"Rape...is not caused by rapists" WTF!?!

[Unacceptable]

If you aren't aware of the rapist Brock Turner and the campaigners who think he's getting a hard time, have a read of this guardian link.

AIBU to think that the statement from Leslie Rassmussen decrying political correctness that harms poor boys like Brock is the dumbest piece of shit I've ever read?

Even in their drunkest, most ridiculous states my Husband, Brothers and adult sons would not rape a woman because, and I'm sure Leslie wouldn't want to entertain this notion, they wouldn't rape somebody because they aren't rapists!!!!

Brock clearly is.
Having sex without consent is rape.
Forcing yourself upon an unconscious person is rape.

You don't have to be a stranger in a dark alley to do that, just your normal, average, everyday twat.

I know it is hard to accept the wrongdoings of a loved one.
I know we'd all fight to protect those we care about but you can still fucking accept the mistakes that people make...even if you can't get your head around it, don't bury your head in the sand and pretend it's less of an abuse because 'he's a nice guy'.
When will people wake the fuck up?

Link: gu.com/p/4kk46/stw

[ThumbWitchesAbroad]

Rasmussen's "defence" of Turner is the most moronic piece of crap I've read around this case. She's either fucking delusional or has been paid wads to write that utter pigshit. She's done herself no good whatsoever by being a rape apologist.

Sex with someone without their consent is rape - legally so. There are no shades of grey. The graduate was sexually assaulted and if the Swedes hadn't come by when they did would probably have been raped - as it was, she was bruised and grazed in many places. I'm thoroughly sickened by all the "defending" of this sorry excuse for a man, and why in hell his position as an "athlete" should make any difference whatsoever makes no sense to me. In fact, they seem to be the very ones who think they can get away with these actions!

Time to call a halt to that idea.

[DoinItFine]

I kind of hate the "rape is caused by rapists" thing.

I mean, it can be powerful in pointing out that there is no excuse for rape and that if you do one you are a rapist.

But it can also lead to a lot of problematic ideas

eg "I am not rapist, therefore what just happened with my girlfriend can't have been rape."

I actually think that boys like Brock Turner believe that rape is caused by rapists, but they don't see themselves as peolle who could ever be part of that group.

Brock Turner didn't rape her "because he was a rapist", he raped her because he wanted to and because he thought he could get away with it.

Because he somehow (like so many rapists) believed that what he was doing was not rape. And he still appears to believe that.

[Zaurak]

I remember being at uni and being utterly bladdered with friends and doing some really, really dumb shit. Deciding to swim the lake for example. One friend decided to climb a construction crane. Really stupid stuff. Vomiting copiously in public (sorry, sorry..I was young and stupid and away from home for the first time...)

And yet, not of my male friends ever managed to accidentally drunkenly rape someone. Because while they were young, foolish and had alcohol induced feelings of immortality, they weren't rapists. I used to go rock climbing a lot - this was always trips where we stayed in barns/friends floors and we often had a few too many and ended up all in our sleeping bags on people's floors. None of my friends ever took advantage. Because they're not rapists.

The judge in this case needs to be removed from the courts for good. Turners father needs to have a long hard look in the mirror. The only positive thing coming out of this is the widespread public outrage.

And as for the 'was asking for it/drunk' angle. Turner had had a few, yes? So he was out, drunk. Does he expect to be told to not have drink in case someone rapes him? No. No he does not.

He's a rapist. His father has utterly dire attitudes towards women. The young woman in question is extremely courageous.

I am septa unella, standing behind turner for the rest of his fucking life, intoning 'shame!' In public. he needs to go to jail. Real jail, not county jail.

[GabsAlot]

it the dads statement that annoyed me the sheer entitlement of his precious sons life whose ruiened over 20 mins of aciton as he calls it

if he were my son id disown him but hes an enabler-throw the pair of them in jail

[LordoftheTits]

women are blamed for being raped if they've been drinking but if a man rapes, it's not his fault, he was drunk and he didn't know what he was doing.

This. This. This.

[LaBelleOtero]

I read about this. I read his fathers statement and his female friends statement (you can't be a rapist if a female vouches for you!) No wonder if he thinks he can do what he likes when the people who surround him tell he's entitled to. Because he's a good swimmer.

Actually I read that Brock intends to start up a program lecturing college students about the dangers of binge drinking - so that those little drink hussies out there don't continue to ruin innocent young men's lives...(Second part of that sentence is mine if you weren't sure.)

