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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

That teachers do NOT always get it right.

178 replies

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 09:15

  1. This is not teacher bashing. Teacher bashing would be criticising people just because they are teachers.
  1. I am a teacher. I know children misunderstand things, a lot. I know what can sound awful was actually nothing after establishing the facts. I would never recommend a parent goes in 'guns blazing.'
  1. I know teachers work hard. I know it can be thankless task, knackering, the odd mistake can be forgiven and indeed expected and so on and so forth.

Now to the crux.

Whenever someone complains about a teacher on here there are so many replies that assume the parent is unreasonable, that assume the teacher is right (because they are a teacher) and it's getting to the stage where I know opening a thread where someone asks about a teacher (which will happen a lot as so many have school age children) will have numerous pages insisting that whatever they are concerned about either didn't happen at all or that if it did, it's fine and excused on the basis teachers work hard.

No.

Teachers lie. I had a teacher tell a lie about me that could have been very serious indeed. Luckily, enough students were brave enough (and it was brave of them) to be truthful. The teacher in question was their head of year and it was a horribly awkward situation. I have known numerous Headteachers and senior teachers lie. They started their careers as ordinary classroom teachers. Do not kid yourselves teachers won't lie. They might lie out of awkwardness, out of anxiety, out of misplaced loyalty or just to be spiteful.

Teachers do sometimes take against a particular child. I haven't seen this happen a lot - only a handful of times - but it does happen. Again I am NOT saying if you think this is the case to go in 'guns blazing.' I am saying that while it's rare and probably is not the case, it is nonetheless a possibility.

Teachers don't know everything, that should be obvious. However, if you have real concerns about the education your child is getting, it does not stand that because the teacher has a degree and a teaching qualification that they know everything. I nearly missed out on my university place due to not being taught a vital part of the curriculum on one of my A levels. I am sure the teacher did not mean this to happen, I am sure they felt really bad about it. But still, if the university hadn't let me in anyway, that would have altered the course of my life. It certainly affected some other students in the class. It is acceptable to ask questions, to ask on here first and then raise concerns with the teacher. It is not acceptable for a load of ITS A TEACHER DON'T BE DAFT NOW RUN ALONG.

Teachers sometimes make a bad judgement. Nine times out of ten it's probably just a normal human error and I'd say let it go. If it's upsetting your child - raise it. A good teacher won't mind talking to you and sorting out whatever the issue is.

It's the end of term. Teachers for the most part do a brilliant job, but amongst them as well as the kind, intelligent, supportive and enthusiastic are the sinister, cruel, lying, bullying and incompetent. Rare? Yes. Never heard of? No.

Mumsnet is a great resource for sharing ideas about children's education and I think parents should be able to enquire about it without angry teachers slating them for having the gall to ask.

OP posts:
NotYoda · 19/07/2016 17:58

What you say is obvious

I think it's only reasonable to comment on particular issues on particular thread

I think starting a thread about it is a bit teacher-bashy because you are stating the obvious

ppeatfruit · 19/07/2016 17:59

The other problem on a lot of threads is the assumption that a child was lying. That happens a lot. That annoys me, aren't we supposed to be 'listening' to children nowadays after the terrible abuse cases?

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 17:59

But Evil, overwhelmingly, that IS what happens. Posters are advised by the sensible posters to talk to the teacher and take it from there. However, there is a side helping of chest-beating theatrics insisting that the teacher did NOT do/say THAT, the child is WRONG and to question the teacher will result in a nervous breakdown and possibly leaving the profession.

Bonkers.

OP posts:
NotYoda · 19/07/2016 18:01

Also, on page you made a characterisation of about what people say, in capital letter, which is an overly dramatic way of raising the issue.

NotYoda · 19/07/2016 18:02

You are the one who is chest-beating, imo

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 18:02
Wink
That teachers do NOT always get it right.
OP posts:
NotYoda · 19/07/2016 18:04

On page 2, you suggested a poster didn't bother posting if she didn't agree with you. That's not reasoned discussion

EvilTwins · 19/07/2016 18:05

callherwillow OK, great.

Not sure what you are trying to achieve here. Perhaps take a bit of your own advice and accept that different people have different views, and that personal views colour our opinions.

JudyCoolibar · 19/07/2016 18:05

Maybe rather than asking on a parenting forum, they should ask the teacher. Just a thought.

