Play scheme worker forced DS into her car

[Longlost10]

My 8 yo DS is in a holiday playscheme, there are two workers there I know. I employ the first one to drive DS home for me at the end of the day. The second one is her boss.

Two days ago, the first one was called away by a family emergency, and unable to drive DS home. The second one made him get into her car against his will, and she drove him home.

I rang her up that night, very very angry. I have taught DS never to get into anyone's car without my express permission, even if he knows them. He was very distressed, and said he had tried to resist and argue, but she had irresistibly over ruled him and forced him in.

When I spoke to the second worker on Friday, she got very offended, and said she thought she was doing a favour for a friend. I am however going to make a formal complaint. She probably was a friend, of sorts, we have been using that play scheme for years,and got to know each other well.

Even so, AIBU to think she should have rung me, and given me the option of leaving work early as a one off emergency, or giving DS permission to get in her car

[Sunshineonacloudyday]

WOW her child should go with an adult in the event of an emergency. That was not an emergency the mother should have been called. The adult shouted at the child that is abuse and she had no right driving him home. She shouldn't work with children if that is her behaviour.

[catkind]

Boney, you said "once again" that it was nothing to do with the play scheme. I along with other posters had already explained why it was, because there will have been a collection policy that will have been breached. Which part are you agreeing to disagree about? that there would be a policy? We know there was, because OP said her son wasn't allowed to just get the bus home.

[AppOrNoApp]

I wouldn't be annoyed as much by the offer of a lift, as the way the lift was imposed offered. The poor lad must've been very intimidated, he's only 8 and she's an adult figure of authority shouting at him.

I can't understand why she would be comfortable intimidating him like that, rather than seeking to comfort him by calling his Mum to seek clarification as to whether it's ok to get in the car or not.

You're not being OTT by teaching your son stranger danger, you're being a responsible parent.

[Marysunshine]

Emrel has got it right. Thank you is what needs saying to someone whose actions were intended to be helpful.
When u leave your child in a responsible, accredited adults care ( as you will when the go to school), you are delegating parental responsibility to them for that time. You need to trust them to ask in the child's best interest. Do they have to call you every time they want to stick a plaster on a scratch, dry their tears, tell them off or give them a hug when they are sad. What if you child needed to be taken to A&E or a trip out when the 'designated person' was away from work?
We need to teach our children to be safe..........but we need to teach them to follow the instructions of trusted adults too, so that means widening the 'options' available.
As for all the shouting/ pushing etc...........I'd check it out properly before kicking off.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

catkind

And I along with others have explained why its not.

[catkind]

Why it's not playscheme's responsibility to follow their own collection policy? I haven't seen anyone attempt to explain that one. You think a collection policy would allow a CM to delegate to a friend without the parent okaying it? I've never seen one that does. You can disagree about that if you like.

[PlotterOfPlots]

Really puzzled by how anyone can read catkind and Thunder's posts and disagree. The arguments seem very clear to me. Whereas I can't begin to follow an argument such as these Boney:
"
That the childminder decided to make other arrangements (yes it is an assumption) with a friend, is nothing to do with the play-scheme.

that the two workers work at the play-scheme and arranged something outside of the play-schemes hours, is nothing to do with the play-scheme."

The playscheme's final responsibility of the day is to hand the child over to the adult designated by the parent. The parent will have filled in paperwork specifying who's allowed to collect. The CM's playscheme boss was not on the list, and the playscheme's rules specifically forbid children to leave unaccompanied, therefore the playscheme has failed to perform its last duty of the day.

Imagine that instead of her boss, the CM asked a random friend Pam to collect. Pam has never met the child. Boney, are you seriously telling me that the playscheme would have no culpability for releasing the child into Pam's care, without the parent's knowledge? And any complaint would be met with "not our problem, it was CM's fault we released the child to a stranger. We did nothing wrong". Obviously the risks to the child were much much lower with the boss, but it doesn't change the basic fact - and it is fact, not opinion - that the playscheme had responsibility to discharge the child to the adult specified by the parent. Until they have done that, they remain responsible for the child. Their responsibility does not end at 6pm or when the boss - or Pam- takes the child off the premises.