The two male witnesses who stopped him (and thank god for them because I don't think he would have been convicted otherwise, the judge must have resented having to convict, hence the three six month sentence) said she was completely unconscious. So as far as I'm concerned alcohol had nothing to do with it from her side. She could have fallen and hit her head for all he knew. He just saw a collapsed young woman and attacked her.

[LittleLionMansMummy]

Yes yes yes. A friend shared this on Facebook yesterday which illustrates it quite nicely I think.

[Thelittleredhead]

Snorepatrol while I agree that this man deserves nothing but misery, wishing rape on ANYONE, regardless of what they've done, is, in my opinion, abhorrent. I've seen this a lot - 'hope he gets his "20 minutes of action"'..."hope his father passes out drunk and gets ass raped for 20 minutes to see how he likes it", and it really sickens me.

Rape is such an emotive topic exactly because it's such a despicable, unforgivable act of violence which NO human should ever inflict upon another. If we are to retain this idea in a civilised society, we do ourselves a great disservice by wishing it upon those we determine to be 'deserving' of it.

But then, I'm very opposed to the idea of an 'eye for an eye' so that's just me I guess.

You're absolutely right re the photos though - completely bloody disgusting and obvious manipulation of public opinion.

[VestalVirgin]

eg "I am not rapist, therefore what just happened with my girlfriend can't have been rape."

True, but you can't phrase it in any way that will not make rapists come up with excuses.

There was this study where they found that out of around 90 male university students, 30% would rape if they had no consequences to fear. 30% that would "have sex without consent" or somesuch phrasing. When they wrote "rape", only 10% admitted they wanted to do it, or had done it.
So, a whopping 30% of rapists. Two thirds of whom managed to convince themselves that rape, if no one calls it rape, is then somehow not rape.

You can't beat that kind of self-delusion. They'll bent themselves into pretzels trying to argue that they aren't rapists, regardless of how you phrase it.

If you replace "rape" with "nonconsensual sex" then I bet with you, within a couple of years, rapists will claim that what they did cannot be called "nonconsensual sex", because [insert idiotic pseudo-reason].

[StarlingMurmuration]

This whole case has made me almost foam at the mouth in rage. The survivor's statement actually made me cry, it was one of the best pieces of writing I've read for a long time. That little shit should be banged up for a long time.

And the men who saved her and caught him deserve a medal.

[LizKeen]

The victim's statement was amazing. I was sobbing by the end.

The Judge should not be able to continue as a judge IMO. If the defendant before him had been black, or even white and poor, the sentence would have been much much longer.

I am actually not sure how the Judge could have sat in court while the victim read her statement and felt OK about the sentence he had passed. (IIUC she read it to the court after sentencing.)

[DoinItFine]

True, but you can't phrase it in any way that will not make rapists come up with excuses.

No, but the excuse is just too handy here.

I bet a lot of them men hoping Brock Turner gets raped in prison are rapists themselves.

Anything that pretends that men neatly and clearly divide into rapists and non-rapists is part of rape culture.

We need to crystal clear that if yiu are having sex without enthusiastic consent, then yiu need to remember that you could well be a rapist.

Rape is not caused by an evil coterie of men whose aim in life is to go around raping.

It's doing the rape that makes you a rapist. It's not predetermined. But the "rape caused by rapists" thing can be read that way.

[VestalVirgin]

There are no shades of grey. The graduate was sexually assaulted and if the Swedes hadn't come by when they did would probably have been raped - as it was, she was bruised and grazed in many places.

So the witnesses are Swedes?
Perhaps a coincidence, but it seems relevant, considering that Sweden has occasionally shown somewhat more consciousness of the fact that women are people, than the US has.

[littlemonkey5]

This screams of the song 'Dirty Cash'

I've no excuse
I just want you to use me
(Use me)
Take me and abuse me
I got no taboos
I'll make a trade with you
(With you)
I'll do anything you want me to

Money talks
(You know)
Money talks
Dirty cash
I want you
Dirty cash
I need you, oh
Money talks
(You know)
Money talks
Dirty cash
I want you
(Dirty cash)
Dirty cash
I need you, oh

I wasn't right
And now I'm so behind
I want to get rich quick
I want success
And all that goes with it
And I'm gonna use myself

removed

I want your money
I need you money
Dirty cash I want you
I want your money
I need you money

I've no excuse
I just want you to use me
Take me and abuse me
I got no taboos
I'll make a trade with you
Do anything you want me to

removed

Anyone who forces themselves upon another person sexually is a rapist, especially if the person being abused lacks the capacity to consent. I don't see why anyone's profession is relevant. Screw his future! Poor woman! If he was in contention for the Olympics or whatever, I'd tell him that prospect has gone. Why would you want to boast that one of your team mates is a convicted rapist? And in such a cruel and crass way!
At least we will know that he will get the treatment he deserves in jail prisoners generally HATE rapists with a different passion

Regardless of the case, I just don't get why anyone would want to be drunk to the point of being unconscious or where they lack the capacity. I just don't understand why that is a good feeling for anyone. I'd be scared of my personal safety whether that be rape, being attacked, being in a RTA or not finding myself in a safe environment (such as home) tbh......