But how does it hurt to ask on a forum? Sometimes it may end up being helpful to the school if the MN consensus is that there are no grounds for complaint. Plus there are some very knowledgeable people round here who may be able to offer helpful advice, e.g. to check school policies. consider whether there is a disability discrimination issue, look at government guidance etc.

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 18:05

Not at all. I suggested since she felt the thread didn't achieve anything, posting on it wouldn't be beneficial to her :)

OP posts:
callherwillow · 19/07/2016 18:06

I think it's pretty obvious what I'm trying to achieve to be honest! I'm trying to achieve a bit of balance and point out that it's perfectly acceptable to question teachers and it's perfectly acceptable to question whether you should question teachers on MN!

OP posts:
Pearlman · 19/07/2016 18:07

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NotYoda · 19/07/2016 18:09

callher

Yes, and you've done that. And the water thread had lots of people who agreed with you. Lots of people who didn't say that the child was a little shit. But you quote those few, not all the others

There is no MN consensus. MN is huge. If you disagree, go onto that thread and state your point

And I see through your PA smiley

TheRealAdaLovelace · 19/07/2016 18:09

" 99.9999% of the time its excessive parental fussing.

0.0001% of the time its a genuine mistake. "

sorry I cannot agree with that. The thing that bothers me is that many people seem to think that 'the teacher is always right' when the reality is that teachers are simply humans who may have a not very good degree, and have done a training course. This does not make them infallible super-people or amazing 'professionals'.

In my children's junior school years many teachers have lied or been unpleasant, with one of them actively encouraging bullying behaviour.

Some secondary teachers did not behave much better.

Let's listen to children instead of rubbishing any comment about bad teacher behaviour.

JudyCoolibar · 19/07/2016 18:09

On page 2, you suggested a poster didn't bother posting if she didn't agree with you. That's not reasoned discussion

No, misrepresenting what a poster says is not reasoned discussion. OP suggested to a poster who said the thread couldn't achieve anything that she shouldn't bother posting if that was what she believed - that's a different thing entirely.

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 18:11

It's not PA, Yoda, I can promise you! Have a Wine and chill ...

OP posts:
Pearlman · 19/07/2016 18:11

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NotYoda · 19/07/2016 18:12
Grin

Aaaah ya got me! You clever minx.

I will go and do just that Smile

RaskolnikovsGarret · 19/07/2016 18:13

The default option seems to be to disbelieve the child. Why? I know for a fact my DDs wouldn't lie about a school incident, as they take school
seriously.

I have never complained about a teacher. I feel I should have done on three or four occasions, but actually I, and many others, are quite scared of complaining. We are concerned we won't be believed, and also maybe what the consequences will be for our children if we are not.

And teachers are wrong sometimes. There is no 'poor teacher's' side when the teacher arrives late to a lesson with no explanation and proceeds to play a game on his laptop, telling the children to get on with their (non existent) work, if all the children report the same thing. But on MN, some teachers would still find an excuse for this behaviour.

I have actively praised good teachers but never publicly criticised bad ones. Complaining is not something many parents take lightly.

As in all jobs, there are good and bad teachers. It just astounds me that the default position on here is not to believe the parent/child. I cannot understand it.

That poor boy should have been given his water straightaway, why the need to work out the apparent full story behind it?

YANBU.

Pearlman · 19/07/2016 18:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

OurBlanche · 19/07/2016 18:18

So... there are good and bad teachers... but all children should be believed...

Okay! Sounds good to me!

EvilTwins · 19/07/2016 18:22

I give up. That poor boy?? His mother is refusing to tell anyone what happened when she went to school. If the "poor boy" was telling the whole truth, why would she need to keep it a secret?

Children lie. Everyone lies. Assuming that one type of person has the monopoly on the truth is ludicrous.

callherwillow · 19/07/2016 18:26

Believed, or listened to?

Let's not rehash the water argument. You could substitute that for any number of threads over the years.

OP posts:
jellyfrizz · 19/07/2016 18:30

Trouble is OP, just like teachers and parents some MN posters are reasonable, some are not. So even if most people agree that no one is perfect or whatever the point is there'll be some fucker who will disagree.

smallfox2002 · 19/07/2016 18:32

But you could also subsititute the water thread with many others over the years, some that outline serious concerns, some that talk about being furious about some quite petty things.

Children should always be listened to, but getting both sides of it is imperative as the water lady was instructed before she got angry, she did after all ask if she was being unreasonable.

Teachers do get it wrong of course, but as previously stated there is as much denigration of teachers on here as there is "teachers can do no wrong".