To think that 14 (barely) is too young to stay out all night in Soho?

[overprotective]

DS, 14 at the end of July, wants to stay out all night queuing outside a shop he likes in Soho. In the past he's gotten up really early (5am) and taken the a train into town with friends to queue outside the shop. I'm fine with that but feel that overnight is too much.

He was trying to arrange a whole group of boys. Three are now allowed and plan to take the early train. One has gotten permission and one has been told he can do it but only if DS can do it. Now DS is angry because I'm 'ruining it for everyone' by saying no. I'm a bit cheesed off with the parents who put the responsibility for saying no onto me. Now DS feels responsible for whether that boy can go or not. I've offered to stay in a hotel in Soho and DS can come and sleep there then go back early but I don't think the friend would be allowed under those circumstances and it would be unfair for the one boy with permission to stand there on his own.

My concerns are:

They're very young.
The trains stop running overnight so at one point they would be unable to get home if something went wrong.
They will most likely spend their time playing Pokemon Go so their phones will die at some point overnight. Spoke to DS about this and he swears it wouldn't happen but I've heard that before.
They could be in a situation that they are too young to handle.
The nature of Soho overnight with it's bars, strip joints, etc.

I feel quite strongly that it's not appropriate but I'm feeling guilty right now and feeling the pressure. DH is no help. He's away on a business trip and I think he would be OK with it as he finds it hard to say no to the children. I'm always the bad cop. Usually that's fine but I hate that everyone (including the other parents) have shifted the responsibility onto me for this.

Help me mumsnetters! AIBU?

I would have the horrors being in soho in the early hours, there are some really nasty little streets if you wander off the main drag

Yes, it's Supreme that they would be queuing for.

Thanks so much for the support. I said that in a year or two then they could do this kind of thing but he's just too young now. Barely 14 and, though reasonably mature, just not ready for this kind of responsibility.

Bloodyteenagers, I'll look into the curfew. If it's 'the law' and not just me maybe that will make a difference to the daily drama I'm getting at the moment.

I didn't know about the curfew, but there's his excuse to save face!

Humm I don't have kids this age but tbh, I don't really see the problem with this from a personal safety perspective. I don't see that it would be dangerous if they're in a group, and in somewhere so central as Soho. The sex shop/gay bar worry is a bit of a red herring - they're not going to be let in anywhere anyway. The danger of being out at night is to be somewhere deserted imo, but Soho won't be, and there'll be a police presence in the neighbourhood as well.

My objections would be over-tiredness in staying up all night, and also the fact that they're going to get bored doing so and will probably feel like jacking it in at 3am. Also it seems a bit stupid to queue up all night for clothes.

But safety-wise, if you feel you can trust them not to let their phones die (which I guess you can't maybe!), I think it's ok.

No. I've lived in London for a long time and feel quite safe walking around Soho most of the time, but still no for a 14yr old. Just in case they are approached by a dodgy person who seems trustworthy to them. They don't need to do this, although I'm sure it sounds like an exciting adventure to them. They'd probably get fed up half way through the night and wish they had a nice hotel room to go back to. I used to be glad that my parents wouldn't let me stay out all night, as it was an excuse to get back to my own comfy bed. They can build up slowly to this kind of thing, and do it when they're a bit more worldly wise maybe. But no.

If they're part of a large queue of teenagers who will be there overnight, it's a rather different picture from the three of them being there on their own. However, it's an awfully long time to be there and I suspect in the nature of things some of them will be wandering off at various points to find food or loos etc, so I don't think I would want to take the risk.

Great news about the curfew. But I'd still make it clear it would have been a no anyway.

You can buy chargers to charge your phone away from home.

Having said that there is no way on this earth I would've let my children do that. It's ridiculous anyway - what's the point in queuing all night when you could go in on an early train and buy them then? I'd be tempted to quote my granny, Nobody's going to be looking at you anyway.

No. And what a sad sack thing to do! Time he learnt that brands are for sheep.

There isn't a curfew. Technically groups of 2 or more people (16 and under) can be broken up and/or that the members of the group have to leave the designated area (if they do not live there). Crucially, police do not have to see actual anti-social behaviour, but a constable in uniform has reasonable grounds for believing that the presence or behaviour of a group of two or more persons in any public place in the relevant locality has resulted, or is likely to result, in any members of the public being intimidated, harassed, alarmed or distressed...

Sorry if this is a stupid Q, but do you know what the main appeal of this plan is? The staying out all night? Or being the first to get the clothes?

I don't know London so I can't advise on safety concerns but it's struck me that your DS could have the opportunity to really think carefully about how much he wants the clothes - I don't know how much they cost or the extent of the kudos - but if you were to offer to give him the money to be spent on something else would he be interested?

I can appreciate the fun of being part of a whole group staying up all night queueing for something, and the fact that it's something that most adults would consider pointless and sheeplike is neither here nor there. And I always feel pretty safe in the very centre of London late at night.

HOWEVER: speaking as the parent of a nearly 14 year old, just turned 14 is simply too young for this plan.

Nope he's still a little nipper and in no way big enough to be doing this. And all for clothes?

What privateidaho said, although it'd be better if they could go there first thing instead of camping overnight.

I'd say no (but my two would be too scared to go out all night in Soho. They don't even go there by day alone unless I sit in a nearby cafe)
You've offered lots of options, including staying at a nearby hotel. If none of them suit, then he'll have to lose face. Better that than being alone on a street at 3 am facing druggies and alcoholic blokes spoiling for a fight.

Sleep over in one of your gardens and then an early train to the shop seems a better idea.

Is this Bape?

Anyway - I wouldn't agree to this. I worked and partied in Soho for years and it becomes seriously unsavoury after hours!

Absolutely no chance would be my answer if DS asked me to do that at 14 just not appropriate without an adult imo.

At nearly 14 I wanted to go queue overnight for tickets in Finsbury Park. Mum said no ......either she came too (but promised not to do anything uncool) or I didn't go at all. She was the cool mum with a bagful of snacks and some kids thought it was great she even knew about cool stuff like queuing overnight. She basically only spoke when spoken to at first but by the end of the night was one of the gang along with a few other Mums.

I'd offer him cool Mum in the queue or nothing. His choice.

I'd say they can do it if you go too and that is the only choice. It may not be cool but it's appropriate at their age.
It makes you a cool mum though!

He wants to sit in a soho street all night at 14? Not likely.

You have been amazingly accomodating in your offers. I wonder what the other parents would have done had you said yes.

No from me too. You have presented several solutions to enable either overnight queuing (you joining them) or queuing very early in the morning and those have all been rejected. I think you have gone above and beyond in trying to accommodate this, and your DS is being U.

I do think this "fan group" type gathering is very different to three kids alone however. The police are usually very good at keeping an eye on them too.

I'd probably book myself a hotel within walking distance of the store , and wander down regularly through the night to keep a discreet eye on them without wrecking their cred. I suspect when turning up with a bag a maccyds I wouldn't be unwelcome however 😀

Definitely no! I have a liberal approach with my (generally sensible) 16 yr old & would let her go.
At that age he doesn't have the life experience to a) understand the risks b) deal with any unpleasant happenings. Time to say I am your parent, I have far more knowledge of the world than you and I say no!