[CatchIt]

I've just tweeted this image just in case there's any confusion as to what causes rape.

[diddl]

"Despite this, he was sentenced to just six months by judge Aaron Perksy, who said due to his age and lack of criminal history, ‘a prison sentence would have a severe impact on him’."

OMFG!!

Wouldn't that have been the fucking point?

[WellErrr]

What a disgusting creature.

I wonder what his father would say if his son gets raped in prison? Boys will be boys and all that.

[Querty12345]

Reading that has made my whole body feel like it's on fire. The women who stuck up for him need a smack in the vulva and the men who stood up for him should be castrated immediately. Imagine being the woman that was RAPED and listening to all that minimising bollocks? I would jump across the court and slit his fucking throat.

[TinklyLittleLaugh]

He won't get raped in prison though. He is going to a soft prison.

[MetalMidget]

I feel so sorry for the victim - first the assault, then being so aggressively questioned during the court case, then the lenient sentence, and now the rapist's friends and family defending him and continuing to blame her. His dad in particular - I'm getting the impression the apple didn't fall far from the tree. The stuff saying how his son could do more good going into schools to warn of the dangers of 'promiscuity' and 'drinking' - ugh.

You can be 'promiscuous' and not be a rapist. You can drink heavily, and not be a rapist. You can even do both, and not be a rapist. And either or both on the part of a woman isn't an excuse to rape her. Brock Turner doesn't seem to be remorseful at all, just sad that he got caught, and that attitude has been reflected by his friends and family. Awful.

[VestalVirgin]

Anything that pretends that men neatly and clearly divide into rapists and non-rapists is part of rape culture.

I don't think so. If we say that theft is caused by thieves, would people say that if someone who doesn't consider himself a thief steals someone elses property, that's somehow not theft?

Pretending that rape is something that could somehow "happen", is what is dangerous in my opinion. This "YOU could be accused of rape" just breeds sympathy with rapists.
Consent is not complicated and oh so difficult that a nice and decent guy could accidentally commit rape.

Rape is not caused by an evil coterie of men whose aim in life is to go around raping.

Perhaps not their only aim in life. But there's many, many repeat offenders, who obviously have this as one of their aims in life.
I'd bet that this guy is a repeat offender. Probably the only reason no other victims have come forward is because they never found out who raped them.

[CocktailQueen]

I read the Guardian article on this today. Absolutely horrific.

So if someone can swim quickly = they don't deserve prison and should get a lighter sentence?? Only in America. If Brock was black, or Mexican, or poor, it wold have been a whole other story.

Brock doesn't seem to have realised what he did - he's offering to go round campuses warning against 'the dangers of intoxication and promiscuity' - when really he should be parading with a great sign hung round his neck saying: 'Beware of me. I am a rapist and I am happy to rape an unconscious woman.'

This case has made me so so angry.

Brock's dad? Should be strung up. No prison for his son 'for 20 mins of action'!! Beggars belief. So if the rape had lasted longer, he'd deserve more prison time? FFS.
Unfair on so many levels -white privelige at its best. Judge should be struck off too.

[squoosh]

The stuff saying how his son could do more good going into schools to warn of the dangers of 'promiscuity' and 'drinking' - ugh.

You can be 'promiscuous' and not be a rapist. You can drink heavily, and not be a rapist. You can even do both, and not be a rapist.

So true.

Can you imagine a school inviting a convicted rapist to come lecture your children on the evils of drinking and promiscuity?!

[clarrrp]

This whole case has really infuriated me. This kid isn't being punished for what he did. He's basically getting off with a slap on the hand. Fuck he'd have gotten longer for not paying his taxes than he has for destroying someone else's life.

It's fucking disgraceful.

But what really infuriated me was the completely fuckign delusional letter his own father wrote saying that his son basically shouldn't be punished for '20 minutes' of wrongdoing.

Fucking hell. If that were one of my brother then they would be praying for a life sentence because my parents would have murdered them.

Rapists rape.

It;'s not fucking complicated.