[Thunderbumsmum]

catkind of course you are completely right, some people are just fucking dumb.

[Loopy5000]

'a distressed child to make them get into their car.'
they might at the end of a stressful day , when they just wanna get home and have now got to drop off a kid who is not their resposibility.YABU

[43percentburnt]

The nursery will have a collection policy this should have been followed. In childcare and other professions you cannot choose to ignore the written policies! If they pick and choose when and what policies they follow then what else is going on?

[CherryPicking]

She should have called you and got you to reassure him it was OK.

[BoGrainger]

At school if a CM said to us in the morning that a child would be picked up by someone else at the end of the day we wouldn't check with the parent if we knew the who the picker-upper was. If, at the end of the day, we realised that the child was unaware of the arrangement and started making a fuss and refusing to go then we would unpick why, resulting in a phone call to the parents/contacts if necessary.
In this case of course the boundaries are blurred.

[CarefullyAirbrushedPotato]

YANBU aside from the manners part (why people think they can treat children worse than their dogs is beyond me), there's the safeguarding issue. Your son was of course quite right not to want to go with somebody without knowing in advance that you've arranged it, which of course you didn't!
I'd be very surprised if bullying a child into your car without parental permission to drive them somewhere wasn't a sackable offense, if it were me I'd be awaiting my disciplinary.

I'm surprised at all the posters accusing your son of making "a big fat fuss", it's not a secret that our children are more likely to come to harm at the hands of someone known to them! It's pretty basic personal safety rules, nobody remember Charlie Says? Obviously not the playworker manager, I'm surprised she didn't offer him a look at some kittens FFS

[CharlotteTurc]

I expect someone has already said this but I was a play leader and unless the law has changed in the last couple of years it is illegal for a play leader to let a child be taken home by anyone other than a parent or someone the parent has designated to do this - in an emergency that can be by phone but normally it should be in writing. I was taught that the legal procedure if a child is left at the end of the session is to contact the parents and stay with the child (at least two adults must stay) at the play centre until a parent or someone a parent has appointed comes. If the parents cannot be contacted, cannot come and cannot appoint someone else then the proper procedure is to call the police who will inform social services and the child is taken temporarily into care. This happened on one occasion when I was running a play scheme. As a result of a series of mishaps and accidents to the parents (Mum's car broke down miles up the motorway, Dad was away at work, Gran had taken youngest child to hospital etc) I was left with a child and could not get to the parents nor could i get their permission to hand their son to someone else. I therefore contacted the police who came. He was taken to a local approved foster home. The parents were able to sort the situation out and collected their son that evening.

[HSMMaCM]

The fact that the CM works at the play scheme is almost irrelevent, as her CM contract is to take the child from play scheme to home. The CM should have let the parents know she was unable to do that job.

Once the play scheme knew that the child did not have a lift home, they should have contacted the parents. It seems that they knew this early in the day, so could easily have contacted then. Otherwise, at the end of the day, the uncollected child policy should have come into place. I'd be very surprised if this policy was that a member of staff should force a child into their car and take them home without contacting parents.

I also taught my DD not to get into cars with anyone and we had discussions about her very best friends father offering her a lift home from school (he always collected his daughter) and that she was to say no, until she had spoken to me. He (of course) was a lovely guy, who would have no problem getting me on the phone to confirm.

So 2 faults -

1. the CM did not contact you
   
2. the play scheme did not operate their policies

[CharlotteTurc]

Addition to my last post
And of course unless the parent has specifically agreed for a play leader to take a child home it ts illegal for them to do so.

[CuboidalSlipshoddy]

And of course unless the parent has specifically agreed for a play leader to take a child home it ts illegal for them to do so.

Under what legislation? I mean, if it's "of course" you'll be able to tell us the offence and its definition, yes? Illegal means "if this happens, you have committed an offence". What offence?

[Dutchcourage]

'Cutting your nose off to spite your face' springs to mind.

