Mil - you may well find that your daughter picks her own holes in Mil 's assertions. Make sure that your DD understands that it's good to question adults, and that there is no obligation to believe what adults say.