YABU about the whole issue

[losmn]

Here's the legal stuff : your playscheme agreement cannot be changed without permission and agreement with all the persons who signed the said agreement I.e the person(s) with parental responsibility and the proprietor of the playscheme.
It is a legal document and is in place to protect the proprietor, the parent and most importantly the child.
If child has not been picked up from the setting, generally what happens is a member of staff stays put until somebody known/agreed turns up, unless otherwise stated in agreement.
Yes, it's a pain as we have lives too , but the way settings get round this is to levy a fee. A proprietor making a sole decision regarding the child without contacting the parent/police/social services ( yep ) is not complying with the rules and regulations.

In the real world, I would still call my best friend to inform them that I am bringing her/his DS/DD home, even from a party, just out of courtesy. To not inform a parent of changes at a registered setting, sadly, is not right.
Longlost10, YANBU, to expect to be informed of plans made, albeit unexpectedly, regarding your child.

My opinion : is it really too much for the proprietor to call the parent? We do it all the time where I work.

However a meeting with staff in question to iron things out would be my advice, as a first step. However you may now need to look for someone else to pick up DS and/or new playscheme but as we know nobody/nothing is irreplaceable.
Good luck.

[millimat]

Notice that OP had disappeared from this- probably due to the harsh comments from some people!

[Emmaroos]

YANBU to be upset, but YABU to not appreciate that if you have taught your son this absolute rule then you have a responsibility to explain this to anyone who is charged with transporting him. The woman who usually does it would have no reason to think there would be a problem if another staff member, who you know and trust to look after your son at the camp, brought him home instead. The worker you employ thought she was doing you a favour by sorting an alternative arrangement for you knowing you were at work and she had no reason to think there would be a problem to know there was a problem. But yes, even if she sorted out an alternative she should have called you to let you know. She's being paid to do a particular job and not letting you know was poor.
The other worker was trying to do her/you a favour but in that situation, if your son was obviously distressed, she should have listened to him enough to realise that a quick call to you would have sorted the situation without distress.
I think your tack should be first and foremost appreciation that they tried to help, but feedback that in this day and age a child may be taught they need express permission from a parent before they get in a car, and that a phone call to the parent is necessary in that situation.
Making the phone call in anger was not a wise move and you probably never acknowledged your own part in the fiasco which isn't fair.
Tell your son he did his best and you are very proud of him for trying and that it was your and his teacher's fault for the muddle in communication. He'll learn that it's not a perfect world, that people make mistakes and then improve and learn from them. You'll tell him that next time he is getting a lift the person will know he is only allowed to go with the designated person and on his part hell know that if a similar situation ever arises he should ask them to phone you.

[happymamanSO22]

YANBU.

basic common sense for childcare professionals to ring parents in case of change of circumstances and watchkeeper, no matter what.
I would have been upset too.
it is unfair for the child to get such pressure, even though she was obviously trying to help, and even though he was not making this easy.
Honestly, she should have realised something was not right here.

a formal complaint , maybe not. it is not a child abduction !

[Sunshineonacloudyday]

The worker would not get extra training if the OP doesn't complain. They probably don't risk asses properly. Would any of you leave children with this brilliant play scheme establishment.

[Sunshineonacloudyday]

I'm guessing they don't do health and safety checks as well.

[Longlost10]

I haven't gone anywhere, I've just had a hectic few days. Thank you all for your comments. i'm not upset by harsh comments, I'm interested in different opinions. After reading the first few pages here, I had decided not to complain, but since then some more details came to light and somebody else informed the manager of the company.

One new detail was that my son was the last one left, and the playscheme then closed 20 mins early. I didn't know that before, I just thought they had got home unusually quickly. The other detail was that the altercation in the street was seen by a senior member of the primary school staff. The school rents out its hall to the play scheme..

I have had an apology from the person who owns/runs the company the playscheme belongs to, and the second worker is not there at the moment. She hasn't been there since Monday. I don't know if she will go back I've been offered a place at another playscheme run by the same company, but we are not using it, we have sorted out a hotch potch of days with friends, or doing holiday activities at the sports centre, until we go away camping, then after that I'm not sure yet.

Thanks again for everyone's input.